President Announces Moving Embassy to Jerusalem

[-Trinity- 513]

Btw, if the meaning of the UN and it's members is insignificant why the threaths to cut of financial aid to those who vote against? And who are those countries that rely on US financial aid? The Netherlands voted against, I can't imagine them depending on US money. Italy is a different story, they depend on the EU money 

 

I guess America can go ahead and do as it wishes. What happens if they move their embassy to Jerusalem?

Edited December 21, 2017 by Beachlover

[Boiler 45,662]

44 minutes ago, bcking said:

West Germany had the good sense not to insist their capital was Berlin during a period of political and military tension where two groups claimed control over the city. We'll never know what America would have done if West Germany lacked that good sense and insisted on keeping Berlin as their capitol. With the USSR as an opponent I doubt we would have been so "brave" as we are acting now. It's easy to be the bully when you don't have anyone standing up to you.

Not sure if History or Geography is your weakness.

 

East Berlin was the de facto capital of East Germany

 

This map may help:

 

 

 

 

[bcking 3,157]

1 minute ago, Boiler said:

Not sure if History or Geography is your weakness.

 

East Berlin was the de facto capital of East Germany

 

This map may help:

 

 

 

 

When did I discuss the capitol of East Germany? We were discussing West Germany.

 

While we are off topic - We didn't recognize Berlin as the capitol if East Germany either. Even when we established diplomatic relations with East Germany we still did not recognize Berlin as their capitol.

 

But do you actually have a comment about West Germany or do you want to remain in a tangent?

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

The U.N. has always been anti semantic.  Nothing new here 

[Ban Hammer 13,403]

17 minutes ago, bcking said:

When did I discuss the capitol of East Germany? We were discussing West Germany.

 

While we are off topic - We didn't recognize Berlin as the capitol if East Germany either. Even when we established diplomatic relations with East Germany we still did not recognize Berlin as their capitol.

 

But do you actually have a comment about West Germany or do you want to remain in a tangent?

the map should bring to mind the issues that would happen for the rest of the west german population if they had to travel to their capital to do something.  they'd have to cross into east german land or airspace to do so.........

[-Trinity- 513]

17 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

The U.N. has always been anti semantic.  Nothing new here 

How so?  Cause I'm pretty sure there are EU countries that are pro Israel. As I said earlier Netherlands, but yet they voted against.

 

But from my understanding the vote doesn't have any meaning, nothing stopping America to move the embassy to Jerusalem.

[Dashinka 24,593]

Just now, Ban Hammer said:

the map should bring to mind the issues that would happen for the rest of the west german population if they had to travel to their capital to do something.  they'd have to cross into east german land or airspace to do so.........

Actually, if memory serves there were several land corridors that were open for travel to West Berlin.  Of course at one point the East Germans and Soviets closed those off and primarily the US conducted the airlift to W. Berlin, but I get your point as to the logistics that would have been involved if W. Germany had made W. Berlin their capitol.

 

Getting back to the OP and the UN vote today, I heard a lot of folks speak about how they were not going to bow to US pressure or blackmail with their vote, but don’t many of them succumb to the PRC blackmail relative to recognition of the ROC?

[Boiler 45,662]

Edited December 21, 2017 by Boiler

[Dashinka 24,593]

1 minute ago, Beachlover said:

How so?  Cause I'm pretty sure there are EU countries that are pro Israel. As I said earlier Netherlands, but yet they voted against.

 

But from my understanding the vote doesn't have any meaning, nothing stopping America to move the embassy to Jerusalem.

That is the great thing about the UN, pretty much everything they do is meaningless.

[bcking 3,157]

11 minutes ago, Ban Hammer said:

the map should bring to mind the issues that would happen for the rest of the west german population if they had to travel to their capital to do something.  they'd have to cross into east german land or airspace to do so.........

I'm well aware of the geographical limitations of making Berlin the capitol. West Germany still had a reasonable, defensible "right" to do so as a soverign country. Just because a soverign country has the "right" doesn't always mean it's in their best interest and a good idea to do so. 

 

They realized it wasn't in their best interest. Let's be honest also that when we say "they" we really mean America at the time. 

 

Israel may have an argument that defends Jerusalem as their capitol, but so does the group arguing for a Palestinian State. Israel's right has it's origins in civil war and aggression. Jerusalem is one of the core problems in peace talks and our recognition basically just claims the issue is solved without it actually be solved.

Edited December 21, 2017 by bcking

[Ban Hammer 13,403]

2 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

Actually, if memory serves there were several land corridors that were open for travel to West Berlin.  Of course at one point the East Germans and Soviets closed those off and primarily the US conducted the airlift to W. Berlin, but I get your point as to the logistics that would have been involved if W. Germany had made W. Berlin their capitol.

 

Getting back to the OP and the UN vote today, I heard a lot of folks speak about how they were not going to bow to US pressure or blackmail with their vote, but don’t many of them succumb to the PRC blackmail relative to recognition of the ROC?

there were - and oh what a great idea with west berlin, put your entire government surrounded by hostiles so they can take out your government in 30 minutes!

[-Trinity- 513]

6 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

That is the great thing about the UN, pretty much everything they do is meaningless.

So, there is nothing to worry about. But why the threaths and to whom? Cause not every UN member depends on US financial aid.

 

 

[Dashinka 24,593]

3 minutes ago, Ban Hammer said:

there were - and oh what a great idea with west berlin, put your entire government surrounded by hostiles so they can take out your government in 30 minutes!

One word, Seoul.  Although not surrounded by the DPRK, the proximity to the DMZ is troubling to some.

[Dashinka 24,593]

3 minutes ago, Beachlover said:

So, there is nothing to worry about. But why the threaths and to whom? Cause not every UN member depends on US financial aid.

 

 

I suppose the threats are more for show etc., as the US makes threats all the time just as other countries do.  I seem to remember President Obama drawing some lines in the sand.  The issue will be if this threat will be followed through on.  Personally, I doubt much will happen, the US will move the embassy to Jerusalem, activists and others will continue to do everything they can to push Israel into the sea, and US foreign aid will continue to flow.

[OriZ 3,157]

1 hour ago, Beachlover said:

Thanks 

 

Yeah, I'm painting as we speak so we can put it on the market somewhere beginning of next year.

What/where are you moving into instead?

 

20 minutes ago, bcking said:

I'm well aware of the geographical limitations of making Berlin the capitol. West Germany still had a reasonable, defensible "right" to do so as a soverign country. Just because a soverign country has the "right" doesn't always mean it's in their best interest and a good idea to do so. 

 

They realized it wasn't in their best interest. Let's be honest also that when we say "they" we really mean America at the time. 

 

Israel may have an argument that defends Jerusalem as their capitol, but so does the group arguing for a Palestinian State. Israel's right has it's origins in civil war and aggression. Jerusalem is one of the core problems in peace talks and our recognition basically just claims the issue is solved without it actually be solved.

I'm still not sure what aggression you're referring to lol. Was Israel an aggressor in the Yom Kippur war? I never said Israel was perfect, but most of the time it acted in self defense, and even situations like the Six Day war happened because it had to strike first. There was aggression against Israel before there was even an Israel, and pogroms against the Jewish population by the Arabs living in Palestine. But we've got dozens of threads(I believe most if not all are before your time here) on these events and all the wars in here already so I really don't wanna get dragged into a discussion about it again. Regarding Trump's recognition it has nothing to do with declaring the issue is solved, all it is is admitting reality on the ground. Peace talks, believe it or not can happen even with Israel's capital being Jerusalem. Because in NO future agreement, will Jerusalem cease to be Israel's capital(even if it is the capital of both states).

 

13 minutes ago, Beachlover said:

So, there is nothing to worry about. But why the threaths and to whom? Cause not every UN member depends on US financial aid.

 

 

Because it's becoming absurd. And because the US sees it as a slap in the face by countries it helps all the time.