B2 visa denied - Can still use VWP to cross border?

[Boiler 45,928]

Some get it straight away some need to wait 

[SusieQQQ 11,587]

But now or later, the point is that without an approved ESTA the friend cannot use VWP.

[JFH 12,191]

5 hours ago, TNJ17 said:

No. You lose ESTA forever after a tourist denial. In the future if he ever tries to get a tourist visa again, he’ll have a hard time and if he does get approved he will still face denial at the border. A denial stays with you forever. 

ESTA is not required for land border crossings on the VWP. ESTA is only required for air and sea arrivals.

 

That said, after a B-2 denial I don't think he stands much chance of getting into the USA by any non-immigrant means in the immediate future. 

[JFH 12,191]

59 minutes ago, SusieQQQ said:

But now or later, the point is that without an approved ESTA the friend cannot use VWP.

By land, he can try. ESTA is not required for land crossings. 

[Villanelle 4,122]

6 hours ago, NinjaMax said:

Im asking for a friend.

He is a UK citizen that was previously denied a B2 visa at the US consulate in london. He has never traveled to the US.

He is in Canada now, can he still use the VWP to visit the US through a land crossing? Does that previous denial show up at the border, does it affect anything?

Thank you.

There is a lot of conflicting things posted on this thread. 

 

Do you know what he answered on the ESTA application for the question have you ever been denied a visa?

Basically he is coming by land (https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/1132/~/citizen-of-visa-waiver-country%2C-wants-to-drive-into-u.s.-from-canada-or-mexico%2C) and will fill out the 1-94W. It has the same question on it. 

Answering yes to this question does not automatically mean you will be denied. Some denials like 212(a) criminal stuff pretty much mean no way. 221g denials are never logged in as actual denials- they are pending further info with 1yr to respond. When you dont its considered out of time frame and not accessible. It never logs as a denial but you still have to say yes you were denied, explain it and they will determine its not a denial. 214(b) denials are specific to the application. They do not impact any other application. 

So if he said yes on ESTA and explained what it was and was denied then its probably never going to be approved. If he said no and they found his denial then that was why he was denied and should say yes this time on the 1-94W and depending on the denial specifics he may or may not be approved entry.

 

 

[SusieQQQ 11,587]

19 minutes ago, JFH said:

By land, he can try. ESTA is not required for land crossings. 

Ah ok but he has to fill in i94 questions for entry? And CBP  will have his denied visa linked to his passport number on their screens. I guess worse case he wastes a tank of gas, or something. 

[SusieQQQ 11,587]

5 minutes ago, Damara said:

There is a lot of conflicting things posted on this thread. 

 

Do you know what he answered on the ESTA application for the question have you ever been denied a visa?

Basically he is coming by land (https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/1132/~/citizen-of-visa-waiver-country%2C-wants-to-drive-into-u.s.-from-canada-or-mexico%2C) and will fill out the 1-94W. It has the same question on it. 

Answering yes to this question does not automatically mean you will be denied. Some denials like 212(a) criminal stuff pretty much mean no way. 221g denials are never logged in as actual denials- they are pending further info with 1yr to respond. When you dont its considered out of time frame and not accessible. It never logs as a denial but you still have to say yes you were denied, explain it and they will determine its not a denial. 214(b) denials are specific to the application. They do not impact any other application. 

So if he said yes on ESTA and explained what it was and was denied then its probably never going to be approved. If he said no and they found his denial then that was why he was denied and should say yes this time on the 1-94W and depending on the denial specifics he may or may not be approved entry.

 

 

I would disagree strongly that a 214b denial has no impact on any other application. That’s only true for future immigrant applications. It will cast a shadow over any future attempt at a non-immigrant entry. If that indeed was the reason for denial then he needs to take sufficient proof of ties to return home.. which arguably could be even harder to do as a Brit driving in from Canada?

 

also can someone answer this: if you fly in on VWP you need to have a return ticket to leave within 90 days.  Obviously you can’t prove when you’ll drive back if coming by car, is there any land equivalent to this notion?

[JFH 12,191]

10 minutes ago, SusieQQQ said:

Ah ok but he has to fill in i94 questions for entry? And CBP  will have his denied visa linked to his passport number on their screens. I guess worse case he wastes a tank of gas, or something. 

Correct. The denial can't be "hidden" by coming by land. He still has to complete the questionnaire on the I-94. The form asks if you have ever been denied a visa for the USA. 

[JFH 12,191]

11 minutes ago, SusieQQQ said:

 

 

also can someone answer this: if you fly in on VWP you need to have a return ticket to leave within 90 days.  Obviously you can’t prove when you’ll drive back if coming by car, is there any land equivalent to this notion?

No proof of onward travel is required for land crossings but the passport will be stamped for 90 days only. The onus is in the individual to be honest and leave on time. Hence the VWP is only available to citizens of countries that have a good track-record of leaving on time. 

[Ontarkie 14,383]

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[Villanelle 4,122]

On 9/5/2018 at 9:02 PM, SusieQQQ said:

I would disagree strongly that a 214b denial has no impact on any other application. That’s only true for future immigrant applications. It will cast a shadow over any future attempt at a non-immigrant entry. If that indeed was the reason for denial then he needs to take sufficient proof of ties to return home.. which arguably could be even harder to do as a Brit driving in from Canada?

perhaps it was a bad choice of words I used. (no impact on any other petition). I should have been more specific (I was just trying not to be so wordy) anyway- a 214b denial is specific to the application- meaning it is a denial but when you have a new application and they look to see if you have any denials that would impact your eligibility that 214b denial can not be used.

Keep in mind to reapply after a 214b denial if nothing has changed you will not get the visa. 

So if the OP has a 214b denial on the B2 he can apply to travel on VWP with ESTA. He has to check yes he has been denied and explain. They will check his denial and see they cant consider it a denial. He will have to prove non immigrant intent just like everyone else. They can give him a hard time or let him breeze through.  

 

On 9/5/2018 at 9:02 PM, SusieQQQ said:

 

also can someone answer this: if you fly in on VWP you need to have a return ticket to leave within 90 days.  Obviously you can’t prove when you’ll drive back if coming by car, is there any land equivalent to this notion?

I dont know if being a Brit crossing from Canada has anything to do with needing to prove more ties.. I think its more about the specifics. If you have a loaded car full of stuff vs being in a group of hikers. Why is this friend in Canada? Why were they denied the B2? What is he coming to the US for? for how long?.... we may never know.