I-129f - Yet another arrest record question

[Robert & Diana 2]

I'm in the process of collecting paperwork for an i-129f. (I'm the petitioner)

 

I have 2 previous arrests in New York (15 years ago, and one from over 30 years ago - nothing major). I called the court - no problem in getting the certified dispositions, and I'm in the process of obtaining those now.

 

Now, I am trying to get my arrest records. I called the police station - they told me I need to file a FOIL request. Wrong. I already know that's wrong. So I called back again after a little more research... this time a little bit smarter, and got the records department. I'm a few states away, so I can't exactly walk in.

 

They told me that they DON'T supply certified copies. They can give me a 'letter of good conduct', listing my arrests, but not certified. I made it clear that this is for immigration, and they require a certified letter. I got the same reply back, and was told that immigration could 'give them a call if they had any issues'... (She's obviously never worked with immigration.) I then asked if she could write on the form that they don't give certified copies, and got a "no" for that also. 

Given we all know how long the filing process takes, I'm really not looking for an RFE. 

Is an attorney going to be able to do any better? Or do you think immigration will take this letter? Is it worth trying to call USCIS?

 

Thanks for any thoughts or advice on this.

 

 

[JayMar2019 2,741]

35 minutes ago, Robert & Diana said:

I'm in the process of collecting paperwork for an i-129f. (I'm the petitioner)

 

I have 2 previous arrests in New York (15 years ago, and one from over 30 years ago - nothing major). I called the court - no problem in getting the certified dispositions, and I'm in the process of obtaining those now.

 

Now, I am trying to get my arrest records. I called the police station - they told me I need to file a FOIL request. Wrong. I already know that's wrong. So I called back again after a little more research... this time a little bit smarter, and got the records department. I'm a few states away, so I can't exactly walk in.

 

They told me that they DON'T supply certified copies. They can give me a 'letter of good conduct', listing my arrests, but not certified. I made it clear that this is for immigration, and they require a certified letter. I got the same reply back, and was told that immigration could 'give them a call if they had any issues'... (She's obviously never worked with immigration.) I then asked if she could write on the form that they don't give certified copies, and got a "no" for that also. 

Given we all know how long the filing process takes, I'm really not looking for an RFE. 

Is an attorney going to be able to do any better? Or do you think immigration will take this letter? Is it worth trying to call USCIS?

 

Thanks for any thoughts or advice on this.

 

 

You don't need to supply a certified copies of your arrests. You have to supply a certified copy (I would get the seal on it as well), of the final disposition. The document should contain the date of the arrest(s), crime(s) charged and what the final outcome (disposition) was for each offense. But in regards to the step by step of what occurred in each case (like the arraignment, continuances, etc.), that is not necessary.

[Robert & Diana 2]

I went back and looked at the instructions again:

 

"Item Number 4.b.  Criminal History Documents.  If you indicated “Yes” in Item Number 4.a., provide information that explains the circumstances, places, dates, and outcomes for each incident of arrest, citation, charge, indictment, conviction, fine, or imprisonment.  You must submit court certified copies of the arrest record and/or disposition for each incident unless you submit a certified statement from the court indicating that no record exists of your arrest, citation, charge, indictment, conviction, fine, or imprisonment. "

 

It does say to get certified copies of the arrest record. The certified disposition - those I can get.

[MandW 310]

read it again, its says AND/OR meaning if you cant get a certified arrest record then you can choose the court deposition, and/or.....emphasis on the "or"

[JayMar2019 2,741]

1 minute ago, Robert & Diana said:

I went back and looked at the instructions again:

 

"Item Number 4.b.  Criminal History Documents.  If you indicated “Yes” in Item Number 4.a., provide information that explains the circumstances, places, dates, and outcomes for each incident of arrest, citation, charge, indictment, conviction, fine, or imprisonment.  You must submit court certified copies of the arrest record and/or disposition for each incident unless you submit a certified statement from the court indicating that no record exists of your arrest, citation, charge, indictment, conviction, fine, or imprisonment. "

 

It does say to get certified copies of the arrest record. The certified disposition - those I can get.

And the certified document your get from the clerk's office should list the date of the offense(s), and outcome(s) (disposition). The disposition will be whether the outcome of your arrest if you got a citation, conviction, fine and/or imprisonment.

 

The court should be providing you the arrest record that shows the disposition of that arrest, hence why it says "the arrest record and/or disposition for each incident".  So when you get your certified dispositions that you said you are waiting on, it should list the county/state courthouse which is the place/location, it will list the date(s), the charge/offense for the arrest, and the outcome (disposition) for the arrest.

 

If you were arrested but not convicted, then the disposition will show that. If you were arrested and were convicted, the disposition will also show that however, it will show whatever your sentence recommendation was (fine, imprisonment, NOLP - which is charges dropped, citations, etc.). The court document you are receiving should be a printout from the beginning of the arrest all the day to the very end which is the disposition.

[Robert & Diana 2]

Thank you for the replies. You guys are awesome. I'm going to give it a try! Hoping for no RFE!

[JayMar2019 2,741]

4 minutes ago, Robert & Diana said:

Thank you for the replies. You guys are awesome. I'm going to give it a try! Hoping for no RFE!

Just keep in mind that USCIS is gonna be aware of the offense(s) as they do a thorough background checks on both the USC and the beneficiary. You just have to be completely honest by providing an explanation and documentation showing the proof of the final disposition. What they are looking for is to see what the final outcome was for each offense, the severity of the offense, and to make sure the judgment has been satisfied.

[MandW 310]

I don't believe USCIS does background checks on the beneficiary, if that were true there would be no administrative processing before and/or after the interview.

[JayMar2019 2,741]

Just now, MandW said:

I don't believe USCIS does background checks on the beneficiary, if that were true there would be no administrative processing before and/or after the interview.

Yes, they do background checks on both the beneficiary and the petitioner. The administrative processing (AP) isn't specifically just for background checks at the embassy level. That is a standard step that happens after the beneficiary has been interviewed. Background checks are done on both the beneficiary and petitioner multiple times throughout this process (K1/CR1 with USCIS, NVC and at the embassy level).

[dandk 72]

OP,

 

Make sure your fiance is aware of these arrests, it will be asked during the embassy/consulate interview later.

[Robert & Diana 2]

I am the petitioner. My Fiance has no record - she is aware of mine.

 

Thanks again.

[GP1977 288]

10 hours ago, Robert & Diana said:

I'm in the process of collecting paperwork for an i-129f. (I'm the petitioner)

 

I have 2 previous arrests in New York (15 years ago, and one from over 30 years ago - nothing major). I called the court - no problem in getting the certified dispositions, and I'm in the process of obtaining those now.

 

Now, I am trying to get my arrest records. I called the police station - they told me I need to file a FOIL request. Wrong. I already know that's wrong. So I called back again after a little more research... this time a little bit smarter, and got the records department. I'm a few states away, so I can't exactly walk in.

 

They told me that they DON'T supply certified copies. They can give me a 'letter of good conduct', listing my arrests, but not certified. I made it clear that this is for immigration, and they require a certified letter. I got the same reply back, and was told that immigration could 'give them a call if they had any issues'... (She's obviously never worked with immigration.) I then asked if she could write on the form that they don't give certified copies, and got a "no" for that also. 

Given we all know how long the filing process takes, I'm really not looking for an RFE. 

Is an attorney going to be able to do any better? Or do you think immigration will take this letter? Is it worth trying to call USCIS?

 

Thanks for any thoughts or advice on this.

 

 

I don't think hiring an attorney will get you a better outcome.  They will do the same thing you will do, except you will care and be more persistent than an attorney.

 

  I would keep on calling the records department and asking for a supervisor.  If they tell you no, ask again.  Call back and get their supervisor.  Ask them.  Ask for their supervisor.  Keep going up the chain of command.  They are a public servant and work for the taxpayers. 

 

I had a DUI which I was found not guilty of and expunged 14 years ago and didn't appear on a fingerprint FBI and state background check.  I lost my expungement order.   No records existed at the courthouse and my attorney didn't have a copy either.   I had to keep calling the courthouse and the clerk there basically told me to stop calling and she can't help me and i am out of luck.   Well I took it up the chain of command until I got to the office of the chief judge for the highest court in the state.  Guess what, I got my letter.  It was a huge pain in the ### but if you are persistent you will get what you want but you have to keep asking and it will be a time drain.  Dont take no for an answer.  When there is a will, there is a way.

 

Finally, even if you can't get the documents keep records of all of your communication with the agency.    Read this part of the USCIS manual and it talks about if a document isn't available they want to see either a certified letter that it isn't or repeated efforts made to obtain that document.

 

USCIS Manual 

https://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/AFM/HTML/AFM/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-2061/0-0-0-2073.html#0-0-0-312

      (f)     Primary and Secondary Evidence     .            

 Closely related to the best evidence rule is the concept of primary and secondary evidence. Primary evidence is evidence which on its face proves a fact. For example, the divorce certificate is primary evidence of a divorce. Secondary evidence is evidence which makes it more likely that the fact sought to be proven by the primary evidence is true, but cannot do so on its own face, without any external reference. In the above example, church records showing that an individual was divorced at a certain time w ould be secondary evidence of the divorce. You will often encounter situations in which primary evidence is unavailable. This gives rise to a presumption of ineligibility                 , which is the applicant or petitioner’s burden to overcome.                     Title                     8 CFR 103.2(b)(2)                     sets out the procedures relating to unavailability of documents. A petitioner or applicant cannot simply assert that the primary evidence does not exist. The absence of a primary record, instead, must be proven either:                    

 

          ·                 By a written statement from the appropriate issuing authority attesting to the fact that no record exists or can be located, or that the record sought was part of some segment of records which were lost or destroyed; or                    

          ·                 By evidence (such as an affidavit) "that repeated good faith attempts were made to obtain the required document or record."                    

[OlayemiLoray 172]

10 hours ago, Trinab80 said:

Yes, they do background checks on both the beneficiary and the petitioner. The administrative processing (AP) isn't specifically just for background checks at the embassy level. That is a standard step that happens after the beneficiary has been interviewed. Background checks are done on both the beneficiary and petitioner multiple times throughout this process (K1/CR1 with USCIS, NVC and at the embassy level).

This is very much correct^^^^^

[Yan_Inna 32]

12 hours ago, Robert & Diana said:

I'm in the process of collecting paperwork for an i-129f. (I'm the petitioner)

 

I have 2 previous arrests in New York (15 years ago, and one from over 30 years ago - nothing major). I called the court - no problem in getting the certified dispositions, and I'm in the process of obtaining those now.

 

Now, I am trying to get my arrest records. I called the police station - they told me I need to file a FOIL request. Wrong. I already know that's wrong. So I called back again after a little more research... this time a little bit smarter, and got the records department. I'm a few states away, so I can't exactly walk in.

 

They told me that they DON'T supply certified copies. They can give me a 'letter of good conduct', listing my arrests, but not certified. I made it clear that this is for immigration, and they require a certified letter. I got the same reply back, and was told that immigration could 'give them a call if they had any issues'... (She's obviously never worked with immigration.) I then asked if she could write on the form that they don't give certified copies, and got a "no" for that also. 

Given we all know how long the filing process takes, I'm really not looking for an RFE. 

Is an attorney going to be able to do any better? Or do you think immigration will take this letter? Is it worth trying to call USCIS?

 

Thanks for any thoughts or advice on this.

 

 

Those records you receive from them are certified because they are issued by court. I had the same problem as you.  I sent in the copies of those records and everything was fine. No need to worry about that. As long as you’re being honest that’s all they care about.

[TNJ17 1,329]

11 hours ago, MandW said:

I don't believe USCIS does background checks on the beneficiary, if that were true there would be no administrative processing before and/or after the interview.

Yes they do. That’s why it takes so long. And that is why you have to get a police certificate from every country you’ve lived in except the US because USCIS runs their own background check. USCIS would never approve any petition without running a background check on someone.