Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born: Study

[spookyturtle 9,466]

2 minutes ago, Póg mo said:

Nobody can argue with getting tough with MS-13,  however I am not sure that I am down with sending gang members directly back to their home country is always a good idea. Especially if said home country is all struggling to overcome the aftermath of a civil war, because doing so may just create more problems not just for the home country, but the United States, in the form of increased numbers of people fleeing a deteriorating home country.

If they've committed crimes here, put them in prison and then deport them when they complete their sentences. What do you propose doing with them if we don't deport them?

[Boiler 45,670]

1 hour ago, bcking said:

Please elaborate.

 

I used the statistics presented in the original article cited, and applied it to the Arizona State population and Arizona State prison population.

 

Where in my math is the problem? I guess in retrospect I should have said convicted not committed. Maybe some committed murder but weren't caught.

Love it when people ask a question and then answer it.

[Boiler 45,670]

43 minutes ago, spookyturtle said:

If they've committed crimes here, put them in prison and then deport them when they complete their sentences. What do you propose doing with them if we don't deport them?

Give them US Citizenship?

 

Only option left.

[Póg mo 1,749]

1 hour ago, spookyturtle said:

If they've committed crimes here, put them in prison and then deport them when they complete their sentences. What do you propose doing with them if we don't deport them?

Parole here with strict conditions, and provide training to those who want it. Sending too many back, may not be a cost effective long term solution, especially if doing so causes increased illegal immigration. Also, seeing as the United States is in some ways responsible for the feeding more than a couple of civil wars in South America, I do believe it should probably try and do something to make amends, and perhaps future US governments might think twice about interfering in other countries affairs. 

 

[Boiler 45,670]

1 minute ago, Póg mo said:

Parole here with strict conditions, and provide training to those who want it. Sending too many back, may not be a cost effective long term solution, especially if doing so causes increased illegal immigration. Also, seeing as the United States is in some ways responsible for the feeding more than a couple of civil wars in South America, I do believe it should probably try and do something to make amends, and perhaps future US governments might think twice about interfering in other countries affairs. 

 

So get me right, commit a crime whilst here illegally, claim gang membership and you get a legal status, well sort of.

 

Come here and overstay your visa, get caught, do not commit a crime, do not belong to a gang and get deported.

 

MDL thinking in spades.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

10 minutes ago, Póg mo said:

Parole here with strict conditions, and provide training to those who want it. Sending too many back, may not be a cost effective long term solution, especially if doing so causes increased illegal immigration. Also, seeing as the United States is in some ways responsible for the feeding more than a couple of civil wars in South America, I do believe it should probably try and do something to make amends, and perhaps future US governments might think twice about interfering in other countries affairs. 

 

There are a lot of people here illegally who have not committed crimes while here. Personally I would rather something along the lines of DACA than trying to rehabilitate illegals who are criminals and members of one of the most ruthless gangs on the planet. We have enough problems with our own criminals and prison system. Giving preference to MS-13 doesn't make sense to me.

 

[bcking 3,157]

56 minutes ago, Boiler said:

Love it when people ask a question and then answer it.

Specifically the "convicted" versus "committed" part? That's splitting hairs a bit.

 

How many illegal immigrants do you suspect have killed someone and haven't been convicted? I highly doubt that would change the number very much. Double the number, you get 1% of illegal immigrants that are murderers. The overall number I provided would then be 97.6% instead of 98.6%, or something like that.

 

No matter what, it's still a tiny number. Admittedly a larger percentage compared to USC, but in overall numbers we are dealing with small groups in either population.

Edited January 29, 2018 by bcking

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

5 hours ago, Póg mo said:

Parole here with strict conditions, and provide training to those who want it. Sending too many back, may not be a cost effective long term solution, especially if doing so causes increased illegal immigration. Also, seeing as the United States is in some ways responsible for the feeding more than a couple of civil wars in South America, I do believe it should probably try and do something to make amends, and perhaps future US governments might think twice about interfering in other countries affairs. 

 

Parole illegal aliens, who happen to be members in perhaps the worst gang in the world?  Train them?  Ummm, no thank you.  Let their home country deal with them.  We have enough prisoners in the US without them.

[Boiler 45,670]

5 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

Parole illegal aliens, who happen to be members in perhaps the worst gang in the world?  Train them?  Ummm, no thank you.  Let their home country deal with them.  We have enough prisoners in the US without them.

Sometimes you think you have seen it all, and then your jaw drops.

[Póg mo 1,749]

48 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

Parole illegal aliens, who happen to be members in perhaps the worst gang in the world?  Train them?  Ummm, no thank you.  Let their home country deal with them.  We have enough prisoners in the US without them.

I suggested training them because I thought rather than abandoning them in a country they know little about, we could for once try to break the circle of violence, and give them the chance to be productive members of society, and not just victims of an inhumane system, that looks at criminal justice as a kind of game of wack a mole. 

 

 

[Boiler 45,670]

22 minutes ago, Póg mo said:

I suggested training them because I thought rather than abandoning them in a country they know little about, we could for once try to break the circle of violence, and give them the chance to be productive members of society, and not just victims of an inhumane system, that looks at criminal justice as a kind of game of wack a mole. 

 

 

[jg121783 3,918]

7 hours ago, Póg mo said:

Parole here with strict conditions, and provide training to those who want it. Sending too many back, may not be a cost effective long term solution, especially if doing so causes increased illegal immigration. Also, seeing as the United States is in some ways responsible for the feeding more than a couple of civil wars in South America, I do believe it should probably try and do something to make amends, and perhaps future US governments might think twice about interfering in other countries affairs. 

 

I'm in favor of prison time equal to what a US citizen gets for the same crime then deportation. If they come back they get more prison time (for breaking immigration laws) then deportation again. I can be reasonable on the whole DACA situation but there are no circumstances under which I would go along with giving any sort of legal status to criminals. 

 

1 hour ago, Póg mo said:

I suggested training them because I thought rather than abandoning them in a country they know little about, we could for once try to break the circle of violence, and give them the chance to be productive members of society, and not just victims of an inhumane system, that looks at criminal justice as a kind of game of wack a mole. 

 

 

So MS13 members are victims? Now I have heard it all.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

2 hours ago, Póg mo said:

I suggested training them because I thought rather than abandoning them in a country they know little about, we could for once try to break the circle of violence, and give them the chance to be productive members of society, and not just victims of an inhumane system, that looks at criminal justice as a kind of game of wack a mole. 

 

 

A country they know little about?  The majority came from El Salvador as adults.  These are MS-13 murderers and rapists we are talking about here, not innocent DACAs.  They know their country very well.  And they know their gang’s motto very well, also.  “Kill, Steal, Rape Control”

 

If you haven’t heard much about them based on where you live, you might want to read up a bit.  These are NOT your garden variety “teens gone wrong” in your local neighborhood.