Florida School Shooting

[yuna628 9,676]

1 minute ago, IDWAF said:

But that’s the thing... many of us here grew up playing like that.  Cops & robbers.  Cowboys and Indians.  We took guns and knives to school.  But all of that has seemingly changed in one generation.  Why?  

 

What was “kids will be kids” in my day has turned into, “Oh, Johnny has ADHD, we had to medicate him”.  Or something similar. 

I do not think that we should say to anyone during any generation ''kids will be kids''... or more specifically ''boys will be boys''. Young men have always done stupidly violent and reckless things. You don't think my dad was an absolute hellraiser before he turned his life around (he used to put that into his sermons for effect)?

 

Things were violent when I was growing up, but our community at the time was more peaceful than it became as I got older. The crime/violence spread with the drugs and poverty. It encompassed everything and everyone in it's path. Parents who don't parent existed in my dad's day.. they existed in my grandpa's day even. But we do now glorify violence on a massive scale. We don't teach kids critical reasoning skills. Our heroes became ultra violent. Mental illness existed and so did abuse then too... but now it's been brought out into the open.

 

ADHD exists and always did, but so do a host of other learning conditions that school systems fail to recognize. Little help is given to kids in that regard. My SiL is going through this with her son. Since the very day he was born, he was different, and we knew something was wrong with him. It's taken years. Some say he has a severe learning and brain development disorder coupled with ADHD. Some say he has severe autism. All I know is, the medication isn't working... he's not getting OT or the learning help he needs. He has difficulty speaking, focusing, eating, sleeping, or learning. He gets angry.  There's millions of kids like this.

 

My schooling was unconventional, but I still struggled with learning until I was about 11 not being able to get the help I needed. The help wasn't easy and it required a lot of effort. Like many kids I played video games and still do, but there are many children that probably shouldn't be playing them without supervision or at all. But many parents struggle with taking an active role or understanding in their children's life with regards to technology. They find things to babysit the kid, rather than actual babysitting.. and the older they got the worse it was. I found so many angry kids online that were hurting because of their parents (and the parents hurt because of their parents) and they all can't cope.

 

Spooky says he graduated up to BB guns after being raised with the values of do no harm, and that's fine. But there are many kids, who have BB guns and don't have those values (the shooter included). Society grows and changes over time, often for the worse. For many guns are not mere tools to be handled with care and respect (an attitude I think is still around in Europe at least). Its a thing to look cool with and they think it makes them seem more like a macho man. To be feared or respected by their peers. So they can be just like the 'unreality' actors with their gun-skills on film. Even war is glorified; we don't show the real psychological pain of many vets when they return. We have lost.. the ability to empathize and humanize each other and some like it that way. Couple that with everything else.. and it goes downhill from there.

[smilesammich 10,727]

tamir rice.

 

In two years, police killed 86 people brandishing guns that look real — but aren’t

 

the days of kids running around in the streets with toy guns is long over, imo.

 

 

[spookyturtle 9,466]

11 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

tamir rice.

 

In two years, police killed 86 people brandishing guns that look real — but aren’t

 

the days of kids running around in the streets with toy guns is long over, imo.

 

 

It’s definitely over. But the question begs to be asked, why has everything changed to the point where kids are getting shot for playing with toy guns and why are kids shooting other kids with real guns? 

[smilesammich 10,727]

Just now, spookyturtle said:

It’s definitely over. But the question begs to be asked, why has everything changed to the point where kids are getting shot for playing with toy guns and why are kids shooting other kids with real guns? 

too many people, too many guns. and the regular stuff: a culture of violence, generational poverty.  but also, our priorities concerning public safety (state and federal level) are all askew..as far as i can tell, alcohol is more heavily regulated in this country (from an industry standpoint) than gun sales/ownership. that's ridiculous.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

12 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

too many people, too many guns. and the regular stuff: a culture of violence, generational poverty.  but also, our priorities concerning public safety (state and federal level) are all askew..as far as i can tell, alcohol is more heavily regulated in this country (from an industry standpoint) than gun sales/ownership. that's ridiculous.

It seems to me that we have a large number of people who don’t know right from wrong or don’t care. They aren’t learning responsibility at home, and that’s where it starts, IMO. Again, I watched the Three Stooges and knew you didn’t hit someone in the head with a hammer. And I knew this at 4 or 5 years old. Today, many kids  don’t know that 

[smilesammich 10,727]

6 minutes ago, spookyturtle said:

It seems to me that we have a large number of people who don’t know right from wrong or don’t care. They aren’t learning responsibility at home, and that’s where it starts, IMO. Again, I watched the Three Stooges and knew you didn’t hit someone in the head with a hammer. And I knew this at 4 or 5 years old. Today, many kids  don’t know that 

i'm sure that other generations had just as many kids that grew up in environments that were neglectful. the difference might lie in what little weight we place on public education and teachers. say if it were standard for all 3-4 year olds to go to a head start sort of environment with teachers well trained in early childhood development. many kids on the wrong path would get set on a good one (not to mention their basic needs would be met, the aspect of stability, which plays a huge part in deviant behavior in young children). i don't think there's something different about kids nowadays, but i do think there's less of a chance that a kid in need will get positive intervention early enough. 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

we had some of the greatest poverty this country has ever known during the great depression. Lots of guns also.

 

Just saying

[-Trinity- 513]

2 hours ago, IDWAF said:

We do.  If you ever get caught with an illegal weapon, you will have to deal with the law.  Just as you do if you are stopped without car insurance, an unregistered vehicle, etc.  Trouble is, you are much less likely to be stopped for owning an illegal weapon than driving without insurance.  But if you are willing to take that risk...

Yeah, no thanks..never broke the law and not intending to do that now lol.

 

But is a weapon illegal if you bought it through a friend? And you have a clean record, and so does your friend. 

 

If so, what is the difference between selling a gun to someone you know/trust etc..and the black market?

[-Trinity- 513]

3 hours ago, IDWAF said:

But that’s the thing... many of us here grew up playing like that.  Cops & robbers.  Cowboys and Indians.  We took guns and knives to school.  But all of that has seemingly changed in one generation.  Why?  

 

What was “kids will be kids” in my day has turned into, “Oh, Johnny has ADHD, we had to medicate him”.  Or something similar. 

Change of mentality? Things that were considered normal, lets say 20 years ago, are now outdated?  Perhaps not everyone can deal with the pressure of today's society?

I don't know, if I had the answer i probably would be a millionaire by now.

 

 

[-Trinity- 513]

3 hours ago, spookyturtle said:

When I was a kid, and that was a long time ago, we “played guns”. We had toy guns, cap guns, eraser guns, water pistols, etc etc. Then the ultimate gift was a BB gun. When this time came, we were taught never to point it at person. When the progression was made to real guns, this was second nature. You didn’t play with real guns. You didn’t point a real gun at anyone, the family dog, cat etc. 

 

i learned responsibility at an early age. I watched the Three Stooges and never hit anyone in the head with a hammer  or poked them in the eyes. You knew you didn’t do that, yet you could watch it and laugh. Something has changed in society.

So is it that we don't teach kids how to be responsible?  If so, why don't this kind of shootings happen in other similar countries? 
What is it that makes people feel that they can take other people's lives?

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

28 minutes ago, -Trinity- said:

Yeah, no thanks..never broke the law and not intending to do that now lol.

 

But is a weapon illegal if you bought it through a friend? And you have a clean record, and so does your friend. 

 

If so, what is the difference between selling a gun to someone you know/trust etc..and the black market?

No, not illegal at all (provided states allows it, I mean).  A gun dealer has restrictions on selling across state lines.  Not so with private sellers.

 

It is only illegal to sell a gun to someone whom you believe is not able to buy a gun legally on their own.  Hence my personal rule of only buying or selling among trusted friends.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

19 minutes ago, -Trinity- said:

So is it that we don't teach kids how to be responsible?  If so, why don't this kind of shootings happen in other similar countries? 
What is it that makes people feel that they can take other people's lives?

The other countries probably don’t have 300,000,000 million guns in private hands. I think today there is less time spent between parents and children. Many kids today spend there first 4 or 5 years in daycare 10 hours a day 5 days a week. Then they’re off to school while mom and dad both work to support the household. 

 

I dont  know why some people have no problem killing. It has to go back to the family unit, environment  and society, IMO.

[smilesammich 10,727]

it's criminal to sell or have in your possession drugs that haven't been prescribed to you..but private gun sales are allowed. i don't get that. the government thinks i can't determine if it's safe to give away an antibiotic to a family friend, but i give them a gun. 

[spookyturtle 9,466]

1 hour ago, smilesammich said:

i'm sure that other generations had just as many kids that grew up in environments that were neglectful. the difference might lie in what little weight we place on public education and teachers. say if it were standard for all 3-4 year olds to go to a head start sort of environment with teachers well trained in early childhood development. many kids on the wrong path would get set on a good one (not to mention their basic needs would be met, the aspect of stability, which plays a huge part in deviant behavior in young children). i don't think there's something different about kids nowadays, but i do think there's less of a chance that a kid in need will get positive intervention early enough. 

I think there are more options available for kids and parents than there ever have been, especially with the  special needs school programs. I think it’s up to the parents to set a good example at home and seek help when needed. Daycare and teachers shouldn’t be raising our children, we should be doing it ourselves. 

[spookyturtle 9,466]

2 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

it's criminal to sell or have in your possession drugs that haven't been prescribed to you..but private gun sales are allowed. i don't get that. the government thinks i can't determine if it's safe to give away an antibiotic to a family friend, but i give them a gun. 

It’s also illegal to have an illegally obtained firearm.