Open Border Tragedies Caused by Visa Lottery System

[CaliCat 3,957]

11 minutes ago, charmander said:

Actually EU might revoke the VWP first because US still enforces visas to EU members Poland, Bulgaria, Romania, Croatia, and Cyprus.

 

There is no VWP for American citizens coming to Europe. VWP is for certain nationalities coming into the US. 

[Cyberfx1024 7,980]

3 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

 

VWP needs to go away. It's fraud-prone and abused often.

Hey is the sky falling because I am agreeing with you on something?

[CaliCat 3,957]

Just now, cyberfx1024 said:

Hey is the sky falling because I am agreeing with you on something?

 

LOL. I think we agree on a lot of things, and disagree on a whole bunch of other stuff; but if we don't lock horns on the stuff we disagree, how will we know what others are thinking?

 

 

[charmander 692]

8 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

 

There is no VWP for American citizens coming to Europe. VWP is for certain nationalities coming into the US. 

What I meant was enforcing a visa requirement for US passport holders traveling to Europe.

[CaliCat 3,957]

1 minute ago, charmander said:

What I meant was enforcing a visa requirement for US passport holders traveling to Europe.

 

At some point, I think every country will require visas for all visitors. 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

51 minutes ago, cyberfx1024 said:

No, there is not a special type of visa for people from the Philippines. But it is VERY hard for regular people to get a tourist visa from there. 

Thank you 

[charmander 692]

4 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

 

At some point, I think every country will require visas for all visitors. 

Except for countries that heavily rely on international tourism. For instance, I can't imagine Mexico or Caribbean countries start enforcing tourist visas to US  passport holders.

 

[Dashinka 24,830]

1 minute ago, charmander said:

Except for countries that heavily rely on international tourism. For instance, I can't imagine Mexico or Caribbean countries start enforcing tourist visas to US  passport holders.

 

Is each country in the EU going to establish their own rules, or will it be a blanket EU thing?  Dealing with the EU is always difficult since there are sovereign governments of all the individual countries and then there is a big bureaucratic government in Brussels. 

[charmander 692]

6 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

Is each country in the EU going to establish their own rules, or will it be a blanket EU thing?  Dealing with the EU is always difficult since there are sovereign governments of all the individual countries and then there is a big bureaucratic government in Brussels. 

Some countries already applying their own rules. For instance, Turkish passports need Schengen visa, which requires heavy paperwork, consulate visits, etc. but you're just visiting a nearby Greek island during summer months, they relax the visa requirements, much easier paperwork and quick.

 

These types of exceptions are fine for islands, but can't imaging how they would allow own rules unless they go back to the old closed border status.

[bcking 3,157]

24 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

Is each country in the EU going to establish their own rules, or will it be a blanket EU thing?  Dealing with the EU is always difficult since there are sovereign governments of all the individual countries and then there is a big bureaucratic government in Brussels. 

I believe it would be a "blanket EU thing", since I think it would fall under what the EU is supposed to manage (border entry). However, because of the complexities you mention it is unlikely to happen.

 

The EU is in a rather fragile state as it is. If they tried to require all of the member countries to start requiring visas for US tourists to visit their country, I think they would run into trouble. Even if we (USA) are responsible for the skewed double standard.

[N-o-l-a 7,168]

38 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

Is each country in the EU going to establish their own rules, or will it be a blanket EU thing?  Dealing with the EU is always difficult since there are sovereign governments of all the individual countries and then there is a big bureaucratic government in Brussels. 

 

They already have separate Schengen and non-Schengen countries in the EU and those zones do dictate travel requirements differently.  For example, as an American, you can stay I believe 90 days or thereabouts in any combination of the Schengen countries during a 6 month period.  So, you couldn't let's say, spend 90 days in Denmark and then move on to Germany and spend more time.  But, you might have different time limits if you then decided to travel to the UK, a non-Schengen country.

 

I'd hardly call EU governments sovereign at this point since they have limited abilities to enforce their own laws and borders, a critical part of being sovereign.

[bcking 3,157]

17 minutes ago, N-o-l-a said:

 

They already have separate Schengen and non-Schengen countries in the EU and those zones do dictate travel requirements differently.  For example, as an American, you can stay I believe 90 days or thereabouts in any combination of the Schengen countries during a 6 month period.  So, you couldn't let's say, spend 90 days in Denmark and then move on to Germany and spend more time.  But, you might have different time limits if you then decided to travel to the UK, a non-Schengen country.

 

I'd hardly call EU governments sovereign at this point since they have limited abilities to enforce their own laws and borders, a critical part of being sovereign.

The vast majority of the EU is in the Schengen group, especially if you include the 4 countries that aren't technically in the group yet but are working on it. Excluding those you only have the Republic of Ireland and the UK. The UK is working on leaving the whole EU as well speak, so then RI will be left.

So the EU could look to change the rules for the Schengen block as a whole with regards to American visitors and it would apply to essentially all member countries. I just think there are enough countries that wouldn't support it, and enough countries with political groups questioning the value of the EU, that it would be a dicey proposition.

Edited November 15, 2017 by bcking

[Amica Nostra 4,803]

1 hour ago, CaliCat said:

 

There is no VWP for American citizens coming to Europe. VWP is for certain nationalities coming into the US. 

But Americans and Canadians can enter for 90 days without a Visa correct?

[Steeleballz 7,550]

2 hours ago, cyberfx1024 said:

No, there is not a special type of visa for people from the Philippines. But it is VERY hard for regular people to get a tourist visa from there. 

 

   The rate of non compliance with existing US immigration law has been high in the PI. All high risk countries have similar issues with their citizens getting US tourist visas. 

[Steeleballz 7,550]

11 hours ago, Tahoma said:

Am I the only one here who actually knows someone who received their visa through the lottery?

 

My friend is from Poland, is now happily married, has two wonderful children, and works full-time.

 

   I know 2 couples. Met them both through my wife. One couple from Russia who lived in the same town as my wife's parents. They own a construction business in Denver. The other couple are from Poland and both work in the medical field. My wife originally met them through work.