Third judge rules against Trump move to end DACA

[Keith & Arileidi 437]

1 minute ago, Bill & Katya said:

Did Congress actually pass a bill?  If it was so bipartisan, why couldn’t they muster a veto proof bill.  Regardless, it is Congresses responsibility to craft immigration law, it should not be left to a president to simply create DACA by signing an EO.

And they did craft legislation , but trump threatened to veto it. 

This was also during a debt ceiling time crunch. 

 

[Dashinka 24,492]

4 minutes ago, bcking said:

Sure but still you have to admit it is unlikely Trump was thinking about "separate of powers" when he rescinded it. That would require that he has a basic knowledge of the Constitution. He likely pays people for that.

 

He rescinded it as a political tool. He knew certain groups of people would like that he did it, and he knew it could then be used as a negotiating/bargaining chip in Congress. He also calculated (somewhat correctly) that he could spin it to make it seem like it was the Democrats who "let the Dreamers down", ignoring his own role.

Didn’t Obama create it as a political tool?  Personally, I am fine with Trump attempting to use it as a political tool if he can get the funding to secure the border.  It did not work out though, so for now everything is in limbo until Congress acts.

 

Btw, I think Trump is a lot smarter than a lot of people give him credit for, but I suppose Trump being an idiot is another one of those political narratives circulating.

1 minute ago, Keith & Arileidi said:

And they did craft legislation , but trump threatened to veto it. 

This was also during a debt ceiling time crunch. 

 

Crafting is not passing.  Was there even a vote?  Btw, how do you feel about Obama usurping the power of Congress when he created it?

Edited April 26, 2018 by Bill & Katya

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

12 minutes ago, Keith & Arileidi said:

And they did craft legislation , but trump threatened to veto it. 

This was also during a debt ceiling time crunch. 

 

Yeah a bill was drafted by the Dems and the Republicans but it was not approved on either side. So good job there at only getting half of the story.

[smilesammich 10,727]

4 minutes ago, cyberfx1024 said:

Yeah a bill was drafted by the Dems and the Republicans but it was not approved on either side. So good job there at only getting half of the story.

and that wasn't about daca, that was about funding trump's border wall.

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

1 minute ago, smilesammich said:

and that wasn't about daca, that was about funding trump's border wall.

No, there have been at least 2 immigration bills crafted this year that failed in the Senate

[bcking 3,157]

31 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

Btw, I think Trump is a lot smarter than a lot of people give him credit for, but I suppose Trump being an idiot is another one of those political narratives circulating.

 

As much as I joke about I agree with you, with some caveats.

 

I think he lacks a lot of concrete knowledge, though I'm sure he is learning on the job (if he wants to learn). On the other hand I think he has at least some baseline intelligence. I think he mostly uses that to manipulate people and get ahead.

 

I don't disagree with the assessments that were made prior to the election calling him a Narcissist. He is also serial liar, mostly to appease his narcissistic personality.

[smilesammich 10,727]

2 minutes ago, cyberfx1024 said:

No, there have been at least 2 immigration bills crafted this year that failed in the Senate

i believe there were four, and daca was only on the table because trump put it there.

[Keith & Arileidi 437]

9 minutes ago, cyberfx1024 said:

Yeah a bill was drafted by the Dems and the Republicans but it was not approved on either side. So good job there at only getting half of the story.

You mean not approved enough to pass a presidential veto? 

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

Just now, Keith & Arileidi said:

You mean not approved enough to pass a presidential veto? 

No, not approved AT ALL they did not pass the Senate.

[Keith & Arileidi 437]

Just now, cyberfx1024 said:

No, not approved AT ALL they did not pass the Senate.

Because it would have been vetoed. 

This is not a hard concept. 

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

7 minutes ago, Keith & Arileidi said:

You mean not approved enough to pass a presidential veto? 

 

8 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

i believe there were four, and daca was only on the table because trump put it there.

As much as I hate to agree with @smilesammich she is correct.

 

The Senate voted on Thursday afternoon on four immigration bills, looking for any forward movement on protecting young people brought illegally to the United States as children and beefing up border security.

Every proposal failed.

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) has teed up votes on four amendments for Thursday to address the plight of those covered by the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, which includes about 700,000 people who were brought to the United States illegally as children. President Trump has said he would rescind those protections in early March, putting the onus on Congress to come up with a permanent solution.

The proposals needed 60 votes to advance. The first plan, which would have granted legal status to DACA recipients without any funding for Trump’s border wall, failed 52 to 47.

 

The second amendment, targeting sanctuary cities, has also failed.

 

A third bill, the product of the broadest bipartisan compromise, with a DACA fix and border funding but minimal legal immigration changes, couldn’t muster the necessary support either.

 

And lastly, the White House’s own immigration demands also failed on the Senate floor, garnering the least support of the four bills.

 

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/2/12/17003552/senate-immigration-bill-floor-debate

Edited April 26, 2018 by cyberfx1024

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

2 minutes ago, Keith & Arileidi said:

Because it would have been vetoed. 

This is not a hard concept. 

There were a couple that were submitted by the Republicans that did not pass either because the Dems didn't like it.

 

What your not grasping is that Presidential veto has no authority in wither a bill passes or not. If it passes then it passes and then he vetoes it, if it doesn't pass it won't even get to his desk. It's Civics 101 which in NC we called ELPSA, in which I got A in Honors ELPSA..

Edited April 26, 2018 by cyberfx1024

[smilesammich 10,727]

2 minutes ago, cyberfx1024 said:

There were a couple that were submitted by the Republicans that did not pass either because the Dems didn't like it.

 

What your not grasping is that Presidential veto has no authority in wither a bill passes or not. If it passes then it passes and then he vetoes it, if it doesn't pass it won't even get to his desk. It's Civics 101 which in NC we called ELPSA, in which I got A in Honors ELPSA..

but daca would have never been on the chopping block if it weren't for trump using it as a pawn in his own agenda. then he tries to blame democrats for failing daca recipients.

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

Just now, smilesammich said:

but daca would have never been on the chopping block if it weren't for trump using it as a pawn in his own agenda. then he tries to blame democrats for failing daca recipients.

DACA was expiring anyway which people aren't getting which is beyond me. Trump tried to actually fix it but the Dems said hell no.

[smilesammich 10,727]

1 minute ago, cyberfx1024 said:

DACA was expiring anyway which people aren't getting which is beyond me. Trump tried to actually fix it but the Dems said hell no.

how exactly did he try to fix it?

trump is trying to fix it and end it - without being able to effectively justify ending it? makes zero sense.