Citizenship by Fraud / False Marriage

[little immigrant 800]

So person A admitted to your cousin that his previous marriage was fraud? During a) getting the green card b) removing conditions c) receiving citizenship he had to provide evidence that his marriage was bona-fide. How did he do that?

[deepfineleg 13]

2 minutes ago, adil-rafa said:

ok, to answer your quesiton, she is legally obligated 

You are not an accomplice or co-conspirator unless you knew about the fraud for a while and did nothing to stop it or if you participated in the fraud 

anytime you know of a person committing a crime even if you don't have proof, you are legally obligated to report it / ICE is respondsible for investaging / if ICE does nothing,  she is clear and can not be held responsible for not reporting it 

I called a family member and asked as the person is FBI (not ICE but the Federal laws are the same for any fraud crime)

i didn't think you needed me to go on about this as many others had already answered

I appreciate you making the call to provide clarity in response. I will advise my cousin to report as such.

[Jeanne Adil 1,651]

she can herself call (without giving a name) and ask or you can for her

sometimes it is not as important to them as the illegals and ICE does nothing

stay safe

[deepfineleg 13]

2 minutes ago, Andrina said:

So person A admitted to your cousin that his previous marriage was fraud? During a) getting the green card b) removing conditions c) receiving citizenship he had to provide evidence that his marriage was bona-fide. How did he do that?

 

He appeared to have married someone in extended family in America. The woman potentially was compensated to stay the course.... I believe, about 5-years or so.

[deepfineleg 13]

1 minute ago, adil-rafa said:

she can herself call (without giving a name) and ask or you can for her

sometimes it is not as important to them as the illegals and ICE does nothing

stay safe

 

I will make the call if she does not. It is not fair to thousand who prescribe to legal route. 

[Jeanne Adil 1,651]

right, it is not right to those of us who go the legal route and this man did originally 

this is probably why ICE does't investigate or go after them

so, reporting it is saving her a lot of anguish 

Homeland Security has a lot more to worry about now than a failed marriage 

 

[deepfineleg 13]

13 minutes ago, adil-rafa said:

right, it is not right to those of us who go the legal route and this man did originally 

this is probably why ICE does't investigate or go after them

so, reporting it is saving her a lot of anguish 

Homeland Security has a lot more to worry about now than a failed marriage 

 

It is actually sad and frustrating to know that ICE wouldn't prioritize to investigate even with reporting of such fraud.

[acidrain 325]

36 minutes ago, deepfineleg said:

It is actually sad and frustrating to know that ICE wouldn't prioritize to investigate even with reporting of such fraud.

I think it might depend on how it gets reported and the evidence ICE is able to formulate. For instance if it's from a disgruntled ex then sorting through the seedy details will be more difficult. But since it is coming from an extremely credible source I find it hard to believe they would pass over an investigation.

 

If one can't prove the fraud occurred then it might not go anywhere. However, I saw one case in the news where the couple never lived together and could not provide proof they ever did. They both got charged despite the fact the two were very good friends.

 

The importance is to provide as much detail as possible in case they need to request specific information.

[Enigma11561 336]

You are not an accomplice or co-conspirator unless you knew about the fraud for a while and did nothing to stop it or if you participated in the fraud http://www.mercercountysheriff.org/Images/identitytheft/article5.pdf

The above quote deals with identity fraud not immigration. Having said that and ASSUMING this law can also be used in the context we are discussing..1. Your cousin did not participate in the fraud and 2. was made aware of the fraud after it occurred ( some 5 years later) and could not have possible stopped it. So it does not apply. My concerns are that this man AND the woman he married both committed immigration fraud. He paid her to get a green card and then citizenship. Very illegal. Why your cousin wants to marry such a person is only something she can answer. She has two options. Say nothing as she is not legally obligated ( maybe morally though) to say anything since she has no proof other than his honesty to her. Or call ICE, give them his name and so forth and they will..maybe look into it...then maybe do something about it...and then maybe he could be stripped of his citizenship, deported, and have a lifetime ban. Which means she would have to move and live in his home country for the rest of her life. Remember that ICE would have to look back some 5 years and find concrete proof that the marriage was not bona fide. He said, she said does not count. I do not advocate fraud and what he did was wrong but only her conscience can tell her what to do now.

[deepfineleg 13]

4 hours ago, acidrain said:

I think it might depend on how it gets reported and the evidence ICE is able to formulate. For instance if it's from a disgruntled ex then sorting through the seedy details will be more difficult. But since it is coming from an extremely credible source I find it hard to believe they would pass over an investigation.

 

If one can't prove the fraud occurred then it might not go anywhere. However, I saw one case in the news where the couple never lived together and could not provide proof they ever did. They both got charged despite the fact the two were very good friends.

 

The importance is to provide as much detail as possible in case they need to request specific information.

 

Thanks for reply. In this case, she doesn't have any evidence to provide besides reporting the name. I have advised her as such. If she doesn't, I will certainly report.

[deepfineleg 13]

3 hours ago, Enigma11561 said:

You are not an accomplice or co-conspirator unless you knew about the fraud for a while and did nothing to stop it or if you participated in the fraud http://www.mercercountysheriff.org/Images/identitytheft/article5.pdf

The above quote deals with identity fraud not immigration. Having said that and ASSUMING this law can also be used in the context we are discussing..1. Your cousin did not participate in the fraud and 2. was made aware of the fraud after it occurred ( some 5 years later) and could not have possible stopped it. So it does not apply. My concerns are that this man AND the woman he married both committed immigration fraud. He paid her to get a green card and then citizenship. Very illegal. Why your cousin wants to marry such a person is only something she can answer. She has two options. Say nothing as she is not legally obligated ( maybe morally though) to say anything since she has no proof other than his honesty to her. Or call ICE, give them his name and so forth and they will..maybe look into it...then maybe do something about it...and then maybe he could be stripped of his citizenship, deported, and have a lifetime ban. Which means she would have to move and live in his home country for the rest of her life. Remember that ICE would have to look back some 5 years and find concrete proof that the marriage was not bona fide. He said, she said does not count. I do not advocate fraud and what he did was wrong but only her conscience can tell her what to do now.

 

I appreciate you taking time to respond in detail. I agree with everything you noted.

 

My cousin is convinced that the Person A committed such fraud to escape hardships/atrocities in his home country and she is willing to look other way. Anyways, I have advised to report (morally) with the limited information she has.

 

I'm not certain if my reporting would do anything if my cousin wouldn't report. But I will follow through with the call to ICE/USCIS anyways.

[Enigma11561 336]

I would not do that. It is not your call. It is hers. I can appreciate your trying to do the "right" thing here, but to make that call and say , basically, " he said to her and she said to me" ( and still absolutely no proof of anything) will most likely go no where. Having gone through the immigration process many times, my wife, her son, his wife and daughter, and everyone becoming citizens in the long run, I have little empathy to those who circumvent the process. But I also dislike "snitching". If everyone called ICE on anyone they felt was wrongly admitted they would be getting a thousand calls a day. I might get some push back here from other members but ( BIG BUT ) if this guy truly had severe hardships, and this was an only option, and did it out of severe desperation, and he is a good guy, and all of this is over 5 years old to begin with, maybe, just maybe, this might be a case where leave well enough alone and let ICE concentrate of the bad guys. IMHO.

[maryLu 58]

Before giving advice on who should report who, we need to keep in mind tat there's always two sides to each story! 

[Bahatj 4]

2 hours ago, maryLu said:

Before giving advice on who should report who, we need to keep in mind tat there's always two sides to each story! 

True! Lets see if this deepfineleg person will heed those admonitions to not report and leave it to the discretion of the parties involved. He/She was quick to agree with those who say report but then again, you got to ascertain the story in entirety before arrogating such responsibilities to yourself. IMHO, it's her and only her call to report or not.

Edited December 2, 2017 by Bahatj

[andy78 178]

17 hours ago, deepfineleg said:

 

I appreciate you taking time to respond in detail. I agree with everything you noted.

 

My cousin is convinced that the Person A committed such fraud to escape hardships/atrocities in his home country and she is willing to look other way. Anyways, I have advised to report (morally) with the limited information she has.

 

I'm not certain if my reporting would do anything if my cousin wouldn't report. But I will follow through with the call to ICE/USCIS anyways.

 

First of all, why report if she is planning to marry the person? Is she trying to sabotage the marriage from the start / stab her future husband in the back?

 

Second, does she have any actual evidence of any kind to support HER CLAIM that the person committed fraud?  If not, then what is there to report?