Trump shifts blame to violent video games, movies in gun violence discussion

[Boiler 44,927]

2 minutes ago, -Trinity- said:

My two cents: I think it's the same thing with cannabis. There already has to be something off in a person's mind, and vigorously gaming/smoking weed triggers that person mind.

 

Some people can smoke cannabis their entire life and never get affected by it, and some people do. Same thing with alcohol.

I started going into Pubs when I was 16, not that often, I had no money. But the US attitude to many things is strange.

 

To be fair I also remember shops in the Uk that sold guns like in the US and we had a school shooting range, mention that now and look at the horror.

 

We had a school disco when I was 16 and some girl high decided she could fly out of a window, first and last disco.

[yuna628 9,652]

10 minutes ago, spookyturtle said:

Ban video games. And poodles.

Considering my adorable-looking poodle would be happy to rip a face off in an instant, sure thing.

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2 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

Considering my adorable-looking poodle would be happy to rip a face off in an instant, sure thing.

My pup is 168lbs of Cuteness, he could rip your arm off if he sees the local fox.

[yuna628 9,652]

2 minutes ago, Boiler said:

My pup is 168lbs of Cuteness, he could rip your arm off if he sees the local fox.

I put him on a scale after getting his 'winter overgrowth' shaved down for the spring... he actually gained a pound. 13lbs vicious now!

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4 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

I put him on a scale after getting his 'winter overgrowth' shaved down for the spring... he actually gained a pound. 13lbs vicious now!

A few months before I have to face that, did wash him yesterday, not a pleasant experience, manage to trim the nails on one paw, 3 more to go...

[TBoneTX 44,786]

12 minutes ago, Boiler said:

could rip your arm off if he sees the local fox.

Local fox here is a knockout blonde, and Mrs. T-B. would rip off my arm AND my face if I ogled her for too long (= at all).

[smilesammich 10,727]

1 hour ago, bcking said:

Do you really think Trump is in any way involved in what toys/games his young son gets? I'm sure if he does buy any presents for him it is through an intermediary person. I doubt even Melania really goes "shopping" for gifts. They probably both tell someone else to buy things. This isn't a dig at Trump, just the likely reality of having a wealthy businessman father, worse that he is older and has already raised a set of significant older children, and even worse because he is President and is therefore even more limited in what he can do for his son (and what he has time to do).

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/190225/digital-and-physical-game-sales-in-the-us-since-2009/

 

In 2016 just 26% of video game sales were in physical form. The safeguards are much harder to enforce online, so that is 3/4 of video game sales with weaker safeguards. Even the physical store sales though it would really depend on the parent, and the sales person. I doubt every sales person would say what that person said to you. Some may say "This game is rated mature, are you okay?", and some would say nothing and assume that since you are there with your child purchasing the game that you have already given your approval.

 

Movie theaters I do think are better at enforcing their rating scales. Though once the movie goes to DVD the same issue comes up again since I imagine the statistics on DVD sales are somewhat similar to video games (if not worse).

i am obviously not a good comparison since i have never really limited my son's media consumption, but i know there are ways to totally block internet you don't want your child to have access to. i use verizon's family base to control my son's data, i don't block content but it's possible to do. i guess i just don't think that ratings are any more or less effective than they were back when i was a kid. i still found a way to watch/listen to what i wanted, even in a very strict (southern baptist) household. the difference was i had no adults to talk candidly with about what i was consuming. 

 

1 hour ago, yuna628 said:

 

 

I don't find it odd at all.... sadly I don't think he's very hands-on as a parent. He's likely going to fit into the category of so many parents that pop out the babies and spend little time thinking about them afterwards. So maybe he should ask Melania about it.. she has been fairly protective of her son thus far.

i just thought it was common knowledge, like he's never seen a game cover his son plays? i don't know, he exists in a rare bubble that's for sure.

 

14 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

Just because you're a great mom and stay involved doesn't mean everyone is.  I allowed my kids to game a bit and watch R rated movies, but supervised it early on.  My son had amazing game skills, blew me away.  

 

But... many parents let the games and movies do the babysitting, and I'm sure you'd agree this is not the same as your method.

 

Games today are FAR more graphic and violent than in the past.  I've heard teens saying they were "going to go all GTA4" on someone who crossed them.

 

Movies, too.  Cursing, killing, blood, gore, etc.  We've all become desensitized to it.  It's the new norm. And I feel it plays a part in what people with few morals feel is acceptable. 

if anything i think parents nowadays are more hands on with their kids and probably try to manage what media they consume too much. kids had tvs for babysitters when i was young, too. 

i don't buy the desensitization bit either. my son and i both love horror/gore genre. we both curse, a ton. he's been playing violent graphic video games since he would watch his dad play as a toddler. but when my neighbor was murdered next door and his brother/murderer killed himself in the driveway next to our house - he was shaken up for weeks. we didn't even know the guy, we had just moved in. my son was extremely sad for our dead neighbor's young children - we didn't know them either.  a few years when his best friend's older sister hung herself (she was 13) it completely upended him for well over a year. he wasn't desensitized, it majorly affected him.

i guess, being raised southern baptists and being exposed to all the violence/rape in the bible all while being sheltered from watching certain cartoons (roadrunner was too violent for me to watch, not allowed) i may have a twisted view on these things. but i ultimately don't think that people now are 'worse' than they've ever been before.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

dont think its the only cause but it does need to be looked at. Along with many other social variables including lack of parenting and violence in movies and TV.

 

I can say this much. 40 years ago we did not have this kind of problem and we had almost no gun control. Something has changed and access to guns hasn't, except they are more controlled. 

[smilesammich 10,727]

4 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

dont think its the only cause but it does need to be looked at. Along with many other social variables including lack of parenting and violence in movies and TV.

 

I can say this much. 40 years ago we did not have this kind of problem and we had almost no gun control. Something has changed and access to guns hasn't, except they are more controlled. 

a lot more people, a lot more guns.

 

i do think that if a kid is already at risk any exposure to violence is not going to help. if a kid is raised watching wrestling (for example) but also has witnessed his mom getting clotheslined by his dad - that kid is probably going to think clotheslining people is sort of normal unless there's an adult around to tell him it's not.. one thing that isn't often discussed is why males are more violent than females. girls game too, we watch just as many violent movies..

[yuna628 9,652]

1 hour ago, Boiler said:

A few months before I have to face that, did wash him yesterday, not a pleasant experience, manage to trim the nails on one paw, 3 more to go...

I gave up on the trimming and just let the groomer handle him this time. He did not want to go with her at all... and I thought 'uh oh.. he's going to be a problem child' today. I absolutely make it clear to them to feel free to muzzle for their own safety. They are understanding, and this time she said with a nervous laugh that he wasn't as bad as last time! I can tell she trimmed them down but not nearly enough... so I guess I'll be fighting with him again soon.

58 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

i am obviously not a good comparison since i have never really limited my son's media consumption, but i know there are ways to totally block internet you don't want your child to have access to. i use verizon's family base to control my son's data, i don't block content but it's possible to do. i guess i just don't think that ratings are any more or less effective than they were back when i was a kid. i still found a way to watch/listen to what i wanted, even in a very strict (southern baptist) household. the difference was i had no adults to talk candidly with about what i was consuming. 

 

i just thought it was common knowledge, like he's never seen a game cover his son plays? i don't know, he exists in a rare bubble that's for sure.

 

if anything i think parents nowadays are more hands on with their kids and probably try to manage what media they consume too much. kids had tvs for babysitters when i was young, too. 

i don't buy the desensitization bit either. my son and i both love horror/gore genre. we both curse, a ton. he's been playing violent graphic video games since he would watch his dad play as a toddler. but when my neighbor was murdered next door and his brother/murderer killed himself in the driveway next to our house - he was shaken up for weeks. we didn't even know the guy, we had just moved in. my son was extremely sad for our dead neighbor's young children - we didn't know them either.  a few years when his best friend's older sister hung herself (she was 13) it completely upended him for well over a year. he wasn't desensitized, it majorly affected him.

i guess, being raised southern baptists and being exposed to all the violence/rape in the bible all while being sheltered from watching certain cartoons (roadrunner was too violent for me to watch, not allowed) i may have a twisted view on these things. but i ultimately don't think that people now are 'worse' than they've ever been before.

I don't see parents being more hands on... these days sorry. I'm sure they exist, and I hope that the new generation will hopefully learn from their parent's mistakes and be more involved. Like you, things were strict growing up. I wasn't allowed read certain things, or watch certain things - and absolutely wasn't allowed to listen to anything but 'gospel'. The education method isolated me from others. Tabletop games and rock music (this segued into Christian rock music was okay until they finally gave up) were evil blah blah blah... But like any kid, I found clever ways of gaining knowledge and experiencing things other kids were. To be sure, the Bible is one of the most violent books a kid is exposed to early on as well as a host of other apocalyptic-type Christian fiction.

 

22 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

dont think its the only cause but it does need to be looked at. Along with many other social variables including lack of parenting and violence in movies and TV.

 

I can say this much. 40 years ago we did not have this kind of problem and we had almost no gun control. Something has changed and access to guns hasn't, except they are more controlled. 

Violence in movies and tv has always been there. Seriously. It's more graphic, yes. But a guy who dies in an old western, is no more dead than one dying in a modern film. 40 years ago was the 70s..  which had plenty of films with pretty graphic violence.. and to a degree some more violent than today with a hardcore type of nihilism too. An interesting study I found... had a poll taken from the 90s, asked if people thought violent content had an effect on teenage crime. The majority thought so. Rolling back the clock to the 50s.. (a time when media content is largely considered 'tame') what do we find in those polls? The majority also thought that tv, movies, radio dramas, and comic books also were the cause of teen crime. http://news.gallup.com/poll/5626/blame-game-youth-media-violence.aspx

 

Violent behavior has existed even before modern media consumption. Before movies and tv.

As evidenced in this UK study we as a people have changed. History shows us where the breakdowns culturally begins, but also shows us that we were just as violent in older times too. It does not exactly prove that misbehavior is worse than before; though it can appear that way, appearances may be deceiving. Each generation believed there was some sort of crisis at work in youth culture.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

2 hours ago, -Trinity- said:

My two cents: I think it's the same thing with cannabis. There already has to be something off in a person's mind, and vigorously gaming/smoking weed triggers that person mind.

 

Some people can smoke cannabis their entire life and never get affected by it, and some people do. Same thing with alcohol.

Good points.  When I think of games and what we watch as things that influence actions today, I don’t think the game itself nor the movies or media we watch to be the actual culprits themselves.  Rather, it is what has become “normal” in today’s society.  When I was a kid, video games had very little direct violence, only remote (space invaders, Galaxians, Galaga, Pac Man).  You killed “things”, not people.  My son played Halo.   You kill each other, but little graphic gore. Now we have COD, GTA, MW etc.  All first-person shooters, with much gore.  

 

We see bloodshed on TV and online.  TV does not try to shield our kids from any of it; if that happens, it is ONLY at the parent level.  Much more fantasy cartoons and such, anime, etc.  A paradigm shift in what kids see as normal today.

 

None of this will make anyone more violent; that comes (or doesn’t) from within.  But the idea that violence is more normal today is certainly out there, and for a younger developing person, I think that changes how they perceive they can act.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

2 hours ago, smilesammich said:

i am obviously not a good comparison since i have never really limited my son's media consumption, but i know there are ways to totally block internet you don't want your child to have access to. i use verizon's family base to control my son's data, i don't block content but it's possible to do. i guess i just don't think that ratings are any more or less effective than they were back when i was a kid. i still found a way to watch/listen to what i wanted, even in a very strict (southern baptist) household. the difference was i had no adults to talk candidly with about what i was consuming. 

 

i just thought it was common knowledge, like he's never seen a game cover his son plays? i don't know, he exists in a rare bubble that's for sure.

 

if anything i think parents nowadays are more hands on with their kids and probably try to manage what media they consume too much. kids had tvs for babysitters when i was young, too. 

i don't buy the desensitization bit either. my son and i both love horror/gore genre. we both curse, a ton. he's been playing violent graphic video games since he would watch his dad play as a toddler. but when my neighbor was murdered next door and his brother/murderer killed himself in the driveway next to our house - he was shaken up for weeks. we didn't even know the guy, we had just moved in. my son was extremely sad for our dead neighbor's young children - we didn't know them either.  a few years when his best friend's older sister hung herself (she was 13) it completely upended him for well over a year. he wasn't desensitized, it majorly affected him.

i guess, being raised southern baptists and being exposed to all the violence/rape in the bible all while being sheltered from watching certain cartoons (roadrunner was too violent for me to watch, not allowed) i may have a twisted view on these things. but i ultimately don't think that people now are 'worse' than they've ever been before.

Blocking internet at home is an exercise in futility.  Libraries, schools, Internet cafes... too many ways for kids to find whatever they want.  I TALKED to my kids about porn and social sites, but never blocked them, except one time when my daughter gave WAY too much info to a stranger, I took her FB account away for a month.  But was it really effective? She could just create another at school.  I don’t think she did, she seemed to learn from it, but one never knows.

 

I very much disagree with you on parents being more hands-on today.  No way.  There are SOME who are, but those tend to be like you describe... ultra-religious, home schooling, never let their kids outta their sight types.  As my kids grew up, I got to see just how little other parents interacted with their kids, and I found it sad.  Not that I am a great parent or anything, but I always knew where my kids were, told them multiple times a day that I loved them, and tried to stay in touch, even if they were away from me.  

 

Perhaps your son is more sensitive to other people; I know my son is.  He’s just a kind person, has been since birth.  Muscula & brawny today, very strong physically, but always considers the feelings of others.  Daughter?  Not so much.  It seems she gives little thought to how her actions may affect others.  Different kids, same parents, different attitudes.  People die, and she doesn’t appear to be fazed much.  But let an animal get hurt, and she’s all over it, taking care, etc.  Wants to be a vet.  

 

Just keep doing what you are doing, and be thankful that your son is the way he is.  Part of it is due to you, part of it is him, but all that matters is that he turns out to be a productive member of society.  

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 hour ago, smilesammich said:

a lot more people, a lot more guns.

 

i do think that if a kid is already at risk any exposure to violence is not going to help. if a kid is raised watching wrestling (for example) but also has witnessed his mom getting clotheslined by his dad - that kid is probably going to think clotheslining people is sort of normal unless there's an adult around to tell him it's not.. one thing that isn't often discussed is why males are more violent than females. girls game too, we watch just as many violent movies..

And that argument just washes away in the sand, because the ratio should be the same.  The only thing that has changed is that access to guns has gotten more strict (at the law abiding level, anyway).

 

Males are more prone to violence because strength and dominance are in our DNA. That permeates the entire animal kingdom and has since time began.  Even when the West was wild, you didn’t hear of too many lady gunslingers.

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2 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

And that argument just washes away in the sand, because the ratio should be the same.  The only thing that has changed is that access to guns has gotten more strict (at the law abiding level, anyway).

 

Males are more prone to violence because strength and dominance are in our DNA. That permeates the entire animal kingdom and has since time began.  Even when the West was wild, you didn’t hear of too many lady gunslingers.

Does that apply now, we are in the era of Intersectionality.

[smilesammich 10,727]

3 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

I don't see parents being more hands on... these days sorry. I'm sure they exist, and I hope that the new generation will hopefully learn from their parent's mistakes and be more involved. Like you, things were strict growing up. I wasn't allowed read certain things, or watch certain things - and absolutely wasn't allowed to listen to anything but 'gospel'. The education method isolated me from others. Tabletop games and rock music (this segued into Christian rock music was okay until they finally gave up) were evil blah blah blah... But like any kid, I found clever ways of gaining knowledge and experiencing things other kids were. To be sure, the Bible is one of the most violent books a kid is exposed to early on as well as a host of other apocalyptic-type Christian fiction.

 

i don't think back when my parents were young it was considered normal to hover over your kids, helicopter parent, schedule their every waking hour or even necessarily carve out one on one time. i think it was more acceptable back in the 60s-80s to leave kids home alone or turn them loose on the neighborhood from dawn till dusk, the whole 'kids are to be seen not heard' sort of thing. that isn't socially acceptable now, for parents trying to be 'good parents'. but also, i don't think having a kid involved in multiple afterschool activities and staring at a phone the whole time is being 'hands on' either.

i pretty much had one rule with my son when he was little. he wasn't allowed to go to church without me, so basically he wasn't going ever. it's always struck me as ironic that as strict as my parents tried to be with me when i was young, they'd drop me off in a brand new church and leave me with whatever sunday school teacher to be indoctrinated. if a friend invited me to go to church with them, it was no problem (my first exposure to speaking in tongues, lol). i spent weeks in a multi-denominational church camp where my parents had no idea what was being taught.