Plain Curiousity

[Andrea&Henry 311]

In my case, when we filed for AoS back then, it was almost the same situation except we didn’t have kids. 

 

We sent pictures of our marriage, honey moon, and he added me to his health insurance. We filed aos in july 2012 so we were not married for tax season of that year. 

 

We sent so little proof and not only I was approved with no rfe, I was able to have my interview waved.

 

For removal of conditions we sent a copy of our son’s birth certificate, joint taxes, a few utility bills under both names, and joint car and health insurance.

 

As the IO told me during my citizenship interview:

me: “do I still need to show proof of the genuinity of my marriage”.

IO: “mam, you have children together, there is nothing you need proof here” insert laughing at the end.

 

So basically she let me know that having kids together, is a solid proof for the USCiS 

Edited February 1, 2018 by Andrea&Henry

[Crazy Cat 41,894]

Having children together is NOT proof of a legit marriage.......I can point you to numerous attorneys who will tell you that.  It may be one piece of a totality of evidence, but it is NOT solid proof of a marriage.

[Andrea&Henry 311]

11 minutes ago, missileman said:

Having children together is NOT proof of a legit marriage.......I can point you to numerous attorneys who will tell you that.  It may be one piece of a totality of evidence, but it is NOT solid proof of a marriage.

So sharing a checking account and a few utility bills is better proof of the genuinity of a marriage than creating not 1 but 2 human beings with your significant other? Sure! 

 

I’m NOT saying it should be the only thing to show, but having 2 kids together is one strong bond/ proof.

 

Is extremely unlikely( not impossible for sure), but is extremely unlikely that you will have a child let alone 2 with someone who is helping you to get your green card (assuming the relationship is not genuine for example).

 

I live in south florida so I’ve seen many cases of people getting married for immigration purposes only, were the 2 had an agreement. These “couples” get joint bank accounts, move together as roomates, share bills, addresses but they are not a couple. And I have never see a case where they have children.

 

and honestly, I trust more in the judgment of an USCIS IO than “lawyers”. In 7 years that I’ve been part of Visajourney, I’ve seen how “helpful” lawyers can be.

Edited February 1, 2018 by Andrea&Henry

[Crazy Cat 41,894]

1 hour ago, Andrea&Henry said:

I trust more in the judgment of an USCIS IO than “lawyers”.

You are entitled to your opinion.....and maybe you should reread my post that you quoted.....

Edited February 1, 2018 by missileman

[AshMarty 360]

Do you drive. Do you have each other covered on your car insurance plan? Our insurance cards state each of us as drivers on each of our cars.

 

I feel like there are so many things that become combined without even noticing after marriage. Even our Vet now has my husband as  co-owner of "my" now "our" dog.  Our gym contract has a "spouse" discount and a single billing account. Cell phone plans? There has to be something to provide you guys are co-mingled. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 1, 2018 by AshMarty

[Andrea&Henry 311]

7 minutes ago, missileman said:

You are entitled to your opinion.....and maybe you should reread my post that you quoted.....

I invite you to read mind as well

[Orangesapples 1,954]

1 hour ago, missileman said:

Having children together is NOT proof of a legit marriage.......I can point you to numerous attorneys who will tell you that.  It may be one piece of a totality of evidence, but it is NOT solid proof of a marriage.

Apparently the person approving cases said it was. And in reality, it is. Some people might have children only for immigration reasons but it's pretty rare. Having children and taking care of them together is the strongest evidence there is. 

[Crazy Cat 41,894]

3 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Having children and taking care of them together is the strongest evidence there is. 

Nope.  I disagree.....and so do a host of immigration attorneys....it is piece of evidence, but not the strongest.

Edited February 1, 2018 by missileman

[Andrea&Henry 311]

12 minutes ago, missileman said:

Nope.  I disagree.....and so do a host of immigration attorneys....it is piece of evidence, but not the strongest.

you are entitle to your opinion

 

14 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Apparently the person approving cases said it was. And in reality, it is. Some people might have children only for immigration reasons but it's pretty rare. Having children and taking care of them together is the strongest evidence there is. 

 

The IO Who interviewed me was a tier 2 supervisor or something like that. She was probably in her early 60’s and trying to make friendly conversation with her, I asked for how long has she been working/doing this....he replied:” dear, wayyyyy before you were even born”. I’m 32 years old. So yes, the person who actually approve citizenship cases for more than 30 years, I think she must know a thing or 2. And yes, it shouldn’t be the only evidence to show, but definitely having children, especially more than 1, is proof of a genuine and solid commitment (even if the marriage doesn’t last, at least you know, it started as a genuine thing)

 

I think you need to be a parent to understand the level of commitment you have when you make a child with another person (commitment in terms of finances, general responsibilities, doctors appointment, health insurances, provide food and shelter and by the simple fact you are bound to the other person for life).

 

So making 2 human beings with the same person tells you more than 2 people sharing a roof, bills and a joint bank account

 

 

Edited February 1, 2018 by Andrea&Henry

[geowrian 22,337]

Nobody is understating the level of commitment necessary to raise 2 children. At the same time, the commitment is to the children, not their other biological parent. The IO needs to determine that the marriage is bona fide, not the children.

 

Having children isn’t evidence of a bona fide marriage. Taking care of the children together can be...just like merely having a joint account is meaningless unless you actually use it together.

[Umka36 781]

What about couples that don't/can't have kids? Having kids does not make a couple genuine, heck they can often break up marriages.

 

I agree with missileman in that it's just a piece of the whole picture, and we have two children. To me it's not our children that makes us legit, but our commitment/support for each other raising our kids especially when one of our son is autistic.

[Orangesapples 1,954]

53 minutes ago, missileman said:

Nope.  I disagree.....and so do a host of immigration attorneys....it is piece of evidence, but not the strongest.

Immigration officers whose job is to approve cases know more than immigration attorneys. 

 

4 minutes ago, Umka36 said:

What about couples that don't/can't have kids? Having kids does not make a couple genuine, heck they can often break up marriages.

What about them? Nobody is saying that only couples who have kids are genuine couples. But fake couples having two kids - that's extremely rare. And yes, children can be hard on a marriage - but it was still a real marriage to begin with which is what matters to immigration. 

 

12 minutes ago, geowrian said:

Nobody is understating the level of commitment necessary to raise 2 children. At the same time, the commitment is to the children, not their other biological parent. The IO needs to determine that the marriage is bona fide, not the children.

 

Having children isn’t evidence of a bona fide marriage. Taking care of the children together can be...just like merely having a joint account is meaningless unless you actually use it together.

Having a child with someone ties you to that person for life or at least until the child is 18. 

[Crazy Cat 41,894]

5 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Immigration officers whose job is to approve cases know more than immigration attorneys. 

The officer in that case made the decision based on more than a single piece of evidence.  They had joint bank accounts, etc. 

 

5 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Having a child with someone ties you to that person for life or at least until the child is 18. 

Totally false.......and it doesn't provide proof of a legit marriage.

Edited February 1, 2018 by missileman

[geowrian 22,337]

14 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Having a child with someone ties you to that person for life or at least until the child is 18. 

There’s plenty of cases where it has not tied somebody to the other individual...including a number of cases here on VJ. There’s a heck of a lot of single parents that do miraculous jobs out there.

 

Edit This is  anyway. I think the point has been made and I suggest moving along before a mod intervenes. Let’s get  to help the OP.

Edited February 1, 2018 by geowrian

[Umka36 781]

2 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Immigration officers whose job is to approve cases know more than immigration attorneys. 

 

What about them? Nobody is saying that only couples who have kids are genuine couples. But fake couples having two kids - that's extremely rare. And yes, children can be hard on a marriage - but it was still a real marriage to begin with which is what matters to immigration. 

 

Having a child with someone ties you to that person for life or at least until the child is 18. 

We'll have to agree to disagree. I've learned that people will do crazy things for immigration purpose including having children. I'd be interest to hear if anyone has only ever submitted their children's BC as proof.

 

OP, you can only provide what you can. Part of my wife's package did include one of our son's BC (only one was born at the time), photo's of trips together, and a host of other items to include financials/medical/insurance/etc.