Dem senator wants … court injunction to block Kavanaugh confirmation vote?

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

3 minutes ago, janet3 said:

I am not an idiot......

 I realize what I say here on this thread of this forum will not change anyone’s opinion or their mind.

 I actually stumbled upon this thread while searching vj for insight...

And I realize, obviously, my opinion was not necessarily welcomed here....

 

But....as you all know....I grew up in the 1980s....experienced what these women have gone through.......and it changed the course of my life....

 

But let me tell you what you don’t know.....

 

 I became an advocate for rape victims when I was a teenager (I accompanied them to the hospital and police station and spent 100s of hours on the phone and in person meeting these women....or girls) and then became a social worker( I worked for CPS for 11 years...foster care and then supervisor) .....and then adopted a 14 year old girl who was raped by her step father (she was 10 when that started).  

 

So...yes.... I know.....I’m off my rocker....and obviously have no insight as to how a young woman would feel....and that “boys are just boys”

 

OBVIOUSLY I have no place being here on this thread..............

 

I’m sorry. ☺️ Can someone show me where the snowflake thread is? I would much appreciate it.....

Don't let this subgroup fool you we always love differing opinions here and THANK YOU for telling us yours. 

 

I do believe that something happened to Dr. Ford but I do not believe that Kavanaugh did it. I think she is using it to ensure that he does not sit on SCOTUS. 

 

The Dems and various far Left wing groups are politicizing this to further their own agendas. 

[TBoneTX 44,671]

My lingering question -- and one that I haven't heard answered, if it's even been asked -- is this:  Are any of the chief subjects responsible now for what they did as minors?

[TBoneTX 44,671]

2 hours ago, Cyberfx1024 said:

Don't let this subgroup fool you we always love differing opinions here and THANK YOU for telling us yours. 

Agree 100% with this.

2 hours ago, Cyberfx1024 said:

I do believe that something happened to Dr. Ford but I do not believe that Kavanaugh did it. I think she is using it to ensure that he does not sit on SCOTUS. 

Agree with this, except would revise to "I think that she is being used to ensure..."

2 hours ago, Cyberfx1024 said:

The Dems and various far Left wing groups are politicizing this to further their own agendas.

Agree 100,000% with this.

The President held a rally in West Virginia today and pointed this out in very understandable terms.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

9 hours ago, janet3 said:

I am not an idiot......

 I realize what I say here on this thread of this forum will not change anyone’s opinion or their mind.

 I actually stumbled upon this thread while searching vj for insight...

And I realize, obviously, my opinion was not necessarily welcomed here....

 

But....as you all know....I grew up in the 1980s....experienced what these women have gone through.......and it changed the course of my life....

 

But let me tell you what you don’t know.....

 

 I became an advocate for rape victims when I was a teenager (I accompanied them to the hospital and police station and spent 100s of hours on the phone and in person meeting these women....or girls) and then became a social worker( I worked for CPS for 11 years...foster care and then supervisor) .....and then adopted a 14 year old girl who was raped by her step father (she was 10 when that started).  

 

So...yes.... I know.....I’m off my rocker....and obviously have no insight as to how a young woman would feel....and that “boys are just boys”

 

OBVIOUSLY I have no place being here on this thread..............

 

I’m sorry. ☺️ Can someone show me where the snowflake thread is? I would much appreciate it.....

I don’t think you’re an idiot, and will go out on a limb and say that I doubt anyone in CEHST does, either.  We may argue all day long about politics, only to fight about them when the sun goes down... but no one here supports rape. (Though some do support illegal immigration, which blows my mind, considering the forum’s purpose)

 

If you’re off your rocker, I cannot help you.  (Unless it happens to be one of the rockers on the front porch at the Cracker Barrel in Fayetteville). But your opinion(s) are welcome here.  Just don’t get upset when someone disagrees; the skin must have a modicum of thickness about it to play here.  I for one welcome your insight, and (see aforementioned limb) I’m sure others will as well.

Also, kudos to you, helping out rape victims.  That’s a most noble cause, and I am sure your efforts are much appreciated by those whom you have helped get thru a painful and totally unnecessary traumatic time in their lives.  While I have never done so at your level, I have always advocated for the death penalty for proven rapists.  IMO, it’s the only way to start eradicating the problem.  Many here don’t hold that view, but I stand by it.

 

You’re in the snowflake thread already.  Be warned though; some of the flakes that fly are made out of frozen water particulates, and some are made out of stainless steel...

Welcome to CEHST.

[OptimusSpice 164]

On 9/29/2018 at 8:31 PM, janet3 said:

I agree completely.....

 

Those boys should go to the police (especially if being attacked by someone in a locker room). But they won’t....oh yeah....”there’s nothing to report”

 

So....you are telling me that the recourse for all of this peer behavior is to just go ahead and “do it”? Pretty sure that’s how we got to point A to begin with.....

On the contrary, my point is that these things DO need to be reported right away, when it's actually able to be investigated. 

 

The issue I have with what you said is the implication that just because a girl is 12 and sexually active means that she is automatically a victim and anyone who thinks otherwise lives in a delusional world as opposed to the real one we are all living in. Age (if both parties involved are minors) and gender don't define if someone is a victim.

[Dashinka 24,109]

On ‎9‎/‎29‎/‎2018 at 11:47 PM, janet3 said:

I am not an idiot......

 I realize what I say here on this thread of this forum will not change anyone’s opinion or their mind.

 I actually stumbled upon this thread while searching vj for insight...

And I realize, obviously, my opinion was not necessarily welcomed here....

 

But....as you all know....I grew up in the 1980s....experienced what these women have gone through.......and it changed the course of my life....

 

But let me tell you what you don’t know.....

 

 I became an advocate for rape victims when I was a teenager (I accompanied them to the hospital and police station and spent 100s of hours on the phone and in person meeting these women....or girls) and then became a social worker( I worked for CPS for 11 years...foster care and then supervisor) .....and then adopted a 14 year old girl who was raped by her step father (she was 10 when that started).  

 

So...yes.... I know.....I’m off my rocker....and obviously have no insight as to how a young woman would feel....and that “boys are just boys”

 

OBVIOUSLY I have no place being here on this thread..............

 

I’m sorry. ☺️ Can someone show me where the snowflake thread is? I would much appreciate it.....

All opinions are welcomed here in CEHST.  This is actually a great place to debate political topics, and it is very well moderated to keep things from getting out of hand (have you ever been to the comments sections of the likes of HuffPo, Salon, etc.?  Will minds be changed?  I don't think that is the point, but it is always good to be able to air opinions in a relatively safe forum.

 

 

[Neonred 3,514]

Trump should nominate Hillary to the Supreme Court so an investigation of her can finally get started.

[Neonred 3,514]

[TBoneTX 44,671]

5 hours ago, Neonred said:

Trump should nominate Hillary to the Supreme Court so an investigation of her can finally get started.

She would be voted onto the Court in a perfunctory, bipartisan manner.  The evil Republicans must cooperate, after all.

 

If not the above, then it would be leaked in advance that those on the Judiciary Committee or in the Senate who voted "no" would be honored with an efficiently scheduled suicide date.

[Dashinka 24,109]

Thought this was interesting and certainly something I did not know as I have never had to go through an FBI background check.  Will the Dems now be asking for an FBI criminal investigation once SIGBIU (pronounced sig bee u) is completed with the expanded background check?

 

"FBI background investigations are carried out by a special team within the bureau called Special Inquiry and General Background Investigations Unit. SIGBIU functions as a gatherer of facts. It doesn’t cajole or challenge witnesses and routinely offers them anonymity. It never proffers any credibility assessments or speculates about the motives of witnesses.

SIGBIU operates on tight deadlines and usually moves faster with Supreme Court nominations. The process begins and is completed well before the nominee’s Senate Judiciary Committee hearing takes place. Occasionally, SIGBIU is directed to conduct further interviews. Throughout the whole process, it operates under instructions from both the Justice Department and the White House Counsel’s Office.

Significantly, there is a firewall between SIGBIU and FBI’s criminal-investigative divisions. SIGBIU’s goal is to have witnesses be open and forthcoming. Agents routinely assure witnesses that nothing that they say during the interview will be referred for criminal investigation. Even more fundamental, the FBI’s velvet-glove approach to background investigations reflects its recognition that people they interview are not suspected of any crimes and cannot be coerced into cooperating or threatened with a grand jury subpoena."

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/kavanaughs-foes-politicize-the-fbi-1538433332

[janet3 1,170]

On 10/1/2018 at 4:46 AM, OptimusSpice said:

 

The issue I have with what you said is the implication that just because a girl is 12 and sexually active means that she is automatically a victim and anyone who thinks otherwise lives in a delusional world as opposed to the real one we are all living in. Age (if both parties involved are minors) and gender don't define if someone is a victim.

Sorry y’all.....I just couldn’t stay away.....

 

In reference to the quote above.... I respectfully disagree. Because now, in this day and age, the average age of consent is 16. In fact, the lowest age of consent is 12 and that’s in the Philippines and Angola (there’s several countries that the age of consent is the time of marriage....Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc.....which basically means one could have sex after puberty....:10 to 12)

If two 12 year olds are playing “doctor” or “.....and tickle” then yes..... I absolutely agree with you......but if either boy or girl is years older than the 12 year old.....then no, I disagree completely. Because it is not sexual satisfaction that the 12 year old is looking for....it’s acceptance or coercion. 

 

 

 

 

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 hour ago, janet3 said:

Sorry y’all.....I just couldn’t stay away.....

 

In reference to the quote above.... I respectfully disagree. Because now, in this day and age, the average age of consent is 16. In fact, the lowest age of consent is 12 and that’s in the Philippines and Angola (there’s several countries that the age of consent is the time of marriage....Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc.....which basically means one could have sex after puberty....:10 to 12)

If two 12 year olds are playing “doctor” or “.....and tickle” then yes..... I absolutely agree with you......but if either boy or girl is years older than the 12 year old.....then no, I disagree completely. Because it is not sexual satisfaction that the 12 year old is looking for....it’s acceptance or coercion. 

 

 

 

 

“Years older” is pretty vague.  1, 2, 4?

As long as one is not an adult, two kids at 10/11/12 who have sex... no criminal prosecution can be had, if I know my law stuff correctly.

 

The girl I mentioned which (I think) sparked this part of the topic, had sex with several guys from age 12-14.  She sought it, it was nowhere near coercion.  Some girls just enjoy sex at a younger age.  Who are we to judge them, or paint them in a negative light?

[OptimusSpice 164]

 

Since we are further continuing our obvious difference of opinion here - I suppose I'll throw out there that I also disagree with your statement that victims don't heal.  Scars remain - true of any wound or trauma - but victims CAN and DO heal - when they are not perpetually identified as "a victim" and given the tools to heal.  It's disgusting to constantly live a "victimized" life - either by one's own choosing or by the treatment by others.  NOTHING good ever comes from wallowing in self pity and despair at events that cannot be changed.  The only thing a victim has is the present and the future.  That is where the retaking of control over one's life resides.  That is where healing comes from - that personal empowerment to get back up and walk tall. You can waste yours in an emotional cesspool of victimization but I refuse to waste mine!  You say you are a "victim's advocate"? I guess your own identity is defined by your victimization of both yourself and others.  Can't have victims healing, can't truly advocate for their long term well being now can we?  I guess you could call me "triggered" (to use the trendy word for getting highly emotionally charged in regards to a personal trauma).  You don't know my story.  You don't know the things that I've HEALED from and I'll be da*ned if YOU or ANYONE else is going to shove me BACK into the "victimized" experience!  A much more famous victim who has HEALED and now uses her influence to encourage others to heal - a TRUE victim's advocate - Elizabeth Smart.  That girl went through a special kind of hell and now she speaks publicly to ENCOURAGE TRUE HEALING! 

 

I'm not opposed to acknowledging and validating the horrific experiences and devastating pain that comes with experiencing traumatic events.  It MUST be acknowledged, validated and explored emotionally to even begin the healing, but it can't stop there.  It can't become the paradigm through which the victim views everyone and everything else or they will never heal and they will continually relive that experience anytime anything like the CBF story hits the news.  Part of the hate that is being thrown at Kavanaugh is exactly this misdirected anger at victim's own personal attackers.  It doesn't matter what the facts are - in their eyes, he wears the faces of their abusers.  The perpetual victimization has been "weaponized" for politics.  "Can't have victims heal - then we can't manipulate them and further victimize them, using them for our own personal motives!"  Not me!  I will NOT be used that way!  I will NOT be identified as "a victim" because I am not still a victim - I was - but now I'm an OVER COMER and a CONQUEROR.  I am a powerful, strong woman who owns her own life!  My life experiences will NOT be twisted into a political weapon!  You want to "advocate for victims" then by all that is Holy - DON'T refuse them the reality of healing!  Don't continue to perpetually victimize them!  Give them the tools an encouragement to redefine their lives and take back the power and identity that was stolen from them!

 

I fear the world my sons are growing up in, where victims are denied healing, used as weapons and facts don't matter.  If they were to be abused, I would want to see them healed and not further abused and used.  And if they are innocent of wrong doing, I don't want to see their life destroyed by someone who accuses them with NOTHING at all that substantiates their claims.  And god-forbid - if they DID do something that amounted to any kind of sexual harassment or assault - I would want them to have the full weight of any consequences - and so help me, if I ever find out that they have even so much as disrespected a woman, they WILL have consequences from their Mother that WILL set them well and truly straight!  I'm raising better men than that!  

 

I still maintain that a 12 year old sexually active girl or boy is not by definition a victim.  They are by definition "sexually active".  If you think that a 12 year old DOESN'T understand sex, then you are not any where near the world the rest of us are living in.  Have you seen what is on Youtube???  Do you even fathom the availability of explicit material available to ANYONE of ANY AGE regardless of the "rules" and "laws" in place?  It's out there, and 10, 11, 12, 13, and so on years old kids know exactly how to find it.  They may not fully understand the emotional impacts.  They may not even fully understand the possible permanent, life changing elements, but they understand when their body says "I want sexual pleasure" and "that feels good".  It's my job as a parent to navigate this road with my sons.  To teach them and discuss with them - no matter how uncomfortable it may be - the realities of sex.  I work in a medical environment.  Encountering a 13 year old with herpes hit way too close to home and you bet I had a real deep conversation with my oldest son (who is also 13) after I got home from work. 

 

You live in your world that seems defined by "victims, victims, everywhere!" and I live in my world where "humans have sex, age/gender don't define a victim, teenagers do stupid things, and victims can heal and be empowered to take back their lives and be defined by THEIR choices, not those of an abuser/attacker".  So you and I will likely never see eye to eye.  And the beauty of it, we don't have to.  You can live in your world, I can live in mine.  We can both think the other's world is insane.  

[OptimusSpice 164]

@janet3 - I was rereading the thread - I apologize - it wasn't you that said "the mind doesn't heal".  That was said by another poster (you did agree with the post though).  So perhaps you do believe that healing is possible.  I don't know.  I will hold fast to my words above in a generalized way as a response to a very commonly held and expressed viewpoint that once a person is victimized, they are always a victim, defined as a victim.   

 

We may disagree about what makes a person a victim.  I may not care for the absolutely arrogant "all knowing, speaking for all women" and "one and only resident expert on what it's like to be a woman, a teen 30 years ago, and a rape survivor (you say victim, I say survivor)" but you are allowed your voice.  I find it commonplace among more liberal minded thinkers to insist that they speak for everyone and are the singular expert on a topic, so it's not a surprise.  The inability to acknowledge facts is also a common problem.  But you are certainly welcome to your opinions.  (who knows, you might not even be a liberal, it just comes across that way in this thread).  I would respectfully request that you stop trying to speak for me.  You are not the only woman posting here.  You are not the only one who has knowledge of this topic personally.  As someone who is ALSO a woman, was ALSO a teen 30 years ago, and has ALSO experienced this personally -- I have a VERY different set of opinions and a strong enough voice to express them all on my own.

 

I am curious though - how exactly did you get the clairvoyant skill to determine the motives behind a 12 year old having sex?  What scientific evidence do you have that a 12 year old body can't feel sexually satisfied?  What psychology degree do you posses that can state with such assurance that the ONLY reason a 12 year old is having sex is acceptance or coercion?  

[NikLR 13,227]

Comment: the body heals the mind doesnt.

 

Correcrtion: the body heals, your mind can but you always remember.  

 

You can block a traumatic episode from your mind, sometimes it does it on its own too, but that is not healing. 

 

If you've never been raped or assaulted you maybe just dont understand.  Just like I don't understand the terrifying fear some people have of clowns but it doesnt mean that I dont understand that person has that fear and I can empathize with them.   

 

I know too many women who have lived with being abused and have moved on with their lives without anything happening to the ones who abused them.  And since I know that reporting often leads to nothing, you have no choice but to move on.  That doesn't mean you forgive or forget. You just live your life because what else can you do? I wont let past abuse make me weak because it wasn't my fault.  

 

That doesnt erase the fact that someone did something that they had no permission to do.  

 

If that someone wanted to reside on the supreme court to make final judgements for the people of the USA, then I would want to scream to the world that they were not worthy.  I would only hope that I would be strong enough for that voice to make public something I had kept private. 

Edited October 4, 2018 by NikLR