IS IT EVER HOPELESS????

[Marriednow 4]

Hi everybody--I have a few questions that I would like members to address if they would please.....

1. IS IT EVER TOTALLY HOPELESS TRYING TO GET A FIANCE OR SPOUSE OUT OF MOROCCO AND TO THE U.S.A.? If we keep trying long enough, can we eventually get Hamid here? And what is the longest it has taken to get a SO to the U.S.A. that you know of?

2. HOW MANY TIMES CAN A PERSON APPEAL A K-1 REJECTION? OR DOES A PERSON HAVE TO FILE A NEW K-1 PETITION TIME AFTER TIME?

3. WOULD IT BE BETTER AFTER A FEW APPEALS TO GO AHEAD AND GET MARRIED IN MOROCCO AND FILE FOR A SPOUSE VISA? I mean, geeze, if a person waits a few years for their SO, how in the hell can the people sitting in Casa say that this is a fraudulent case?

4. DO THEY GIVE A RAT'S BUTT IF A FIANCE OR SPOUSE GOES BANKRUPT DOING THIS ####### AND/OR VISITING THEIR SO IN ANOTHER COUNTRY? Never mind, I think I can answer that one with a resounding NO.

5. DOES IT DO ANY GOOD TO GET OUR SENATORS AND OTHER REPRESENTATIVES HELPING US? WHAT CAN THEY DO? CAN THEY INTERVENE BEFORE THOSE PEOPLE IN CASA REJECT OUR CASE?

6. WHO IS IN CHARGE OF THE PEOPLE IN CASA WHO ARE MAKING THESE SNAP JUDGMENTS THAT AFFECT THE REST OF OUR LIVES? DOESN'T ANYONE HAVE ANY SAY OVER THOSE FOLKS? I KNOW THERE ARE FRAUDULENT CASES, BUT 70% REJECTION RATE? COME ON, GET A GRIP, CASA.

7. I WILL KEEP VISITING HAMID EVERY SCHOOL BREAK UNTIL HE GETS HERE. ANYBODY KNOW HOW MANY A PERSON HAS TO MAKE BEFORE CASA CONSIDERS THIS A "VALID RELATIONSHIP"? WHAT WILL GIVE OUT FIRST, MY MONEY OR CASA? (LOL, SORRY, COULDN'T RESIST SAYING THAT!!!)

8. I READ THE LAWYER FELLA'S ARTICLE ON HERE RECENTLY. HOW WILL I KNOW WHERE THE PAPERS ARE SENT SO THAT I CAN CHASE THEM DOWN? HE SAID THAT IF WE DON'T RESPOND TO THE PAPERS BEING SENT BACK, WE ARE S.O.L. (AND IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS, IT IS "SH-- OUT OF LUCK." SOUTHERN SAYING)?

9. WHO IS IN CHARGE OF ALL THIS #######? WHO IS MAKING THESE INSANE RULES?

10. IS THERE ANY WAY TO SEND ADDITIONAL INFO SO THAT IT CAN "CATCH UP" TO THE VISA TO GIVE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ABOUT OUR RELATIONSHIP IN THE FORM OF A LETTER OR SUCH?

THANK YOU SOOOOO MUCH, VJ MEMBERS, YOU HAVE MADE ALL THIS BEARABLE. I appreciate each and every word of advice and support you can give. It seems bizarre that a person in Casa can sit and make a 15 minute judgment that ruins the rest of our lives. I'm betting most American (and other country) marriages couldn't hold up under this much scrutiny.

By the way, I was reading where they are going to raise all of the visa fees so "things can go faster" .DOES THIS MEAN THE INTERVIEW WILL TAKE 5 MINUTES RATHER THAN THE USUAL 15 TO DECIDE OUR FATES? Just kidding, sorta......

[Caladan 19]

70% rejection rate? I thought that it was closer to a 75% approval rate for marriage-based visas out of Casablanca.

1. IS IT EVER TOTALLY HOPELESS TRYING TO GET A FIANCE OR SPOUSE OUT OF MOROCCO AND TO THE U.S.A.? If we keep trying long enough, can we eventually get Hamid here? And what is the longest it has taken to get a SO to the U.S.A. that you know of?

It's hard to say. People who find out their situations are hopeless tend to disappear. But yes, some cases are hopeless.

2. HOW MANY TIMES CAN A PERSON APPEAL A K-1 REJECTION? OR DOES A PERSON HAVE TO FILE A NEW K-1 PETITION TIME AFTER TIME?

I think you get one appeal, but I'm not certain and would welcome correction. Most cases I imagine fall apart long before an appeal is completed; I don't think there's a whole lot of information about this.

3. WOULD IT BE BETTER AFTER A FEW APPEALS TO GO AHEAD AND GET MARRIED IN MOROCCO AND FILE FOR A SPOUSE VISA? I mean, geeze, if a person waits a few years for their SO, how in the hell can the people sitting in Casa say that this is a fraudulent case?

You still have to prove a legitimate relationship, no matter if you married him. Imagine the guy's a con man, no real prospects in Morocco, and his only shot, he thinks is getting to the U.S. by whatever means. How long do you think he'd string along an unsuspecting American woman?

4. DO THEY GIVE A RAT'S BUTT IF A FIANCE OR SPOUSE GOES BANKRUPT DOING THIS ####### AND/OR VISITING THEIR SO IN ANOTHER COUNTRY? Never mind, I think I can answer that one with a resounding NO.

Nope.

5. DOES IT DO ANY GOOD TO GET OUR SENATORS AND OTHER REPRESENTATIVES HELPING US? WHAT CAN THEY DO? CAN THEY INTERVENE BEFORE THOSE PEOPLE IN CASA REJECT OUR CASE?

Someone here has an experience of contacting a Senator or Congressman early, but they're not magic. They can inquire into a case, but they can't tell the Department of State to let this guy in.

6. WHO IS IN CHARGE OF THE PEOPLE IN CASA WHO ARE MAKING THESE SNAP JUDGMENTS THAT AFFECT THE REST OF OUR LIVES? DOESN'T ANYONE HAVE ANY SAY OVER THOSE FOLKS? I KNOW THERE ARE FRAUDULENT CASES, BUT 70% REJECTION RATE? COME ON, GET A GRIP, CASA.

I think it's a 1 in 4 rejection rate. And I suspect you're wrong that it's a snap judgment.

7. I WILL KEEP VISITING HAMID EVERY SCHOOL BREAK UNTIL HE GETS HERE. ANYBODY KNOW HOW MANY A PERSON HAS TO MAKE BEFORE CASA CONSIDERS THIS A "VALID RELATIONSHIP"? WHAT WILL GIVE OUT FIRST, MY MONEY OR CASA? (LOL, SORRY, COULDN'T RESIST SAYING THAT!!!)

The question isn't just how dedicated you are, though lots of visits certainly seems to help. The final question is whether he's looking for a dupe so he can get a green card. Lots of visits proves you two have gotten to know each other, but there's not a magic number.

8. I READ THE LAWYER FELLA'S ARTICLE ON HERE RECENTLY. HOW WILL I KNOW WHERE THE PAPERS ARE SENT SO THAT I CAN CHASE THEM DOWN? HE SAID THAT IF WE DON'T RESPOND TO THE PAPERS BEING SENT BACK, WE ARE S.O.L. (AND IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS, IT IS "SH-- OUT OF LUCK." SOUTHERN SAYING)?

Hello-whatnow-come again?

9. WHO IS IN CHARGE OF ALL THIS #######? WHO IS MAKING THESE INSANE RULES?

The guys charged with keeping fraud out of the country. It's not the consulate's fault that a significant minority of young Moroccans are desperate to leave.

10. IS THERE ANY WAY TO SEND ADDITIONAL INFO SO THAT IT CAN "CATCH UP" TO THE VISA TO GIVE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ABOUT OUR RELATIONSHIP IN THE FORM OF A LETTER OR SUCH?

Anyone have experience with this?

THANK YOU SOOOOO MUCH, VJ MEMBERS, YOU HAVE MADE ALL THIS BEARABLE. I appreciate each and every word of advice and support you can give. It seems bizarre that a person in Casa can sit and make a 15 minute judgment that ruins the rest of our lives. I'm betting most American (and other country) marriages couldn't hold up under this much scrutiny.

Eh, most of them could. It's really not all that high a bar, to expect people to follow minimal cultural norms and speak the same language.

--

Look, betting is, you'll be fine. Lots of people have been just fine. Be honest with yourself. Do you have any red flags? If so, what are they? How would you explain them to a consular officer? Put on your consulate hat. Do you two look like a legit couple? You do? Then relax. Your biggest worry now is making sure the consulate is open.

Do you look like maybe you're a bit questionable? Read Kiya's Awesome Thread of Awesomeness and prepare yourself.

[tnh9479 1]

If you want an idea on statistics, you should check here.

[tnh9479 1]

I want to also add that I would also question a more than 20 year age difference between a USC and a beneficiary (no matter the country or the gender). This regularly does not happen in most cultures.

Casa can be intimidating. However, they are trying to do their job with little staff and even less funding. If they truly question the validity of the relationship, they don't have the time or resources to investigate or even schedule another interview. It is much easier if the case is not laid out in front of them in the petition to send it back and let USCIS deal with it.

[Marriednow 4]

I want to also add that I would also question a more than 20 year age difference between a USC and a beneficiary (no matter the country or the gender). This regularly does not happen in most cultures.

Casa can be intimidating. However, they are trying to do their job with little staff and even less funding. If they truly question the validity of the relationship, they don't have the time or resources to investigate or even schedule another interview. It is much easier if the case is not laid out in front of them in the petition to send it back and let USCIS deal with it.

SO, one more question. If the case gets sent back to the USCIS, does somebody here in the USA decide the case? Does that mean we get to add more evidence before they decide it? And is the decision final or can we keep appealing it? Thanks for the info!! Debbie

[Marriednow 4]

I want to also add that I would also question a more than 20 year age difference between a USC and a beneficiary (no matter the country or the gender). This regularly does not happen in most cultures.

Casa can be intimidating. However, they are trying to do their job with little staff and even less funding. If they truly question the validity of the relationship, they don't have the time or resources to investigate or even schedule another interview. It is much easier if the case is not laid out in front of them in the petition to send it back and let USCIS deal with it.

SO, one more question. If the case gets sent back to the USCIS, does somebody here in the USA decide the case? Does that mean we get to add more evidence before they decide it? And is the decision final or can we keep appealing it? Thanks for the info!! Debbie

ONE MORE THING TO ALL READING THIS POST: Hamid was invited by a friend who owns a business to move to England and this guy would sponsor him. But he didn't do it. His brother lives in Spain and wanted him to come there to be with him, but Hamid didn't want to leave Morocco. He also has a friend in Italy who wanted him to come there, but he didn't want to. Also, he would just as soon stay there and have me move there, but I can't do that due to health insurance and such. So, my point is, he has had more than once chance to leave Morocco if that was his reason for wanting a visa. Believe it or not... that is your choice. I am trying my best not to judge people on this site, and I would respectfully ask you to do the same. Yes, we have an age difference, but he looks older and I look younger. Go figure....People don't always fall in love with folks that other people deem appropriate, but only God can figure that one out. Thanks for listening! Debbie

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

SO, one more question. If the case gets sent back to the USCIS, does somebody here in the USA decide the case? Does that mean we get to add more evidence before they decide it? And is the decision final or can we keep appealing it? Thanks for the info!! Debbie

Kiyah has done heavy research into this subject, and covered it in detail here:

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3896

Read it carefully. (It may take several sittings, as there is a lot of info there.) It will answer just about all your questions, and even questions you haven't thought of yet.

I see from your timeline that your case is still at USCIS, and you are still waiting for the NOA #2. Are you concerned over red-flag issues that might result in your case possibly being sent back at the consulate level ? Kiya's thread has a lot of info about preparing for that, too.

Please read her thread -- she, along with Chiquita and several others, have been through a sent-back case. Some have already come out on the other side of the nightmare, and with an approval on the second try. Send them a PM and get in touch with them -- they are excellent resources, and can probably answer your specific questions about denials and intention to deny better than most of the rank-and-file here.

Good luck !

-MK

[mybackpages 0]

5. DOES IT DO ANY GOOD TO GET OUR SENATORS AND OTHER REPRESENTATIVES HELPING US? WHAT CAN THEY DO? CAN THEY INTERVENE BEFORE THOSE PEOPLE IN CASA REJECT OUR CASE?

I would only add this to Caladan's reply. Your elected Reps can intervene if there is a true case of injustice being committed. BUT the burden of proof is on you to prove that you have been treated in a discriminatory way. You can believe all you want that the relationship is real, that the evidence you presented (either in the thefirst petition or in the interview) proves your case and that Casa is just a difficult and unfair consulate to get through. NONE of that matters. You have to prove with evidence that some wrong doing has been done.

A member of the Congress can not interview just because one of their constsituents feels wronged. You need cold hard fact presented in a logical and reasoned manner. Even with this their hands are tied to how much they can do.

[mybackpages 0]

70% rejection rate? I thought that it was closer to a 75% approval rate for marriage-based visas out of Casablanca.

The rejection rate does increase when you add tourists, student and the like to the mix. BUT for family/marriage based, its pretty high.

[tnh9479 1]

I want to also add that I would also question a more than 20 year age difference between a USC and a beneficiary (no matter the country or the gender). This regularly does not happen in most cultures.

Casa can be intimidating. However, they are trying to do their job with little staff and even less funding. If they truly question the validity of the relationship, they don't have the time or resources to investigate or even schedule another interview. It is much easier if the case is not laid out in front of them in the petition to send it back and let USCIS deal with it.

SO, one more question. If the case gets sent back to the USCIS, does somebody here in the USA decide the case? Does that mean we get to add more evidence before they decide it? And is the decision final or can we keep appealing it? Thanks for the info!! Debbie

ONE MORE THING TO ALL READING THIS POST: Hamid was invited by a friend who owns a business to move to England and this guy would sponsor him. But he didn't do it. His brother lives in Spain and wanted him to come there to be with him, but Hamid didn't want to leave Morocco. He also has a friend in Italy who wanted him to come there, but he didn't want to. Also, he would just as soon stay there and have me move there, but I can't do that due to health insurance and such. So, my point is, he has had more than once chance to leave Morocco if that was his reason for wanting a visa. Believe it or not... that is your choice. I am trying my best not to judge people on this site, and I would respectfully ask you to do the same. Yes, we have an age difference, but he looks older and I look younger. Go figure....People don't always fall in love with folks that other people deem appropriate, but only God can figure that one out. Thanks for listening! Debbie

I think people need to be realistic. It is NORMAL to question any relationship where there is a big age gap. I am not judging you. I am trying to help you realize that this will be in the mind of the CO and probably will be something that will need to be overcome.

As for Senators, we had to get one involved in our case because Casa never sent out an interview date or the package to my then fiance. In an instance like this, where we were getting no response from the consulate in any way, shape, or form, the Senator's office was of great assistance.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Age gaps are relative, but an easy target. Choosing 20 years as an age gap red flag is, at best, choosing a totally arbitrary number. A red flag could be triggered at two years, five years, whatever. Afterall, the USCIS and DHS know about the ages of the parties when the petition is initially approved, and plenty of age gap couples have been approved, while others with no real age gap have languished. There is something that goes on at the consulate that determines why a petition is questioned, and that is a far more ambiguous set of elements that none of us knows enough about to surmise on. We can only guess, and those guesses are highly subjective.

[peezey 0]

70% rejection rate? I thought that it was closer to a 75% approval rate for marriage-based visas out of Casablanca.

The rejection rate does increase when you add tourists, student and the like to the mix. BUT for family/marriage based, its pretty high.

This is what I've read, too. Family based immigration approvals are very high out of Morocco.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Frankly, and I've said this before, in relation to age gaps, it is just as much of a red flag for a Muslim to marry a non-Muslim, an Arab to marry a non-Arab or a westerner, for there to be language barriers and for the woman to be more properous than the man. Culturally, this is waaaay out of wack to the norm. What do they really have in common when it is far more traditional to prefer to marry within one's own social class and social circle? To marry in this way is not NORMAL in Arab working class circles either, and it is most certainly counted among the considerations when discerning fraud in Muslim countries, and should not be overlooked when questions such as these are raised.

[deemabrouk 0]

If you want an idea on statistics, you should check here.

WOW.. I was actually kinda surprised at the statistics..

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I think people need to be realistic. It is NORMAL to question any relationship where there is a big age gap. I am not judging you. I am trying to help you realize that this will be in the mind of the CO and probably will be something that will need to be overcome.

Ding ding ding right on ! This is a crucial issue that people really need to consider long and hard.

Of course there is nothing *necessarily* wrong about an older woman with a younger man. Many of these unions are perfectly sincere, and the couples have long and very happy marriages.

But on the other side of the coin, there are all too many cases of fraud (and unfortunately, the American spouse is often the last to know.)

I think the older woman in such a situation really needs to ask herself frankly -- are any younger men in her own country showing any romantic interest in her ? Or is her stock inexplicably shooting wayyyy up when it comes to poorer, unemployed/under-employed younger men from "third world" countries who are quite desperate to leave their miserable economies ? Is one (or several) of these men trying to rush her into marriage soon after initial contact ? This should be a big big BIG warning sign.

Some people are very uncomfortable with the obvious questions and concerns. But they need to be addressed. The Casablanca consulate is well aware of the high incidence of fraud, and it's their job to prevent it. It's a sad fact that in Morocco (and other countries) fraudulent relationships often involve a younger man taking an older American woman for a green card ride. This is the unfortunate background against which you will be presenting your case.