We got NOIR need help

[Lemonslice 4,841]

I'm sorry I did not make myself clear. No matter the cost of the form (and lawyer's fees), the money would be better spend on travelling to meet each other and spending time together, you know, like most married people? 

[SalishSea 17,829]

On 5/2/2019 at 8:34 PM, Sparrow said:

Can you tell me which evidence we have to show them that we have real marriage 

More time spent in person together.  Because right now it really just looks like you're all about getting to the US.

[Going through 5,671]

Hopefully you can actually meet up in June, and your wife doesn't back out of that visit as well.  Without more face-time you have no chance for a visa, really.

[Going through 5,671]

And she'll want to amend her US taxes, too, for those years she filed as "single".  

[Sparrow 23]

Hi guys how are you all? Today my wife believe that you guys were right she talk with attorney today and the attorney said it's not good idea to appeal the case and he said I have to get the letter from culture expert where he write that there is not issue to get marry more then 15 years old in pakistani culture and she is going to visit me in qatar and after she go back she is going to reapply again and she is going to come back when I have interview and she will go with me on interview.So basically I don't know any culture expert in pakistan anyone know where their office at? I don't know where I can find them your help will be highly appreciated thanks to All

[Going through 5,671]

22 minutes ago, Sparrow said:

Hi guys how are you all? Today my wife believe that you guys were right she talk with attorney today and the attorney said it's not good idea to appeal the case and he said I have to get the letter from culture expert where he write that there is not issue to get marry more then 15 years old in pakistani culture and she is going to visit me in qatar and after she go back she is going to reapply again and she is going to come back when I have interview and she will go with me on interview.So basically I don't know any culture expert in pakistan anyone know where their office at? I don't know where I can find them your help will be highly appreciated thanks to All

Honestly I don't know how far a letter like that will go to persuade much in your favour...and presumably the CO is aware of cultural norms already.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a 15 year age gap, however it is uncommon for the female to be 15 years older in Pakistani culture from an embassy standpoint.

 

Of course, there's no harm in exhausting all avenues at this point. 

 

The age gap was just one of the factors the CO used based on the totality of evidence presented in your case (which was very little, as you know)---it was not the sole reason for denial.  You need to stop focusing on the age gap alone.  You were denied based on the combination of all 8 points outlined in the NOIR---not just the age thing.  When you sent in the rebuttal, you didn't really address those 8 points with evidence, but using mostly/only 3rd party affidavits and your own statements...which was not enough at that point in the process to gain approval for the visa.

 

Much better to reapply at a later date when you have more face-time, more evidence of living in marital union, etc.  It's good that she is consulting a lawyer, now.

Edited May 21, 2019 by Going through

[Boiler 45,516]

I would imagine Pakistan has a Central Statistics Bureau, wonder  if they keep details of ages involved in those who marry.

[Lemonslice 4,841]

3 hours ago, Sparrow said:

Hi guys how are you all? Today my wife believe that you guys were right she talk with attorney today and the attorney said it's not good idea to appeal the case and he said I have to get the letter from culture expert where he write that there is not issue to get marry more then 15 years old in pakistani culture and she is going to visit me in qatar and after she go back she is going to reapply again and she is going to come back when I have interview and she will go with me on interview.So basically I don't know any culture expert in pakistan anyone know where their office at? I don't know where I can find them your help will be highly appreciated thanks to All

It might be easier to just live with your wife a few years and demonstrate how you guys are living your relationship. Nothing in the immigration process should require you do sociological or cultural research. Spending time together, travelling to visit each other, are how many long distance couples are able to show they are in legitimate relationships.

 

You would need to find experts to write letters that  getting married on the first meeting with no family present, and then never seeing each other again is "normal". Plus the age difference thing. 

 

In other words, what makes you married and not penpals?

Edited May 22, 2019 by Lemonslice

[Sparrow 23]

11 hours ago, Going through said:

Honestly I don't know how far a letter like that will go to persuade much in your favour...and presumably the CO is aware of cultural norms already.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a 15 year age gap, however it is uncommon for the female to be 15 years older in Pakistani culture from an embassy standpoint.

 

Of course, there's no harm in exhausting all avenues at this point. 

 

The age gap was just one of the factors the CO used based on the totality of evidence presented in your case (which was very little, as you know)---it was not the sole reason for denial.  You need to stop focusing on the age gap alone.  You were denied based on the combination of all 8 points outlined in the NOIR---not just the age thing.  When you sent in the rebuttal, you didn't really address those 8 points with evidence, but using mostly/only 3rd party affidavits and your own statements...which was not enough at that point in the process to gain approval for the visa.

 

Much better to reapply at a later date when you have more face-time, more evidence of living in marital union, etc.  It's good that she is consulting a lawyer, now.

I know that is not the only reason of revocation.Yesterday my wife talk with attorney and he told to her that I need to get the letter from culture expert where he write that there is no issue to get marry more then 15 years older female in pakistan and it's normal he just need that from me so I am wondering where I can find them in pakistan 

[Going through 5,671]

But if refiling at a later date after more evidence of marital union is gathered, and more face-time actually seeing each other physically since being wed...letter from a culture expert likely wouldn't be needed at the consulate stage? 

 

Universities in Pakistan may be a good place to inquire about getting in touch with someone whose expertise is in local cultural norms, I suppose.

 

Curious why the lawyer is requiring such a letter if you're planning on refiling with better/actual evidence this time, though?  The more all-around evidence you have of a bonafide marriage (ie. visits, and such) the less the age-gap will even stick out.

[Ahmed&Freda 628]

Assalamualaikum Brother,

 

Since it's not culturally normal I'm not sure how easy it would be to get such a document.   I only know of one instance in Pakistan where my husbands cousin from his fathers side asked for his aunt on his mothers side hand in marriage.  I think she was 20 years older.  So although the Pakistani boy chose someone in his own culture of that age difference his family did not allow because his father wanted grandsons.   So does it happen in Pakistan?  I'm sure it may but is it a cultural norm?  I think not.  You may have to contact a multitude of agents to gather enough data actual historical occurrences would be helpful. 

 

Another big issue you have to overcome is the fact the embassy thinks you are already married.   Have you provided your families FRC?  Can you get a document from NADRA listing your history? Statements from family stating you were not previously married will not be enough.

 

Lastly more FaceTime....  Before refiling make sure you two have spent more in person time together.   Not seeing each other in person for as long as you both have did not help your situation at all.

 

Please take the advice given if you file based on similar evidence you have given in the past you are setting yourself up for failure.

 

Good luck to you!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Crazy Cat 41,857]

13 hours ago, Sparrow said:

So basically I don't know any culture expert in pakistan anyone know where their office at? I don't know where I can find them your help will be highly appreciated thanks to All

University......

[Sparrow 23]

On 5/22/2019 at 4:03 PM, Ahmed&Freda said:

Assalamualaikum Brother,

 

Since it's not culturally normal I'm not sure how easy it would be to get such a document.   I only know of one instance in Pakistan where my husbands cousin from his fathers side asked for his aunt on his mothers side hand in marriage.  I think she was 20 years older.  So although the Pakistani boy chose someone in his own culture of that age difference his family did not allow because his father wanted grandsons.   So does it happen in Pakistan?  I'm sure it may but is it a cultural norm?  I think not.  You may have to contact a multitude of agents to gather enough data actual historical occurrences would be helpful. 

 

Another big issue you have to overcome is the fact the embassy thinks you are already married.   Have you provided your families FRC?  Can you get a document from NADRA listing your history? Statements from family stating you were not previously married will not be enough.

 

Lastly more FaceTime....  Before refiling make sure you two have spent more in person time together.   Not seeing each other in person for as long as you both have did not help your situation at all.

 

Please take the advice given if you file based on similar evidence you have given in the past you are setting yourself up for failure.

 

Good luck to you!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wasalam sister I register my marriage here in pakistan I bring my marriage certificate to nadra office and they put my wife name on my identity card and I remember I ask them to give me my status history but they told me there is no way to give the history I will go and try to get that history again thank you for giving me that idea and what's happen in your case sister 

[Sparrow 23]

On 5/22/2019 at 4:03 PM, Ahmed&Freda said:

Assalamualaikum Brother,

 

Since it's not culturally normal I'm not sure how easy it would be to get such a document.   I only know of one instance in Pakistan where my husbands cousin from his fathers side asked for his aunt on his mothers side hand in marriage.  I think she was 20 years older.  So although the Pakistani boy chose someone in his own culture of that age difference his family did not allow because his father wanted grandsons.   So does it happen in Pakistan?  I'm sure it may but is it a cultural norm?  I think not.  You may have to contact a multitude of agents to gather enough data actual historical occurrences would be helpful. 

 

Another big issue you have to overcome is the fact the embassy thinks you are already married.   Have you provided your families FRC?  Can you get a document from NADRA listing your history? Statements from family stating you were not previously married will not be enough.

 

Lastly more FaceTime....  Before refiling make sure you two have spent more in person time together.   Not seeing each other in person for as long as you both have did not help your situation at all.

 

Please take the advice given if you file based on similar evidence you have given in the past you are setting yourself up for failure.

 

Good luck to you!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi sister I got FRC today from nadra and it's doesn't state there that I was not married before FRC only show my relationship with my family like my family history that's all and there its doesn't state my status either that if i am single or married i don't know what FRC use for I hope its help in immigration process

Edited May 27, 2019 by Sparrow

[Ahmed&Freda 628]

43 minutes ago, Sparrow said:

Hi sister I got FRC today from nadra and it's doesn't state there that I was not married before FRC only show my relationship with my family like my family history that's all and there its doesn't state my status either that if i am single or married i don't know what FRC use for I hope its help in immigration process

FRC would show if you had a wife linked with your family.  In addition If your wife had a POC card you could add her to the FRC.   You can still add her now but it doesn't show up on the print out until she has a nationality card.   

 

Do you have your old CNIC?  The one before you changed it to married?  That would show history if it shows you were unmarried before if you are unable to get a print out from NADRA.

 

At your interview what did they specifically say, in regards to, them thinking you were married before?  This would help in determining what you would need in order to prove otherwise.