Evidence of Marriage question

[RRDirks 0]

Hi everyone, I recently married my gf of 5 years in Shanghai, China. Now I'm back in the US getting the visa application ready.

I'm just wondering about the evidence because we have no real documentation or our marriage other than the certificate. No joint accounts, joint ownership or anything.

For those of you who have done this, is getting some sworn affadavits the way to go? If so would I have to see a lawyer to get the correct documents? Would showing a bunch of pictures, plane tickets, and letters be enough?

Thanks a ton for any help!

[MaydayDas 1]

you can add a few statements from people that now you two and can certify your marriage is bona fide.

[RRDirks 0]

you can add a few statements from people that now you two and can certify your marriage is bona fide.

Can they just be written statements or do they have to be legal forms with notary and all that? Thx

[YuAndDan 153]

Two things.

First: Per the guides here you only need to provide the marriage cert for the petition, later you will need to provide more at the visa interview.

Second: I highly recommend that you check out A Candle for Love. That site specializes in China marriage and immigration issues, you are just starting on this path so the more that you read and post on that site the better. The consulate in Guangzhou can be tricky, and the members on that site know the ins and outs. http://www.candleforlove.com

When you got the marriage cert, did you have them make an English translation at the Notary office?

Edited May 11, 2007 by YuAndDan

[pushbrk 13,044]

Hi everyone, I recently married my gf of 5 years in Shanghai, China. Now I'm back in the US getting the visa application ready.

I'm just wondering about the evidence because we have no real documentation or our marriage other than the certificate. No joint accounts, joint ownership or anything.

For those of you who have done this, is getting some sworn affadavits the way to go? If so would I have to see a lawyer to get the correct documents? Would showing a bunch of pictures, plane tickets, and letters be enough?

Thanks a ton for any help!

USCIS is accustomed to dealing with newlyweds who live in different countries. Don't sweat any affidavits from people who can't confirm anything more than they attended some party after you registered your marriage in a government office. Your Notarial translation of your marriage certificate is sufficient.

Remember, the I-130 is a multi-purpose form. The affidavits are a viable and meaningful option for those who are in the US living together and adjusting status.

There's no time like the present to start learning the correct terminology. Right now you are getting a petition package ready. A few months after your petition is approved, your wife will be given an opportunity to apply for a visa.

For more China specific support, try www.candleforlove.com

Edited May 11, 2007 by pushbrk

[Yodrak 7]

YuAndDan,

The VJ Guides have been updated to reflect the most recent version of the I-130 petition, which asks for evidence of a bona fide marriage in addition to the marriage certificate evidence of a 'legal' marriage.

Yodrak

Two things.

First: Per the guides here you only need to provide the marriage cert for the petition, later you will need to provide more at the visa interview.

....

[RRDirks 0]

Second: I highly recommend that you check out A Candle for Love. That site specializes in China marriage and immigration issues, you are just starting on this path so the more that you read and post on that site the better. The consulate in Guangzhou can be tricky, and the members on that site know the ins and outs. http://www.candleforlove.com

When you got the marriage cert, did you have them make an English translation at the Notary office?

Thanks for the link, yes we have the certificate and English translation.

[RRDirks 0]

Thank you pushbrk.

The VJ Guides have been updated to reflect the most recent version of the I-130 petition, which asks for evidence of a bona fide marriage in addition to the marriage certificate evidence of a 'legal' marriage.

Yodrak

So has anyone had their I-130 approved without any supporting evidence? I have everything else ready, I've just been waiting to send it all because of my lack of written evidence.

BTW this is our second time as we did the K-1 visa a few years ago. The reason we didn't get married at that time was because our business is in China and we couldn't spend the months in the US to get the status changed and all that.

Thanks again everyone this is really a big help.

[pushbrk 13,044]

Thank you pushbrk.

The VJ Guides have been updated to reflect the most recent version of the I-130 petition, which asks for evidence of a bona fide marriage in addition to the marriage certificate evidence of a 'legal' marriage.

Yodrak

So has anyone had their I-130 approved without any supporting evidence? I have everything else ready, I've just been waiting to send it all because of my lack of written evidence.

BTW this is our second time as we did the K-1 visa a few years ago. The reason we didn't get married at that time was because our business is in China and we couldn't spend the months in the US to get the status changed and all that.

Thanks again everyone this is really a big help.

You do have supporting evidence. You have a Notarial Marriage Certificate and a little red book with your pictures in it. Your marriage took place in a government office. You don't live together, and (if not you, others) have never lived together or even in the same country. What in the world is somebody going to swear to in an affidavit? That they saw you at a party and you looked like you were ready for a honeymoon?

Neither affidavits or any other items listed under the following words....

NOTE: In addition to the required documentation listed in1) through 4) above, you should submit one or more of thefollowing types of documentation that may evidence thatbona fides of your marriage:

...are required. As for the affidavits...

Affidavits sworn to or affirmed by third parties having personal knowledge of the bona fides of the marital relationship

...please note the words "personal knowledge of the bona fides of the marital relationship". It does not say personal knowledge a wedding took place. Just what bona fides does one observe between two newlyweds that they might want to swear to in an affidavit? Maybe somebody trying to sleep in the adjoining room could swear they heard the headboard banging.

Where such affidavits are applicable IMO, is for adjustment of status. For never lived together foreign marriages, they are meaningless. Don't sweat it.

[RRDirks 0]

Thank you pushbrk.

The VJ Guides have been updated to reflect the most recent version of the I-130 petition, which asks for evidence of a bona fide marriage in addition to the marriage certificate evidence of a 'legal' marriage.

Yodrak

So has anyone had their I-130 approved without any supporting evidence? I have everything else ready, I've just been waiting to send it all because of my lack of written evidence.

BTW this is our second time as we did the K-1 visa a few years ago. The reason we didn't get married at that time was because our business is in China and we couldn't spend the months in the US to get the status changed and all that.

Thanks again everyone this is really a big help.

You do have supporting evidence. You have a Notarial Marriage Certificate and a little red book with your pictures in it. Your marriage took place in a government office. You don't live together, and (if not you, others) have never lived together or even in the same country. What in the world is somebody going to swear to in an affidavit? That they saw you at a party and you looked like you were ready for a honeymoon?

Neither affidavits or any other items listed under the following words....

NOTE: In addition to the required documentation listed in1) through 4) above, you should submit one or more of thefollowing types of documentation that may evidence thatbona fides of your marriage:

...are required. As for the affidavits...

Affidavits sworn to or affirmed by third parties having personal knowledge of the bona fides of the marital relationship

...please note the words "personal knowledge of the bona fides of the marital relationship". It does not say personal knowledge a wedding took place. Just what bona fides does one observe between two newlyweds that they might want to swear to in an affidavit? Maybe somebody trying to sleep in the adjoining room could swear they heard the headboard banging.

Where such affidavits are applicable IMO, is for adjustment of status. For never lived together foreign marriages, they are meaningless. Don't sweat it.

Haha, thanks again. You guys are lifesavers.

[ktmracer 0]

Please read the instructions for the I-130 for yourself and then call USCIS, do not make your final decisions from opinions.

Your marriage certificate is a required item from the 1-4 listing in addition to the following:

NOTE: In addition to the required documentation listed in 1)through 4) above, you should submit one or more of the following types of documentation that may evidence that bonafides of your marriage:

1) Documentation showing joint ownership or property; or

2) A lease showing joint tenancy of a common residence; or

3) Documentation showing co-mingling of financialresources; or

4) Birth certificate(s) of child(ren) born to you, the petitioner, and your spouse together; or

5) Affidavits sworn to or affirmed by third parties havingpersonal knowledge of the bona fides of the maritalrelationship (Each affidavit must contain the full nameand address, date and place of birth of the person makingthe affidavit, his or her relationship to the petitioner ofbeneficiary, if any, and complete information and detailsexplaining how the person acquired his or herknowledge of your marriage); or

6) Any other relevant documentation to establish that thereis an ongoing marital union.

1-6 don't sweat it! yeah right! just sweat it when you get RFE. They only say "should" to use up page space.

[pushbrk 13,044]

Please read the instructions for the I-130 for yourself and then call USCIS, do not make your final decisions from opinions.

Your marriage certificate is a required item from the 1-4 listing in addition to the following:

NOTE: In addition to the required documentation listed in 1)through 4) above, you should submit one or more of the following types of documentation that may evidence that bonafides of your marriage:

1) Documentation showing joint ownership or property; or

2) A lease showing joint tenancy of a common residence; or

3) Documentation showing co-mingling of financialresources; or

4) Birth certificate(s) of child(ren) born to you, the petitioner, and your spouse together; or

5) Affidavits sworn to or affirmed by third parties havingpersonal knowledge of the bona fides of the maritalrelationship (Each affidavit must contain the full nameand address, date and place of birth of the person makingthe affidavit, his or her relationship to the petitioner ofbeneficiary, if any, and complete information and detailsexplaining how the person acquired his or herknowledge of your marriage); or

6) Any other relevant documentation to establish that thereis an ongoing marital union.

1-6 don't sweat it! yeah right! just sweat it when you get RFE. They only say "should" to use up page space.

I absolutely agree with your advice to read the instructions and do your own due diligence.

Note number 6 above is both wide open and telling. It refers to documenting an ongoing marital union. Pictures, communication proof, boarding passes for visits are all potential items with far more meaning than affidavits about parties and/or banging headboards. By all means, if you want to send affidavits, more power to you. I just don't think they'll have much meaning for most marriages to between people who have never resided in the same country together.

I wonder what the racer would suggest putting in the affidavits that would provide evidence of relationship bona fides over and above a marriage certificate. (within the context described above)

[Mary G. 0]

We submitted copies of emails between us over the last ten years, receipts from phone card purchases, copies of boarding passes, copies of cards from my family to him and his family to me, etc. These things seemed to work just fine. We also had printouts of several photos, a receipt from the purchase of our wedding rings, evidence of planning for a larger wedding reception.

Good luck!

Mary

Please read the instructions for the I-130 for yourself and then call USCIS, do not make your final decisions from opinions.

Your marriage certificate is a required item from the 1-4 listing in addition to the following:

NOTE: In addition to the required documentation listed in 1)through 4) above, you should submit one or more of the following types of documentation that may evidence that bonafides of your marriage:

1) Documentation showing joint ownership or property; or

2) A lease showing joint tenancy of a common residence; or

3) Documentation showing co-mingling of financialresources; or

4) Birth certificate(s) of child(ren) born to you, the petitioner, and your spouse together; or

5) Affidavits sworn to or affirmed by third parties havingpersonal knowledge of the bona fides of the maritalrelationship (Each affidavit must contain the full nameand address, date and place of birth of the person makingthe affidavit, his or her relationship to the petitioner ofbeneficiary, if any, and complete information and detailsexplaining how the person acquired his or herknowledge of your marriage); or

6) Any other relevant documentation to establish that thereis an ongoing marital union.

1-6 don't sweat it! yeah right! just sweat it when you get RFE. They only say "should" to use up page space.

I absolutely agree with your advice to read the instructions and do your own due diligence.

Note number 6 above is both wide open and telling. It refers to documenting an ongoing marital union. Pictures, communication proof, boarding passes for visits are all potential items with far more meaning than affidavits about parties and/or banging headboards. By all means, if you want to send affidavits, more power to you. I just don't think they'll have much meaning for most marriages to between people who have never resided in the same country together.

I wonder what the racer would suggest putting in the affidavits that would provide evidence of relationship bona fides over and above a marriage certificate. (within the context described above)

[Yodrak 7]

RRDirks,

It's a new addition to the instructions, added with the current printing of the I-130 form. Not much anecdotal experience yet.

As a practical matter many newlyweds submitting an I-130 are going to have very little in the way of the type of evidence suggested on the form, especially if they are still living apart in their respective countries. This will be understood. Perhaps think in terms of how a fiance-fiancee couple demonstrates a bona fide relationship.

Yodrak

Thank you pushbrk.

The VJ Guides have been updated to reflect the most recent version of the I-130 petition, which asks for evidence of a bona fide marriage in addition to the marriage certificate evidence of a 'legal' marriage.

Yodrak

So has anyone had their I-130 approved without any supporting evidence? I have everything else ready, I've just been waiting to send it all because of my lack of written evidence.

BTW this is our second time as we did the K-1 visa a few years ago. The reason we didn't get married at that time was because our business is in China and we couldn't spend the months in the US to get the status changed and all that.

Thanks again everyone this is really a big help.

[pushbrk 13,044]

Right! There is little anecdotal experience with newlywed I-130 approvals since the printing of the new form. However, we certainly have a lack of anecdotal evidence of RFE's from newlywed filers that I find telling.

RRDirks,

It's a new addition to the instructions, added with the current printing of the I-130 form. Not much anecdotal experience yet.

As a practical matter many newlyweds submitting an I-130 are going to have very little in the way of the type of evidence suggested on the form, especially if they are still living apart in their respective countries. This will be understood. Perhaps think in terms of how a fiance-fiancee couple demonstrates a bona fide relationship.

Yodrak

Thank you pushbrk.

The VJ Guides have been updated to reflect the most recent version of the I-130 petition, which asks for evidence of a bona fide marriage in addition to the marriage certificate evidence of a 'legal' marriage.

Yodrak

So has anyone had their I-130 approved without any supporting evidence? I have everything else ready, I've just been waiting to send it all because of my lack of written evidence.

BTW this is our second time as we did the K-1 visa a few years ago. The reason we didn't get married at that time was because our business is in China and we couldn't spend the months in the US to get the status changed and all that.

Thanks again everyone this is really a big help.