I-751 February 2018 Filers

[PerditaD 35]

1 hour ago, aka586 said:

@PerditaD Have you considered that those of us who have been inactive are inactive because we have gotten no updates at all? That would be the case with me, and I’m sure many others. My info is up to date and accurate even though I have been inactive for quite some time. Hard to be active when I get no updates. 🤷🏻‍♀️

@aka586 I meant no disrespect or anything like that. I was just trying to see if there is anything else we can do to make the table more accurate. 

[ALIENRJ187 43]

54 minutes ago, SSKK said:

Good morning, 

 

I believe the "Action" is referring to my address change notice. I have read that USCIS priorities applicants who also have applied to US citizenship (Correct me if it's wrong) 

 

 

Based on the trends for just the Feb 2018 filers,  it seems most, if not all of the approvals from CSC have not applied for N400 citizenship yet.  I heard the same rumor as you did about prioritizing, but it doesn't seem to be happening that way for the most part.  I was wondering if the people who did apply for N400 are going to face extra scrutiny which might delay their cases for awhile.  Could explain why they are not going chronologically based on receiving the files.

[GBOS 198]

23 minutes ago, ALIENRJ187 said:

Based on the trends for just the Feb 2018 filers,  it seems most, if not all of the approvals from CSC have not applied for N400 citizenship yet.  I heard the same rumor as you did about prioritizing, but it doesn't seem to be happening that way for the most part.  I was wondering if the people who did apply for N400 are going to face extra scrutiny which might delay their cases for awhile.  Could explain why they are not going chronologically based on receiving the files.

@ALIENRJ187

 

The work should theoretically be done in chronological (which also means numerical) order.

 

This is the explanation from USCIS official when Vermont had the Service Center open house to immigration lawyers back in 2017 and to the local media in 2016.

 

Files are however put together in a basket (like a USPS mail basket, if you have seen one before), so it goes, for example, EAC180050001 to EAC1810050020 (20 files) in Basket #1, and the next basket (Basket #2) could have another 20 or whatever fits in each basket.  As you know I-751 file is not standard; some people submit loads of documents, while some people submit fewer documents for whatever reason they may have.

 

Each basket is put on a shelf in the file room, and each officer picks up one basket of the Form he/she is assigned to work.  One I/O picks up one and only one basket at a time (and the IO must pick up the first basket in the queue).  The I/0 must finish that by adjudicating (approve, deny), issuing RFE, or transferring the file to a field office for an interview, before he/she can go get a new basket.  If an officer issues an RFE, that particular file stays with him/her until it can be adjudicated or transferred, pending the RFE response from the applicant/petitioner.  So when he/she picks up a new basket, he/she still needs to come back to any open files with outstanding RFE when the response is received back from the applicant/petitioner.

 

That said, you could have Officer A (picking up Basket #1) who works slower than Officer B (picking up Basket #2).  So Officer B would finish Basket #2 before Officer A could finish Basket #1.  Then Officer B would go on to pick up Basket #3, and so it goes.

 

Now imagine there are approximately 80 adjudicating officers (as of 2017) who works exclusively on family-based forms (many other forms including I-751).  So you could imagine how file baskets are out of order everywhere, due to this simple “speed of work” difference.  This doesn’t take into account hundred of other possible issues like - resign, termination, vacation, temporary reassignment, temporary reduction in workforce etc.

 

Hopefully this helps you understand why we see approvals all over the place.

Edited February 24, 2019 by GBOS

[Unidentified 2,930]

2 minutes ago, GBOS said:

The work should theoretically be done in chronological (which also means numerical) order.

 

This is the explanation from USCIS official when Vermont had the Service Center open house to immigration lawyers back in 2017 and to the local media in 2016.

 

Files are however put together in a basket (like a USPS mail basket, if you have seen one before), so it goes, for example, EAC180050001 to EAC1810050020 (20 files) in Basket #1, and the next basket (Basket #2) could have another 20 or whatever fits in each basket.  As you know I-751 file is not standard; some people submit loads of documents, while some people submit fewer documents for whatever reason they may have.

 

Each basket is put on a shelf in the file room, and each officer picks up one basket of the Form he/she is assigned to work.  One I/O picks up one and only one basket at a time (and the IO must pick up the first basket in the queue).  The I/0 must finish that by adjudicating (approve, deny), issuing RFE, or transferring the file to a field office for an interview, before he/she can go get a new basket.  If an officer issues an RFE, that particular file stays with him/her until it can be adjudicated or transferred, pending the RFE response from the applicant/petitioner.  So when he/she picks up a new basket, he/she still needs to come back to any open files with outstanding RFE when the response is received back from the applicant/petitioner.

 

That said, you could have Officer A (picking up Basket #1) who works slower than Officer B (picking up Basket #2).  So Officer B would finish Basket #2 before Officer A could finish Basket #1.  Then Officer B would go on to pick up Basket #3, and so it goes.

 

Now imagine there are approximately 80 adjudicating officers (as of 2017) who works exclusively on family-based forms (many other forms including I-751).  So you could imagine how file baskets are out of order everywhere, due to this simple “speed of work” difference.  This doesn’t take into account hundred of other possible issues like - resign, termination, vacation, temporary reassignment, temporary reduction in workforce etc.

 

Hopefully this helps you understand why we see approvals all over the place.

This is kind of in line with how I have been imagining it. Thanks for sharing, makes so much more sense now! And it kind of help with the whole "those people applied after me, why am I not hearing anything yet?". It just means I am not in the same basket

[ALIENRJ187 43]

@GBOS How does it the USCIS system address the basket situation if you have multiple forms at the same time, such as I-751 and N400?  Since one would be filed before the other, do they find your I-751 file in the basket, stick the N400 inside it and keep your place in line as it were?

[Unidentified 2,930]

1 minute ago, ALIENRJ187 said:

@GBOS How does it the USCIS system address the basket situation if you have multiple forms at the same time, such as I-751 and N400?  Since one would be filed before the other, do they find your I-751 file in the basket, stick the N400 inside it and keep your place in line as it were?

Well, everything government related is scanned into computers... So I would assume they go by the barcode on the form or something and know... okay this file is at this service center, it has this case number so it must belong to this nr basket. And then they just get those files together at (I'm assuming) the local office of the petitioner.  

[GBOS 198]

52 minutes ago, ALIENRJ187 said:

@GBOS How does it the USCIS system address the basket situation if you have multiple forms at the same time, such as I-751 and N400?  Since one would be filed before the other, do they find your I-751 file in the basket, stick the N400 inside it and keep your place in line as it were?

@ALIENRJ187 @Unidentified

 

This explanation is available in the adjudication manual used by all adjudicating officers (aka. the adjudication bible).  N-400 file preparation is handled exclusive by the National Benefits Center (NBC) in Lee Summit, Missouri.

 

Once Form N-400 is filed by an applicant, the system runs A# to see if an applicant is still a conditional resident (CR).  If an applicant is still a CR (meaning an applicant has a pending I-751 (marriage less than 2-years)), a file request is automatically initiated to locate and retrieve the I-751 file from the Service Center the file is at.  NBC waits until it receives I-751 file, put it together with N-400 file and transfer it to the field office having jurisdiction over the address supplied by an applicant.  This system is not perfect (well nothing with USCIS is perfect).  Here are four possible scenarios that we know to play out in reality as a result of N-400 filing while I-751 is pending:

 

Scenario #1

In some cases, filing N-400 will effectively delay (and I don't like this term because it is misleading unless you really understand the big picture of how N-400 and I-751 adjudication works together) I-751 adjudication depending on how fast the field office is processing N-400.  For example, if you are in Dallas, TX, this is one of the slowest N-400 processing due to a very large number of immigrants within this field office's jurisdiction.  Currently it runs about 16-20 months.  That said, your I-751 will NOT be adjudicated until you are called for N-400 interview and both cases will be adjudicated at the same time.  This is when you see people on VJ here complain that they filed I-751 in late 2017 and they are still waiting.  The majority of them complain and as soon as you ask, you will find out that they also have a pending N-400 in one of these overloaded office, namely -- Dallas, Houston, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Atlanta etc.  The wait time for N-400 is improving, nonetheless.  N-400 has been and will always be a priority when it comes to field office workload.  This is more true in the election year (even year).

 

Scenario #2

In some cases, filing N-400 will effectively speed up I-751 adjudication.  For example, if you are in West Palm Beach, FL or Jacksonville, FL, this is one of the fastest N-400 processing in the country due to a very small number of immigrants plus army bases (note: the military members and their family members are entitled to an expedited N-400 processing).  Currently for these fast offices, it runs about 4-6 months.  That said, your I-751 will also be adjudicated at the same time when you are call for N-400 interview.

 

Scenario #3

In some cases, filing N-400 will also delay (and this is a real delay) an adjudication of both I-751 and N-400.  The reasons for this delay is the I-751 file has already been opened by the officer (note: once it is opened by the IO, it will not be pulled and transferred to NBC) and is awaiting an adjudication.  This seems like it should happen quickly once the file is opened, but it is not always the case.  Therefore, some people are being called for N-400 interview first, but their I-751 file is still with the Service Center.  So N-400 cannot be fully approved until the IO at the Service Center finalizes and approves I-751, and who knows what could go wrong in that process.  You also see people claims that N-400 pushes the IO to approve their I-751 at the Service Center.  That is just pure luck, if it happens.  This is not true.

 

Scenario #4

In very very unique cases, the I-751 file is stuck in purgatory of security checks (FBI Name Checks, IBIS, Criminal History etc.) or a fraud investigation.  Fraud investigation is unique to I-751 filing because of the widespread marriage fraud (that is what USCIS claims to happen, which I disagree).  The security check delays are much more common among cases in this scenario than fraud investigations are.  The manpower of USCIS just does not support the investigation of marriage fraud, as opposed to other frauds like H1B.  USCIS chooses to fry bigger fishes.  You can see these in their court filing, many of which they put out on USCIS electronic reading room for people to see that fraud will not be tolerated.  Nobody knows how long it takes to process the cases belong to these individuals (whether they are simply unlucky or they are actually worthy of security/fraud concerns).

 

What I am going to say is here are the misconceptions we see here on VJ all the time:

1. File N-400 as soon as you can to speed up your I-751 adjudication.  This is NOT always true.  In some cases, it does, and some cases, it does not.  See above.

2. File N-400 while I-751 will delay your I-751 adjudication.  This is NOT always true either.  In some cases, it does, and some cases, it does not.  See above.

3. File N-400 will force the Service Center to adjudicate my pending I-751.  This is PLAIN WRONG.  USCIS does not care if you file N-400.  To some people, it does happen that way, and that is just pure luck.  Like their file is literally on someone's desk to be approved, as they file for N-400.

 

I am not an immigration lawyer (but I know many); I also don't work for USCIS (but I know a few who does).  I am just a VJ member who also has a pending I-751 filed in March 2018.  I understand the system pretty darn well by studying the manuals and asking questions from the people who actually work the system.  I try my best to be a contributing member of VJ by helping people understand the system and don't believe any misconception of how USCIS works.  Assuming that USCIS follows the logic is correct, but assuming that a result will also be logical and chronological is incorrect.  Processing immigration petition is not a straight pipe where it goes in one way and out another way.  It is very inefficient and bureaucratic.  I am cynical at times you will see on here, just to blow off steam of frustration I too have with USCIS.

 

Edited February 24, 2019 by GBOS

[EmilyRosePF 34]

@GBOS Just want to say how much I appreciate all the information you provide!

 

I'm also curious where you think the Minneapolis-St Paul field office sits in terms of workload? Currently it's sitting at 16-25 months (one of the reasons my wife didn't file her N-400 with the pending I-751). 

[GBOS 198]

Just now, EmilyRosePF said:

@GBOS Just want to say how much I appreciate all the information you provide!

 

I'm also curious where you think the Minneapolis-St Paul field office sits in terms of workload? Currently it's sitting at 16-25 months (one of the reasons my wife didn't file her N-400 with the pending I-751). 

@EmilyRosePF - One of my friends who recently filed for N400 in MSP told me that he was told that most offices go faster than what is posted on USCIS website when it comes to N-400 processing time.  I will not pretend to know exactly, or I would be misleading.  What I can tell you with facts are:

 

1. Houston, TX shows 17 months on the low end, and my Thai friend got naturalized exactly at 17.5 months in December 2018.  She filed her N400 in mid 2017.

2. Baltimore, MD shows 13 months on the low end, and my other Thai friend just received her interview notice for March 2019, which is roughly 13 months from when she filed early in 2018.  (Note: that naturalization ceremony would then be at least a few weeks after that at the earliest.)

 

So if we are to based on these two facts I know, it would seem that the posted processing times are quite accurate.  But looking at other posts on here, many cases appear to go faster than the posted processing time.

 

If you ask me, personally, I would wait until your I-751 is approved before filing for your N-400.  My educated guess is 14-15 months is where Vermont stands right now.

Again, this is my personal opinion.  You need to do what is best for you and your wife.

[Cross32 21]

1 hour ago, GBOS said:

@EmilyRosePF - One of my friends who recently filed for N400 in MSP told me that he was told that most offices go faster than what is posted on USCIS website when it comes to N-400 processing time.  I will not pretend to know exactly, or I would be misleading.  What I can tell you with facts are:

 

1. Houston, TX shows 17 months on the low end, and my Thai friend got naturalized exactly at 17.5 months in December 2018.  She filed her N400 in mid 2017.

2. Baltimore, MD shows 13 months on the low end, and my other Thai friend just received her interview notice for March 2019, which is roughly 13 months from when she filed early in 2018.  (Note: that naturalization ceremony would then be at least a few weeks after that at the earliest.)

 

So if we are to based on these two facts I know, it would seem that the posted processing times are quite accurate.  But looking at other posts on here, many cases appear to go faster than the posted processing time.

 

If you ask me, personally, I would wait until your I-751 is approved before filing for your N-400.  My educated guess is 14-15 months is where Vermont stands right now.

Again, this is my personal opinion.  You need to do what is best for you and your wife.

Thanks 🙏🏽 

 

am waiting for for my i751 approval first before I go for n400. 

 

 

[Alialina 6]

4 hours ago, SSKK said:

https://myaccount.uscis.dhs.gov/ I believe this is what everyone else uses as well. Create your own account and register your receipt number on the latest letter you have received so far ( i.e. the 18 month extension) 

 

USCIS "Check Case Status" shows something like they cannot provide any information. When I called customer service and dial in my receipt number, it says they cannot find my information. I have the same issue. When I talked the tier 1 and provided the numbers, they pulled out my info so I think it's still there. It's been this way from the beginning for me.  Some people say it's the "Glitch", but cannot be so sure. None of us works at USCIS. 

 

 

That is exactly what I did too. I called and they were able to find my case and called it a glitch.

Thank you for the info. I will create an account

[Cosmos22 51]

On 2/23/2019 at 7:37 PM, ALIENRJ187 said:

Did you or Cosmos22 ever file taxes as married filing separately?  I've heard that can cause a trigger for RFEs.  Then again the way things are going with the RFEs is almost random.  Maybe due to all the shuffling around of files to other service centers.

We filed our 2015 taxes married filing separately since my husband was still living and working in Canada at the time while we were waiting our approval. Then when he moved here in 2016 we have filed jointly ever since. We did supply them 2015-2017 tax transcripts. 

[Fr8dog 312]

Got the transfer notice in the mail yesterday. I'm back at Texas service center (where my I-129 was for 15 months). We'll see what happens next.

 

[GBOS 198]

14 minutes ago, Fr8dog said:

Got the transfer notice in the mail yesterday. I'm back at Texas service center (where my I-129 was for 15 months). We'll see what happens next.

 

@Fr8dog - Texas, unlike Nebraska, has shown a steady, but slow, flow of approval on files that got transferred there.  There is a sliver lining.

[starsky 99]

22 hours ago, PerditaD said:

@aka586 I meant no disrespect or anything like that. I was just trying to see if there is anything else we can do to make the table more accurate. 

I think it's a valid and reasonable suggestion, although I think that the other concern is also valid, in that, many folks don't come here unless they actually have updates to share. We're assuming a lot of things here, which does make the tracking table hit and miss. I try hard to keep it accurate and frequently add changes I pick up from those who communicate here in the thread. I personally use it as a guiding stick for when action is coming down the pipeline so that people can prepare and be more diligent than normal. It's open for interpretation on how others use it. In an ideal world, everyone would participate at all times, but that's just not realistic, so it definitely comes with an advisory notice.

 

19 hours ago, EmilyRosePF said:

@GBOS Just want to say how much I appreciate all the information you provide!

 

I echo this! Thank you @GBOS for all that you contribute here. I am a Houston filer and elected to wait on my N-400 for the reason you described in Scenario #1.