Florida School Shooting

[cyclone27 710]

Small % compared to handguns but I think you know that so your logic is baffling. 

[JimandChristy 1,689]

Just now, cyclone27 said:

Small % compared to handguns but I think you know that so your logic is baffling. 

So? Doesn't mean we can't take action. That small % we're talking about includes elementary and high school students being mowed down in our classrooms. It includes people being mowed down in a cinema, at a nightclub or at a music concert. Context is everything.

[cyclone27 710]

Semi-automatic rifles are not going anywhere its time you face that reality.

 

The only way to avoid it is to find another country that suits your beliefs. 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

To save time could the MDL just use

 

A.  for---Its a straw argument

B. for--Why do you want children to die ?

C. for- Its a weapon of War

[cyclone27 710]

Just now, Nature Boy Flair said:

To save time could the MDL just use

 

A.  for---Its a straw argument

B. for--Why do you want children to die ?

C. for- Its a weapon of War

Repeat at nauseum. 

[Boiler 46,171]

28 minutes ago, JimandChristy said:

They are, the majority of mass shootings since Columbine have been with weapons of war. They don't belong on the streets they belong on a battlefield.

Wow loads of straw!

 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

12 minutes ago, JimandChristy said:

So? Doesn't mean we can't take action. That small % we're talking about includes elementary and high school students being mowed down in our classrooms. It includes people being mowed down in a cinema, at a nightclub or at a music concert. Context is everything.

Maybe we should start here. What we going to do to stop this.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/01/02/us/chicago-murder-rate-2016-visual-guide/index.html

 

One child age 16 or younger is murdered in the city every week on average. This has been happening for more than a quarter century, police records show.

[Boiler 46,171]

3 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

Maybe we should start here. What we going to do to stop this.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/01/02/us/chicago-murder-rate-2016-visual-guide/index.html

 

One child age 16 or younger is murdered in the city every week on average. This has been happening for more than a quarter century, police records show.

Presumably due to the NRA and/or Trump and/or Republicans

 

Remind me again who has been running Chicago for 25 years?

[AshMarty 360]

10 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

Maybe we should start here. What we going to do to stop this.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/01/02/us/chicago-murder-rate-2016-visual-guide/index.html

 

One child age 16 or younger is murdered in the city every week on average. This has been happening for more than a quarter century, police records show.

I live in Baltimore and its bizarre how immune you get to finding out people were shot to death only blocks away. Baltimore is number two for most murders a year 2017-2018. Half of my adult patients are gun shot wounds (most from stray bullets). The issues go far beyond who is in political power. 

 

(Baltimore slogan---> Baltimore there is more than just murder here).  Also a Baltimore joke.. "was that a firework or gunshoots" pretty common conversation around these parts.  Jury Duty is also quite an experience in the city (I found my attempted murder case I sat on really interesting). The shooter wasn't arrested in the end because the witnesses backed out on their statements. 

 

I remember walking my dog over blood spatter on the way to the park about 4 years ago. I cannot get my dog to stop sniffing the blood to continue the walk. I live in the "safe" part of Baltimore. 

 

Edited February 22, 2018 by AshMarty

[smilesammich 10,727]

5 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

Maybe we should start here. What we going to do to stop this.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/01/02/us/chicago-murder-rate-2016-visual-guide/index.html

 

One child age 16 or younger is murdered in the city every week on average. This has been happening for more than a quarter century, police records show.

from your link:

 

Chicago has strict gun laws, which is why many gun rights advocates point to it as evidence that tighter regulation doesn't equal less crime.

 

GUNS IN CHICAGO: 2016 BY THE NUMBERS
3,550 shooting incidents
4,331 shooting victims
8,300 guns recovered -- a 20% increase from 2015
10% more gun arrests in 2016

Source: Chicago Police Department

 

But Chicago's gun violence problem is more complicated. Sixty percent of the guns used in shootings were purchased out of state.
"We border Indiana and Wisconsin, which have really lax gun laws," Chicago Police Superintendent Eddie Johnson said.
"We know that people from Chicago go across the border, fill up gym bags with illegal weapons from gun shows and things of that nature and they come back here and sell them to the gangs."
Illinois Gov. Bruce Rauner recently signed a new gun control law that imposes harsher penalties on those who bring in guns from out of state to sell and do not have gun-owner ID cards.

[Boiler 46,171]

4 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

from your link:

 

Chicago has strict gun laws, which is why many gun rights advocates point to it as evidence that tighter regulation doesn't equal less crime.

 

GUNS IN CHICAGO: 2016 BY THE NUMBERS
3,550 shooting incidents
4,331 shooting victims
8,300 guns recovered -- a 20% increase from 2015
10% more gun arrests in 2016

Source: Chicago Police Department

 

But Chicago's gun violence problem is more complicated. Sixty percent of the guns used in shootings were purchased out of state.
"We border Indiana and Wisconsin, which have really lax gun laws," Chicago Police Superintendent Eddie Johnson said.
"We know that people from Chicago go across the border, fill up gym bags with illegal weapons from gun shows and things of that nature and they come back here and sell them to the gangs."
Illinois Gov. Bruce Rauner recently signed a new gun control law that imposes harsher penalties on those who bring in guns from out of state to sell and do not have gun-owner ID cards.

Presumably it is a criminal offence to sell guns to Gangs?

 

Why not start arresting those who do it?

[smilesammich 10,727]

1 minute ago, Boiler said:

Presumably it is a criminal offence to sell guns to Gangs?

 

Why not start arresting those who do it?

wasn't aware that they didn't arrest those who sell guns illegally. seems to me that this whole line of argument is nothing more than deflection from the issue at hand, which is guns are too easy to get in this country.

seriously, the only time gang violence is brought up by gun rights folk is when they want to change the subject. gangs are a direct result of mass incarceration breaking down the family unit, extreme poverty, and poorly funded systems of public education. but that's a discussion for another thread.

[AshMarty 360]

15 minutes ago, Boiler said:

Presumably it is a criminal offence to sell guns to Gangs?

 

Why not start arresting those who do it?

 

 

21 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

from your link:

 

Chicago has strict gun laws, which is why many gun rights advocates point to it as evidence that tighter regulation doesn't equal less crime.

 

GUNS IN CHICAGO: 2016 BY THE NUMBERS
3,550 shooting incidents
4,331 shooting victims
8,300 guns recovered -- a 20% increase from 2015
10% more gun arrests in 2016

Source: Chicago Police Department

 

But Chicago's gun violence problem is more complicated. Sixty percent of the guns used in shootings were purchased out of state.
"We border Indiana and Wisconsin, which have really lax gun laws," Chicago Police Superintendent Eddie Johnson said.
"We know that people from Chicago go across the border, fill up gym bags with illegal weapons from gun shows and things of that nature and they come back here and sell them to the gangs."
Illinois Gov. Bruce Rauner recently signed a new gun control law that imposes harsher penalties on those who bring in guns from out of state to sell and do not have gun-owner ID cards.

Trying to analyze why these cities are struggling, it difficult to do without living in them and interacting with people that live in these neighbors regularly. In Baltimore city kids were going to schools without heat (the classrooms were 40 degrees). Someone finally decided it was time to do something about it. I saw a 16 year old boy (gang member) with 2 children from different women. The 16 year old boy lived with him grandmother (no parents in his life to give him guidance). This 16 year old was also very respectful and kind to me and the only career he has been show in the city is drug dealing.  It is pretty typical for my patients to come in and have 16 children (none who live with them) and be on medicaid themselves. 

 

You cannot just pull one statistic and think that is the reason why the city is struggling.

Edited February 22, 2018 by AshMarty

[smilesammich 10,727]

1 minute ago, AshMarty said:

 

 

Trying to analyze why these cities are struggling, it difficult to do without living in them and interacting with people that live in these neighbors regularly. In Baltimore city kids were going to schools without heat (the classrooms were 40 degrees). Someone finally decided it was time to do something about it. I saw a 16 year old boy (gang member) with 2 children from different women. The 16 year old boy lived with him grandmother (no parents in his life to give him guidance). This 16 year old was also very respectful and kind to me and the only career he has been show in the city is drug dealing.  It is pretty typical for my patients to come in and have 16 children (none who live with them) and be on medicaid themselves. 

 

You cannot just pull one statistic and think that is the reason why the city is struggling.

agreed. i often see 'lack of respect for life' brought up in these discussions. i wonder if we consider the myriad of ways this lack exposes itself in reality, it goes so far beyond video games.

[AshMarty 360]

Also Baltimore does have a task force for Guns.. it actually made national news for all the wrong reasons this past week. 

 

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/bs-md-ci-gttf-verdict-20180208-story.html

 

Children from these neighborhoods don't respect the police. They respect their parents (when they are present) so they do not have any fear of laws. 

10 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

agreed. i often see 'lack of respect for life' brought up in these discussions. i wonder if we consider the myriad of ways this lack exposes itself in reality, it goes so far beyond video games.

 

Edited February 22, 2018 by AshMarty