Cenomar

[Hank_ 9,174]

9 minutes ago, nelmagriffin said:

It is the same everywhere: Here is a link in Los Angeles Philippine Consulate, when a Filipino who wanted to marry Abroad. I guess some are not familiar because the majority had K1 visa.

Hank: http://www.philippineconsulatela.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/APPLICATION-FOR-MARRIAGE-LICENSE.pdf

Also, http://www.philippineconsulatela.org/consular-services-2/civil-registry-2/report-of-marriage-of-a-filipino-abroad

 

You are not grasping what I am saying .... the USA does care what is on the Philippine consulate website regarding marriage in the USA.  Each state has their rules for applying for a marriage license, the USA doesn't have rules.   And within each state there can be a few variance within the county, but over all it is the state that makes the laws for this.

 

A K-1 visa is not any kind of magic for getting a marriage license in the USA, in fact that  IS NOT ASKED FOR either when obtaining a marriage license.

 

 

 

Here is what is required (on average) to get a marriage license  (do read slowly the list is really long ... NOT  )

 

Marriage Licenses

Marriage licenses must be requested in person. 

• A marriage license must be purchased before getting married and must be used within six months or it will expire.
• A license purchased in Minnesota is valid only in Minnesota and cannot be used in any other state.

Requirements

• Applicants must be 18 years of age to obtain a license (without parental consent). Be prepared to present valid identification. 
• Both parties must be present to apply for a marriage license. If one party cannot be present, they must provide a notarized Supplemental Marriage License Application (PDF) and a completed, notarized Marriage License Application.
• Each applicant must provide: full legal name, address, date and place of birth, telephone numbers and social security numbers (if they have one). 
• Each applicant must provide after-marriage name(s) and address

 

Let this horse lay at the curb... it died a long time ago.    

Edited April 6, 2018 by Hank_

[nelmagriffin 145]

@Hank:

I know that you might think that I am a hard-headed and was not able to grab what you wanted me to understand. I only mentioned about K1 applicants from the Philippines it is because they are already way screened and sort of okayed to marry once in the USA compared to a married woman/man  that still needed to be asked for more documents in order to be able to marry, that is all and certainly not some sort of magic to obtained a license. I stand corrected.

@Krestelso:

I hope everything will be okay and as Hank implied there is nothing to worry.

Please accept my being hard-headed.

My sincere apology.

[Hank_ 9,174]

20 minutes ago, nelmagriffin said:

@Hank:

I know that you might think that I am a hard-headed and was not able to grab what you wanted me to understand. I only mentioned about K1 applicants from the Philippines it is because they are already way screened and sort of okayed to marry once in the USA compared to a married woman/man  that still needed to be asked for more documents in order to be able to marry, that is all and certainly not some sort of magic to obtained a license. I stand corrected.

@Krestelso:

I hope everything will be okay and as Hank implied there is nothing to worry.

Please accept my being hard-headed.

My sincere apology.

I must be wording thing's wrong   .....    What you are not grasping is what you call ".. screened so okayed to marry once in the USA" ... <<<<<  MEANS NOTHING.    

 

That list I gave you of the requirements to get a marriage license is ALL that is needed in most states.    You are trying to make it more difficult than the reality.  Or you can't seem to comprehend that other countries are not as complicated as the Philippines like to make things.

 

As for the OP ... one last time   SHE IS DIVORCED.        And one last time .. the embassy doesn't care that the Philippines doesn't recognize the divorce.   

Edited April 6, 2018 by Hank_

[geowrian 22,337]

3 hours ago, nelmagriffin said:

1. The OP posted two times more or less on the same topic.  If you have read at the very beginning of this post you will be able to catch up. The OP stated that she was married in the Philippines and have a daughter, got separated, used her multiple visa that is valid for 10 years and visited the USA, She then found a new love while in the US who is US Citizen (formerly a Filipino) who petitioned her and was able to adjust her status and currently holding a conditional green card. She mentioned that her new husband also petitioned her daughter and was interviewed, She accompanied her daughter during the interview and was asked to produce a CENOMAR for both her and her second husband.
2.  She was asking why they ask her CENOMAR for both of them? She was told because they are both born in the Philippines, referring to her and her second husband. As I mentioned before, a Divorce decree is only granted to a former Filipino now a US Citizen per Article 26. As stated " Article 26 is clear that only the former Filipino (or the foreigner spouse) may seek a divorce abroad. In other words, even if a spouse is no longer a Filipino, the other spouse who is still a Filipino can’t validly seek a divorce. So how did she manage to do this I do not know, If so would it still be valid considering that the applicant is not even a Us Citizen? Anyways, this is getting further and further, that is why I have asked as none of us are expert and the situation is unique. Back to the main topic, She is worried as she mentioned, that her green card might b revoked? why? Is it because she admitted that she was still married to the father of her daughter and that it triggers the Consul of why was able to even get married for the second time without filing an annulment in first? IS this why Consul ask for CENOMAR/ advisory on Marriage? 

Okay, then yes...I understood the situation correctly.

 

With regards to the question you asked of "how did you get married for the second time in the USA", I repeat: " why wouldn't she have shown the US divorce decree when she applied for the US marriage license to the second individual?". The US does not care about her ability to get or use the divorce in the Philippines. She has proof of being married and proof that the marriage was dissolved under US law. There's absolutely no issue here. The fact that she is a Filipino has no bearing here.

 

With regard to the CENOMAR, the CO will ask for the CENOMAR as a matter of procedure. The CO will accept a CEMAR + proof that the marriage was dissolved. The CO won't care if she got an annulment or not.

 

2 hours ago, nelmagriffin said:

It is the same everywhere: Here is a link in Los Angeles Philippine Consulate, when a Filipino who wanted to marry Abroad. I guess some are not familiar because the majority had K1 visa.

Hank: http://www.philippineconsulatela.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/APPLICATION-FOR-MARRIAGE-LICENSE.pdf

Also, http://www.philippineconsulatela.org/consular-services-2/civil-registry-2/report-of-marriage-of-a-filipino-abroad

The first form has no bearing on somebody that decides to marry outside the Philippines. The US requires no such form or certification requirement to marry, just to show that all past marriages were dissolved...which the divorce decree does perfectly fine. What the Philippines requires has no bearing on marrying outside the Philippines.

 

ROM is for having the foreign-obtained marriage recognized in the Philippines. She cannot do so without an annulment, but this is not necessary for US immigration purposes. The US, and USEM COs, do not care if the second marriage is legal within the Philippines.

[j&ana 363]

A CENOMAR is usually ask for a Filipino doing an immigration visa. no hidden reason, or surprise

If you are single you will get A cenomar if you are married or have been married  a cemar

As it has already been mention  divorce is different in  the U.S then the Philippines. while the Philippines might not recognize a divorce the U.S will

Yes I know about article 26 where only a foreign spouse can seek a divorce for the Philippines to recognize it. However  if a person already in the U.S and has no plan on moving back to the Philippines Then U.S laws apply which means the divorce is recognize in the US . If a person in this case decide to move back to the Philippines then that would be  a different story as Philippines law would apply

[j&ana 363]

8 hours ago, nelmagriffin said:

I only mentioned about K1 applicants from the Philippines it is because they are already way screened and sort of okayed to marry once in the USA compared to a married woman/man  that still needed to be asked for more documents in order to be able to marry

How would a married woman/man get marry in the U.S? Divorce is recognize in the U.S  but Bigamy is not

unless a person is part of the Mormon religion but not all Mormons participate in Bigamy

[Hank_ 9,174]

Ah .. a frontal attack and two flanking maneuvers .. hopefully she gets it now. 

[nelmagriffin 145]

Hello!

Sometimes when one is confused that is because we have read a lot from different sources. No mean words or insults is way appreciated.

( I guess I am just surprised that a non-US Citizen could apply and was granted a Divorce, this is new to me)

 

I came across this: Any comment from the expert will be appreciated.

reference: http://qa.answers.com/Q/Can_a_Filipino_citizen_file_a_divorce_in_US

 

1. Can a Filipino citizen file a divorce in US?

 

ANSWER:

 No. Civil status (i.e. being single or married) is governed by the law of your citizenship. In this case, a Filipino citizen is governed by Philippine law as regards his/her civil status. Therefore, if he/she wants to be free of those marriage ties, he/she must avail of annulment of marriage in the Philippines. Unless he/she becomes a US citizen later on, he/she may properly file for divorce in the US courts. a Filipino citizen file a divorce in US?

 

2. If you married someone who was already married in the Philippines is your marriage even legal and do you need to get a divorce?

ANSWER:

A is married to B. While marriage continues, A marries C.

 

Question: is the marriage of A to C "legal"?

 

The marriage of A to C, is bigamous and not a legal marriage. A may be charged with the crime of bigamy which carries with it a penal sanction.

3. If you're already married when your remarrying someone else will your marriage be legal after your divorced from your first husband or wife?

ANSWER:

If you are still married when you marry your new spouse the second marriage will not be legal. Even if you divorce your first spouse during your second marriage, it will still not be legal. You have to be divorced BEFORE you marry again.

 

[Hank_ 9,174]

13 minutes ago, nelmagriffin said:

Hello!

Sometimes when one is confused that is because we have read a lot from different sources. No mean words or insults is way appreciated.

( I guess I am just surprised that a non-US Citizen could apply and was granted a Divorce, this is new to me)

 

I came across this: Any comment from the expert will be appreciated.

reference: http://qa.answers.com/Q/Can_a_Filipino_citizen_file_a_divorce_in_US

 

1. Can a Filipino citizen file a divorce in US?

 

ANSWER:

 No. Civil status (i.e. being single or married) is governed by the law of your citizenship. In this case, a Filipino citizen is governed by Philippine law as regards his/her civil status. Therefore, if he/she wants to be free of those marriage ties, he/she must avail of annulment of marriage in the Philippines. Unless he/she becomes a US citizen later on, he/she may properly file for divorce in the US courts. a Filipino citizen file a divorce in US?

 

2. If you married someone who was already married in the Philippines is your marriage even legal and do you need to get a divorce?

ANSWER:

A is married to B. While marriage continues, A marries C.

 

Question: is the marriage of A to C "legal"?

 

The marriage of A to C, is bigamous and not a legal marriage. A may be charged with the crime of bigamy which carries with it a penal sanction.

3. If you're already married when your remarrying someone else will your marriage be legal after your divorced from your first husband or wife?

ANSWER:

If you are still married when you marry your new spouse the second marriage will not be legal. Even if you divorce your first spouse during your second marriage, it will still not be legal. You have to be divorced BEFORE you marry again.

 

 

 

I would not look upon that dribble as fact... if it were on paper it might be good to wrap a fish in, but that would be the extent of its value.

 

I am done ... and you should have been a long time ago

 

 

[geowrian 22,337]

2 minutes ago, nelmagriffin said:

Hello!

Sometimes when one is confused that is because we have read a lot from different sources. No mean words or insults is way appreciated.

( I guess I am just surprised that a non-US Citizen could apply and was granted a Divorce, this is new to me)

Obtaining a divorce is a civil matter. Your immigration status - or lack thereof - is not a consideration. Residency for x weeks/months is usually required by the state, but nothing related to immigration status is required...especially not citizenship.

 

#1) Outright wrong...citizenship has nothing to do with your marital status. Nobody needs to become a USC to divorce in the US. The Philippines can choose not to recognize the foreign-obtained divorce, but they can't stop you from getting divorced.

#2) If you do not dissolve an existing marriage and marry somebody else, yes. That's not the case here.

#3) Correct: a divorce for a first marriage that is obtained after marrying a second person does not make the second marriage legal. You need to be divorced before marrying somebody else.

 

To be honest, the answers on that website ate all over the map. I read through a few of them on the website directly....it's a mix of outright wrong information, a slight hint of truth, and all mixed with plenty of spelling and grammatical errors. Those are not professional nor peer reviewed answers. It's just a very poor source for immigration information.

[nelmagriffin 145]

Thank you Geowrian! for being humble and for sharing your thoughts without unnecessary side comments.

[payxibka 10,045]

1 hour ago, nelmagriffin said:

Hello!

Sometimes when one is confused that is because we have read a lot from different sources. No mean words or insults is way appreciated.

( I guess I am just surprised that a non-US Citizen could apply and was granted a Divorce, this is new to me)

The laws of the land that you  visit or reside (civil and criminal) apply to everyone (citizen, resident, non-resident).  It is inconceivable that if you move to another country (except Philippines of course), that you would be required to travel back to your home country to resolve a civil issue (which divorce is).  Even Filipinos know this and have been known to travel to places like Hong Kong for a quickie divorce. 

Edited April 7, 2018 by payxibka

[j&ana 363]

6 hours ago, nelmagriffin said:

No. Civil status (i.e. being single or married) is governed by the law of your citizenship. In this case, a Filipino citizen is governed by Philippine law as regards his/her civil status. Therefore, if he/she wants to be free of those marriage ties, he/she must avail of annulment of marriage in the Philippines. Unless he/she becomes a US citizen later on, he/she may properly file for divorce in the US courts. a Filipino citizen file a divorce in US?

Considering this is from wiki I will not put much into it. You are still looking at it as if the op is in the Philippines, she is not she got divorce and remarry in the U.S and adjust status. so US laws apply if she goes back then The Philippines laws will apply  Perhaps I can explain it this way. Me and my wife got married in the Philippines

I am USC she is Filipina If I divorce her in the US the Philippines would recognize the Divorce  with the proper paper work. However if she divorce me the Philippines government would not recognize divorce    so she could not remarry in the Philippines  without an annulment  However  if my wife moves back to the Philippines after we divorce and meet another USC who petition her on a k-1 then she could be approve as the US would recognize the divorce since it occur in the US

or my wife could stay in US meet a foreign in the US, then  that person could adjust status  like the op did and the US will recognize it since the divorce and remarriage happen in the US

or she could just remarry another USC here and the US will recognize it would

My wife could pretty much remarry anywhere as most other countries would also acknowledge the divorce except the Philippines 

Edited April 8, 2018 by j&ana

[j&ana 363]

On ‎4‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 8:22 AM, nelmagriffin said:

Are you familiar with  Philippine Article 26 of Family Code? Or Article 15 Civil Code? I included this because the OP is not a citizen yet so, How did she manage to get a divorce?

link/:reference:  http://philfaqs.com/marriage-nationality-and-divorce/

 

There’s No Divorce For a Filipino Citizen, Anywhere

Once a couple marries they can not be divorced in the Philippines.  The Family Code does not allow it.

(A notable exception, if the marriage falls under Sharia (Muslim) law, there may be a legal (recognized by the NSO (now called the PSA)) divorce alternative available.  This is way out of my area of expertise.  Those of you of the Islamic faith or married to one of the Islamic faith, must seek guidance from someone competent to advise under the Sharia Law).

The couple may:

• — Obtain a legal separation under Philippine law.  This can settle support, visitation, property disagreements and the like, but it is not a divorce, and neither party is free to marry again. (read this again, it is widely misunderstood!)
• — Obtain a legal annulment,  If this is granted under Philippine law the couple are then both free to remarry. (Note, this has nothing to do with annulment within the Catholic church — two separate issues)
• — Obtain a divorce outside the Philippines.  If this is done, the results under Philippine law vary depending on the citizenship of both parties and also on who files for the divorce.
  • — If both parties are citizens of another country the divorce is recognized by the Philippines
  • — If one party is Filipino and the other a non-Filipino then:
    • — If the foreigner files (is the “petitioner”) then the divorce is valid and the Filipino becomes free to re-marry.
    • — If the Filipino files and the divorce is granted then the Filipino partner is still considered married under the family code and may not re-marry within the Philippines

notice the Last statement

If the Filipino files and the divorce is granted then the Filipino partner is still considered married under the family code and may not re-marry within the Philippines

It states may not remarry in the Philippines it does not state that the Filipino can not remarry in another country

[NikLR 13,227]

Generally speaking most Filipinos let their foreign spouses file for divorce so that the divorce is actually legal.