Democrats melt down over Nunes memo and enter the Upside Down

[jg121783 3,921]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/kass/ct-met-republican-memo-kass-0204-story.html

 

This is just the tip of the iceberg.

Edited February 3, 2018 by jg121783

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

Great stranger things reference 

[bcking 3,157]

But what is the upside down really? Do we even know?!? (I love that show)

 

"What would be best is if we could all read the FBI’s FISA application used against Trump, which Republicans allege was based on opposition research done for the Hillary Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee.

If this is, in fact, true, then it is an outrage and an assault on our freedom. If it is not, we best know it quickly."

 

Couldn't agree more with that. I've read the memo. I don't really care to read the opinion of someone who has a fairly obvious slant. Nunes has already proven in the past that he is willing to bend over for Trump. I'd rather go to the source material itself. They say that the dossier was a "major" part of the application (it doesn't use the word major, but I'm paraphrasing). I'm not going to just take that at face value and assume it's true. We can assume it was at least part of the application, but I'd need to know more/see more to really judge whether it was a "major" part. The memo doesn't actually give us any evidence. We are expected to just believe it.

 

I know it would never happen but I'd also love to hear from the actual Judge or whoever approved the application. The memo tries to imply that knowing the biases of Steele, and the origins of the dossier, would have changed the outcome of the application. That's speculation unless it comes from someone who actually had a say in the matter. The memo doesn't explain "typical practice" for these applications, so we as the lay public don't know if these Judges are used to evidence being presented without a detailed account of the source. That may be the "standard practice" due to concerns over protecting sources.

Edited February 3, 2018 by bcking

[-Trinity- 513]

I think it's stupid that we have to wait a whole entire year for a new season.

Edited February 3, 2018 by -Trinity-

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

9 hours ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

Great stranger things reference 

Love that show.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

1 hour ago, IDWAF said:

Love that show.

Awesome show 

[Boiler 46,070]

Tgis says it all, all you need to know.

 

What if it came out that a Republican-funded opposition research dossier against presidential candidate Barack Obama was used to obtain a secret FISA warrant to put Obama’s aides under surveillance and take him down?

 

And what if the federal judge who granted the warrant wasn’t told that the partisan oppo-research was the basis of the surveillance warrant?

Or, what if senior FBI officials running the investigation of Obama had expressed loathing for the candidate and his voters?

What would the Democratic Media Complex be doing?

 

[jg121783 3,921]

6 hours ago, Boiler said:

Tgis says it all, all you need to know.

 

What if it came out that a Republican-funded opposition research dossier against presidential candidate Barack Obama was used to obtain a secret FISA warrant to put Obama’s aides under surveillance and take him down?

 

And what if the federal judge who granted the warrant wasn’t told that the partisan oppo-research was the basis of the surveillance warrant?

Or, what if senior FBI officials running the investigation of Obama had expressed loathing for the candidate and his voters?

What would the Democratic Media Complex be doing?

 

Well since you put it that way. Something needs to be done about the racist FISA court.

[bcking 3,157]

8 hours ago, Boiler said:

Tgis says it all, all you need to know.

 

What if it came out that a Republican-funded opposition research dossier against presidential candidate Barack Obama was used to obtain a secret FISA warrant to put Obama’s aides under surveillance and take him down?

 

And what if the federal judge who granted the warrant wasn’t told that the partisan oppo-research was the basis of the surveillance warrant?

Or, what if senior FBI officials running the investigation of Obama had expressed loathing for the candidate and his voters?

What would the Democratic Media Complex be doing?

 

The partisan opposition research was PART of the warrant application.

 

The only information we have claiming it formed the basis of the entire application is this memo written by Nunes' team. 

 

Hardly a reliable source to speak honestly about the situation.

 

What if federal judges who issue FISA warrants are never told details about a source, as standard practice? It wouldn't be unreasonable for a secret court dealing with intelligence agencies. Sources are frequently kept on a very need to know basis. 

[jg121783 3,921]

1 hour ago, bcking said:

The partisan opposition research was PART of the warrant application.

 

The only information we have claiming it formed the basis of the entire application is this memo written by Nunes' team. 

 

Hardly a reliable source to speak honestly about the situation.

 

What if federal judges who issue FISA warrants are never told details about a source, as standard practice? It wouldn't be unreasonable for a secret court dealing with intelligence agencies. Sources are frequently kept on a very need to know basis. 

You would think a judge that deals with classified warrants on a regular basis could be trusted with that information and would need to know in order to make a proper decision in accordance with the law. When requesting a warrant to listen to someone's phone conversations, FISA court or not, probable cause must be demonstrated under the law.

[bcking 3,157]

8 minutes ago, jg121783 said:

You would think a judge that deals with classified warrants on a regular basis could be trusted with that information and would need to know in order to make a proper decision in accordance with the law. When requesting a warrant to listen to someone's phone conversations, FISA court or not, probable cause must be demonstrated under the law.

Neither one of us know standard procedure for a FISA court. I agree with you it would make sense, but it still may not be standard procedure when dealing with high level cases involving national security. The memo doesn't state that they deviated from a standard protocol.

 

Probable cause can also come from very sketchy sources. There was a good article I linked here or in the other memo thread from a prosecutor about that. Many warrants are obtained with evidence that comes from a "sketchy source" (drug addicts witnessing a murder for example). While the source is important to consider, it doesn't mean you automatically throw the evidence out. Especially if some of it can be corroborated with other information.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

The only people I see melting down are the Trump lovers and Republicans. They won the election, control all three branches of the government, yet they whine and cry and blame everyone for their incompetency. 

[Boiler 46,070]

12 minutes ago, spookyturtle said:

The only people I see melting down are the Trump lovers and Republicans. They won the election, control all three branches of the government, yet they whine and cry and blame everyone for their incompetency. 

Is this on Twitter?

[Neonred 3,646]

The FBI used a document commissioned by one presidential campaign as a justification to spy on another.  Maybe it was the basis for the warrent or maybe it was only used in part.  Either way, if the FBI had to use it in its application, it means it didn’t have enough other evidence to justify surveillance.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

13 minutes ago, spookyturtle said:

The only people I see melting down are the Trump lovers and Republicans. They won the election, control all three branches of the government, yet they whine and cry and blame everyone for their incompetency. 

So what's so wrong right now. That's right , nothing. Country is in the best shape in decades 

 

Sorry if we think it's a big deal that the FBI became politicized and actively worked against the free and Democratic process of our cornerstone of freedom,  while spying on political candidates,  while  pushing a very fake Russian narrative.  Stalin would be proud, and those that dismiss it for partisan reasons should hang your collective heads.