Florida School Shooting

[Ban Hammer 13,352]

22 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

wasn't aware that they didn't arrest those who sell guns illegally. seems to me that this whole line of argument is nothing more than deflection from the issue at hand, which is guns are too easy to get in this country.

yet those who do so get a slap on the wrist

https://www.snopes.com/dontray-mills/

 

also -

Myth: Criminals buy guns at gun stores and gun shows

Fact: One study of adult offenders living in Chicago or nearby determined that criminals obtain most of their guns through their social network and personal connections. Rarely is the proximate source either direct purchase from a gun store, or even theft. This agrees with other, broader studies of incarcerated felons.

Fact: Another city-wide study, 6 this one in Pittsburgh, showed that 80% of people illegally carrying guns were prohibited from possessing guns, and that a minimum of 30% of the guns were stolen.

Fact: Other common arrangements include sharing guns and holding guns for others.
http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myths/crime-and-guns/

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 hour ago, JimandChristy said:

It's the weapon of choice for the majority of mass shootings. It's the amount of damage these weapons can do in such a short space of time as to why they are weapons of war.

You should really cut back on posting.  Your posts are starting to make less sense...

You obviously know very little about weapons, as well as very little about war.

Edited February 22, 2018 by IDWAF

[smilesammich 10,727]

9 minutes ago, Ban Hammer said:

yet those who do so get a slap on the wrist

https://www.snopes.com/dontray-mills/

 

also -

Myth: Criminals buy guns at gun stores and gun shows

Fact: One study of adult offenders living in Chicago or nearby determined that criminals obtain most of their guns through their social network and personal connections. Rarely is the proximate source either direct purchase from a gun store, or even theft. This agrees with other, broader studies of incarcerated felons.

Fact: Another city-wide study, 6 this one in Pittsburgh, showed that 80% of people illegally carrying guns were prohibited from possessing guns, and that a minimum of 30% of the guns were stolen.

Fact: Other common arrangements include sharing guns and holding guns for others.
http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myths/crime-and-guns/

Quote

As part of the plea bargain, prosecutors agreed with the one year of probation.

that's one person, hardly a full representation of 'those who do'

i don't even know why we're discussing how gangs in chicago get their guns. was the florida shooter in a gang? did he purchase the gun illegally? no. this is all deflection from the fact that guns are too easily attainable in this country and we have to tighten up.

Just now, IDWAF said:

You should really cut back on posting.  Your posts are starting to make less sense...

post police! get your badge yet? 

[yuna628 9,677]

45 minutes ago, AshMarty said:

I live in Baltimore and its bizarre how immune you get to finding out people were shot to death only blocks away. Baltimore is number two for most murders a year 2017-2018. Half of my adult patients are gun shot wounds (most from stray bullets). The issues go far beyond who is in political power. 

 

(Baltimore slogan---> Baltimore there is more than just murder here).  Also a Baltimore joke.. "was that a firework or gunshoots" pretty common conversation around these parts.  Jury Duty is also quite an experience in the city (I found my attempted murder case I sat on really interesting). The shooter wasn't arrested in the end because the witnesses backed out on their statements. 

 

I remember walking my dog over blood spatter on the way to the park about 4 years ago. I cannot get my dog to stop sniffing the blood to continue the walk. I live in the "safe" part of Baltimore. 

 

There's no real 'safe' part of B'more. You just sort of, well carry on and deal with it day by day. The things I saw there every day as a child have stuck with me. There's a reason we call it Murderland, but it's not just murders. The gunshot or firework guesswork extends far beyond the city though... it's a question my husband will ask me fearfully almost every day.

24 minutes ago, AshMarty said:

 

 

Trying to analyze why these cities are struggling, it difficult to do without living in them and interacting with people that live in these neighbors regularly. In Baltimore city kids were going to schools without heat (the classrooms were 40 degrees). Someone finally decided it was time to do something about it. I saw a 16 year old boy (gang member) with 2 children from different women. The 16 year old boy lived with him grandmother (no parents in his life to give him guidance). This 16 year old was also very respectful and kind to me and the only career he has been show in the city is drug dealing.  It is pretty typical for my patients to come in and have 16 children (none who live with them) and be on medicaid themselves. 

 

You cannot just pull one statistic and think that is the reason why the city is struggling.

It's very correct that it's hard for people on the outside looking in, to figure out why cities like B'more or Chicago struggle. They'll think of The Wire, and think it's exactly like that (it's worse). It's poverty, it's drugs, it's a lack of city care that has created the overall culture of crime and abuse for generations. It's run down even when it's beautiful. The school system is a mess and the institutions are crumbling. There's little for kids, and nothing to inspire them to hope for a better future. Once you're stuck you're stuck. The council are still so upset that Amazon didn't want to move in.... ha.. there's the showcase of priorities for you.

10 minutes ago, AshMarty said:

Also Baltimore does have a task force for Guns.. it actually made national news for all the wrong reasons this past week. 

 

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/bs-md-ci-gttf-verdict-20180208-story.html

 

Children from these neighborhoods don't respect the police. They respect their parents (when they are present) so they do not have any fear of laws. 

 

The GTTF is one of the most disgusting and corrupt tales to come out of the BPD in decades. It's resulted in the murder and likely coverup of an officer, and widespread evidence of corruption continues. There has been some calls to scrap the entire PD and start over. They won't respect the police; because why would they? For every good cop on the force, will be overshadowed by the entrenched bad ones that have been left to abuse the citizenry so much with no consequences. These abuses have contributed to a breakdown of trust. But there's other things too... cops are not actually in the communities, and a great deal of them don't even live within the city limits. In some places people feel that when you call the police, none will show up. If they try and take matters into their own hands and be vocal against gangs and dealers - you wind up dead. The children are recruited young so that gangs and drugs seem normal and the only path forward. It's been a standoff for a very long time, but the deep rooted corruption of the BPD (including ties to the mob and gangs) and distrust has been there for decades.

[Ban Hammer 13,352]

2 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

that's one person, hardly a full representation of 'those who do'

 

there are more examples should you care to look for them.

[smilesammich 10,727]

1 minute ago, Ban Hammer said:

there are more examples should you care to look for them.

i'm sure there are. i just don't see how looking for people who i personally feel weren't handed appropriate jail sentences is productive.

[Binna 108]

19 minutes ago, Ban Hammer said:

Fact: One study of adult offenders living in Chicago or nearby determined that criminals obtain most of their guns through their social network and personal connections. Rarely is the proximate source either direct purchase from a gun store, or even theft. This agrees with other, broader studies of incarcerated felons.

Fact: Another city-wide study, 6 this one in Pittsburgh, showed that 80% of people illegally carrying guns were prohibited from possessing guns, and that a minimum of 30% of the guns were stolen.

Fact: Other common arrangements include sharing guns and holding guns for others.

Very interesting facts. Is there any fact you found on where the guns came from originally? That's probably where we could start from. If we can get to the very beginning on how the guns even became available to be stolen or shared/obtained perhaps we could stop the guns from getting to the wrong hands. Don't you think so?

[smilesammich 10,727]

4 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

 

It's very correct that it's hard for people on the outside looking in, to figure out why cities like B'more or Chicago struggle. They'll think of The Wire, and think it's exactly like that (it's worse). It's poverty, it's drugs, it's a lack of city care that has created the overall culture of crime and abuse for generations. It's run down even when it's beautiful. The school system is a mess and the institutions are crumbling. There's little for kids, and nothing to inspire them to hope for a better future. Once you're stuck you're stuck. The council are still so upset that Amazon didn't want to move in.... ha.. there's the showcase of priorities for you.

 

and that's the crux. there's no quick fix.

[AshMarty 360]

13 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

There's no real 'safe' part of B'more. You just sort of, well carry on and deal with it day by day. The things I saw there every day as a child have stuck with me. There's a reason we call it Murderland, but it's not just murders. The gunshot or firework guesswork extends far beyond the city though... it's a question my husband will ask me fearfully almost every day.

It's very correct that it's hard for people on the outside looking in, to figure out why cities like B'more or Chicago struggle. They'll think of The Wire, and think it's exactly like that (it's worse). It's poverty, it's drugs, it's a lack of city care that has created the overall culture of crime and abuse for generations. It's run down even when it's beautiful. The school system is a mess and the institutions are crumbling. There's little for kids, and nothing to inspire them to hope for a better future. Once you're stuck you're stuck. The council are still so upset that Amazon didn't want to move in.... ha.. there's the showcase of priorities for you.

The GTTF is one of the most disgusting and corrupt tales to come out of the BPD in decades. It's resulted in the murder and likely coverup of an officer, and widespread evidence of corruption continues. There has been some calls to scrap the entire PD and start over. They won't respect the police; because why would they? For every good cop on the force, will be overshadowed by the entrenched bad ones that have been left to abuse the citizenry so much with no consequences. These abuses have contributed to a breakdown of trust. But there's other things too... cops are not actually in the communities, and a great deal of them don't even live within the city limits. In some places people feel that when you call the police, none will show up. If they try and take matters into their own hands and be vocal against gangs and dealers - you wind up dead. The children are recruited young so that gangs and drugs seem normal and the only path forward. It's been a standoff for a very long time, but the deep rooted corruption of the BPD (including ties to the mob and gangs) and distrust has been there for decades.

I have lived in Baltimore for 7.5 years. My friends (outside the city) never believe me when I tell them I get put on hold when I call 911.  I don't know if I will always live in Baltimore but I do appreciate the lessons the city has taught me. Especially after growing up in a place like Cape Cod where we didn't even lock our doors at night.  I wish others would be more open minded to experiencing it before they spout out single law fixes and blame.

 

But some how I still love the city (it's such mixed emotions). Hahaha as any one living here feels. Only in Baltimore can you have a multi million dollar home on the same block as the local drug dealer. 

Edited February 22, 2018 by AshMarty

[Boiler 45,555]

2 minutes ago, AshMarty said:

I have lived in Baltimore for 7.5 years. My friends (outside the city) never believe me when I tell them I get put on hold when I call 911.  I don't know if I will always live in Baltimore but I do appreciate the lessons the city has taught me. Especially after growing up in a place like Cape Cod where we didn't even lock our doors at night.  I wish others would be more open minded to experiencing it before they spout out single law fixes and blame to the system.

 

But some how I still love the city (it's such mixed emotions). Hahaha as any one living here feels. Only in Baltimore can you have a multi million dollar home on the same block as the local drug dealer. 

Presumably the local drug dealer has a multi million dollar home.

 

Sadly many of the issues and solutions are Political and whilst you have the establishment  invested in not changing things nothing will change.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 hour ago, smilesammich said:

"We border Indiana and Wisconsin, which have really lax gun laws," Chicago Police Superintendent Eddie Johnson said.
"We know that people from Chicago go across the border, fill up gym bags with illegal weapons from gun shows and things of that nature and they come back here and sell them to the gangs."
Illinois Gov. Bruce Rauner recently signed a new gun control law that imposes harsher penalties on those who bring in guns from out of state to sell and do not have gun-owner ID cards.

I know it’s just you quoting the article, but how does one go to a gun show (and things of that nature???) and buy guns illegally?

[AshMarty 360]

8 minutes ago, Boiler said:

Presumably the local drug dealer has a multi million dollar home.

 

Sadly many of the issues and solutions are Political and whilst you have the establishment  invested in not changing things nothing will change.

No, my local drug dealer lives in the slum house 2 blocks away. The other one was recently evicted 3 houses down. I watched two mornings when she was served the eviction notice (but the house has since been beautifully renovated and a nice family moved in). The really wealthy ones live outside the city. 

 

The best part is last summer when petty crime was making its way into my street/neighbor. The drug dealer came by and said he would make sure this doesn't happen again. Haha.. he doesnt want the police in the area for petty crime when he has business to take care of. 

 

This just about summarizes Baltimore.  

 

And Political yes, in the way legislation needs work (my opinion parties work against each other and nothing is accomplished because of the swings of power and no compromise),. The city is generations behind, the only hope is really starting for the children and working on those generations on. 

Edited February 22, 2018 by AshMarty

[smilesammich 10,727]

Just now, Boiler said:

Presumably the local drug dealer has a multi million dollar home.

 

Sadly many of the issues and solutions are Political and whilst you have the establishment  invested in not changing things nothing will change.

that would be a mostly incorrect assumption.

[smilesammich 10,727]

1 minute ago, IDWAF said:

I know it’s just you quoting the article, but how does one go to a gun show (and things of that nature???) and buy guns illegally?

i don't know. maybe they were clarifying the guns as illegal, because once they're purchased and brought into chicago for sale - they're illegal.

[Boiler 45,555]

2 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

that would be a mostly incorrect assumption.

Has been discussed enough times, go back and have a read.