Florida School Shooting

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

5 minutes ago, Boiler said:

I remember talking to a guy years ago who only bought shall we say informally as he did not want to have anything new he bought on a database, I thought at the time it was a bit Black Helicopter but now not so sure.

I'd prefer to continue this particular discussion via PM.  

[Boiler 45,525]

11 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

As to the mental health check question... How? I mean, people who have treatment for mental health SHOULD already pop up, but as we saw with the former Air Force guy who went rogue, the system failed miserably.

 

If you are suggesting a mental health checkup at the time of purchase, I'd vote no for now, because there isn't a standard,  and it would very limited in scope.  Probably a waste of time and money, I'd guess.

When you buy your gun you fill in the usual application and are given this as well?

 

[OriZ 3,157]

13 hours ago, Bill & Katya said:

Yes, this seems to be the sensible thing to do, but as you know, there will be opposition to a plan like that saying something like the armed guard(s) scare the students.  Since these are "gun free" zones, many uninformed folks believe that anyone having a gun violates that feel good policy.

That's absolutely ridiculous. I've seen and studied in many schools that have guards(in Israel pretty much all of them do) and I can say first hand that scare the kids they don't lol. 

[Boiler 45,525]

6 minutes ago, OriZ said:

That's absolutely ridiculous. I've seen and studied in many schools that have guards(in Israel pretty much all of them do) and I can say first hand that scare the kids they don't lol. 

I remember when I first went to France as a kid and the Gendarme had Guns being surprised and fascinated but not scared.

[yuna628 9,676]

32 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

As to the mental health check question... How? I mean, people who have treatment for mental health SHOULD already pop up, but as we saw with the former Air Force guy who went rogue, the system failed miserably.

 

If you are suggesting a mental health checkup at the time of purchase, I'd vote no for now, because there isn't a standard,  and it would very limited in scope.  Probably a waste of time and money, I'd guess.

How about an exam if it was for someone say 25 and under, like Sonea suggested happens in Germany? You might not catch all the potential crazies that way, but you could cut down on some of them, including the younger crowd that tend to 'enjoy' murdering activity on a large scale like this (kind of like the tide pod thing.. once one kid does it.. another one does it - and this guy was fond of past mass murder offenders propaganda pieces). If they have such an exam in other countries it must work out somehow. People that have known mental issues being on a database so they can't get a gun is good, however that's not going to stop those that are nuts and haven't been formally diagnosed. And yes the system failed, that needs to be addressed. How do we fix it?

 

OriZ this school did have armed officers apparently, didn't stop anything. Armed officers in schools is becoming more of a thing now.

 

Emotionally I do not believe that kids are ready to belong having guns, unless it is with adult supervision and you have instilled proper behavior. But not everyone will instill proper behavior in their kids. We should not, be of the mindset to say... well a few bad apples here and there.. because these bad apples do a lot of murdering. They are using a Constitutional right as a scapegoat to achieve their goal, and they know it. Had he received some sort of exam before purchase, maybe they would have stopped him. He wasn't going to get the help he needed anywhere else clearly nor would he have pinged on the appropriate radar because of the clear disconnect with law enforcement.

[Boiler 45,525]

There ere some youngsters on my Hunters Ed course, 12 to 14?, did not ask, they passed.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

37 minutes ago, OriZ said:

That's absolutely ridiculous. I've seen and studied in many schools that have guards(in Israel pretty much all of them do) and I can say first hand that scare the kids they don't lol. 

When I went to school, we all carried knives in class.  Many had guns in their cars (not allowed in class, unless it was to shoot).  Have also been in airports where armed guards walk around with loaded assault rifles.  Have never felt safer because of it.

[JimandChristy 1,689]

School shootings are now just as American as Apple Pie. Very sad. The land where kids are mowed down inside classrooms.

[Boiler 45,525]

Just now, JimandChristy said:

School shootings are now just as American as Apple Pie. Very sad. The land where kids are mowed down inside classrooms.

What homely would you use for Acid Attacks in the UK?

[Dashinka 24,512]

9 hours ago, Boiler said:

Anyone under the age of 18 must be accompanied by an adult. Individuals 18 or older can purchase a long gun (shotgun or rifle), but must be 21 years of age to purchase a handgun.

 

Colorado, seems fair. I am more concerned about the really young age you can drive. When I learnt to drive you had to be 17 and the test was not the walk in the park it is in the US, most people I knew did not pass first time.

 

You can buy a car at 16 I believe.

 

Mental Health is already a block to buying. Not sure if they can take what you have, I think so.

 

 

Isn't vehicular accidents the biggest killer of teenagers in this country?

[Dashinka 24,512]

8 hours ago, OriZ said:

That's absolutely ridiculous. I've seen and studied in many schools that have guards(in Israel pretty much all of them do) and I can say first hand that scare the kids they don't lol. 

I sympathize, but if you go back in this thread there was at least one response that said this was a bad idea since the armed person (teacher or guard) might turn and start shooting people.  As I opined, someone will find a way to object and will not accept anything less than banning all guns.

[Dashinka 24,512]

6 hours ago, JimandChristy said:

School shootings are now just as American as Apple Pie. Very sad. The land where kids are mowed down inside classrooms.

I keep hearing that all we need to do is make it harder to get firearms.  I wonder, have you ever considered what is the true root cause for these school shootings?  Why are there children that are do blind to the sanctity of human life that they are willing to do this?  I know I am a little older, so I can remember when schools had shooting and archery clubs so there were students that would bring these weapons with them to school.  I also remember when a school was pretty much wide open for all.  Sadly, this is no longer the case, but do you really expect anyone to believe that idiots like this guy in Florida, or any of the others would have ignored their feelings to kill just because  they couldn't get a gun?  Heck, this idiot could have bought a vehicle and rammed a group of students at recess or when school was letting out.

 

Address the root cause.

[Crazy Cat 41,888]

11 hours ago, Merle said:

Don't you know the NRA advocates criminals and crazies buying and owning guns?

Hahahaha!!!

[Crazy Cat 41,888]

1.There will always be mentally ill people who will snap and try to kill others.

2.  Confiscating all the guns is unrealistic.

3.  Signs declaring "gun free zones" are an illusion.

 

The only practical and immediate solution to the problem of school shootings is to beef up security at schools.......and that can be done in several ways...

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 hour ago, Bill & Katya said:

I keep hearing that all we need to do is make it harder to get firearms.  I wonder, have you ever considered what is the true root cause for these school shootings?  Why are there children that are do blind to the sanctity of human life that they are willing to do this?  I know I am a little older, so I can remember when schools had shooting and archery clubs so there were students that would bring these weapons with them to school.  I also remember when a school was pretty much wide open for all.  Sadly, this is no longer the case, but do you really expect anyone to believe that idiots like this guy in Florida, or any of the others would have ignored their feelings to kill just because  they couldn't get a gun?  Heck, this idiot could have bought a vehicle and rammed a group of students at recess or when school was letting out.

 

Address the root cause.

As an older fellow, I too remember those days.  But there exists a group on here (representative of a larger group in America, I imagine) who still think guns are the problem. 

 

Our country was founded on guns.  Without them, America as we know it would not exist today.  You and I saw guns in school.  I used to carry a pocket knife to class at the age of 7 or 8.  I remember kids wearing bigger knives in sheaths on their belts.  No one was stabbed.  No one was shot.  

 

The root cause is humans. And the lack of respect for human life.