DNC head Tom Perez falsely claims Electoral College 'not a creation of the Constitution'

[jayjayj 571]

Just now, bcking said:

It may not be on an actual daily basis, but there are plenty of statements by Trump on more likely a weekly or twice weekly basis that are easily verified as lies. I believe there are some websites that have kept a tally.

One person's lie may be another person's truth.  You can't possibly assert that a website that claims to be tracking his "lies" isn't biased.

[bcking 3,157]

2 minutes ago, jayjayj said:

One person's lie may be another person's truth.  You can't possibly assert that a website that claims to be tracking his "lies" isn't biased.

If you make a statement about something that can be verified, if your information is wrong, that is a lie.

 

There is such a thing as "truth" in many instances. Not all situations, but we aren't talking about opinions. We are talking about when someone makes a statement as a fact. That can be verified.

 

If he said, for example, that he "Didn't want to invade Iraq" but there is evidence to show that at least at one point he DID want to invade Iraq. That was a lie. There isn't an opinion about that. You can't say you didn't support something when there is verifiable evidence that you DID support it.

 

Now if he said "I don't think I was ever supportive of an invasion" he wouldn't be lying. His statement there is about his own thoughts. He isn't stating for sure either way. However in this particular example he states quite clearly that he did not want to invade Iraq. In reality there is audio recording of him say "Yea, I guess so" when asked if he supported the invasion. While that isn't a strong endorsement, it is still an endorsement.

Edited October 27, 2017 by bcking

[Steeleballz 7,550]

10 hours ago, Bill & Katya said:

Lies once?  You do know this is the DNC head you are talking about?  The DNC and it’s leaders lie consistently especially to their ardent supporters.

  That's an outrageous falsehood.

[Dashinka 24,492]

12 minutes ago, Steeleballz said:

  That's an outrageous falsehood.

What, that Perez lied only once?

[jayjayj 571]

31 minutes ago, Steeleballz said:

  That's an outrageous falsehood.

You have no originality at all.

[jayjayj 571]

36 minutes ago, bcking said:

If you make a statement about something that can be verified, if your information is wrong, that is a lie.

 

There is such a thing as "truth" in many instances. Not all situations, but we aren't talking about opinions. We are talking about when someone makes a statement as a fact. That can be verified.

 

If he said, for example, that he "Didn't want to invade Iraq" but there is evidence to show that at least at one point he DID want to invade Iraq. That was a lie. There isn't an opinion about that. You can't say you didn't support something when there is verifiable evidence that you DID support it.

 

Now if he said "I don't think I was ever supportive of an invasion" he wouldn't be lying. His statement there is about his own thoughts. He isn't stating for sure either way. However in this particular example he states quite clearly that he did not want to invade Iraq. In reality there is audio recording of him say "Yea, I guess so" when asked if he supported the invasion. While that isn't a strong endorsement, it is still an endorsement.

I get all that, common sense.  But again, you cannot assert that any website that was created to track his so called "lies" is not biased - that was my point.

[JimandChristy 1,689]

 

[bcking 3,157]

24 minutes ago, jayjayj said:

I get all that, common sense.  But again, you cannot assert that any website that was created to track his so called "lies" is not biased - that was my point.

Yes. I mean I'd say that there probably isn't a single website out there that reports news that isn't biased in some way.

 

That being said, if they provide evidence for the facts they are claiming, and that evidence is audio recordings or written recordings...it's hard to be biased about that. It is what it is.

[natty bumppo 297]

9 minutes ago, bcking said:

Yes. I mean I'd say that there probably isn't a single website out there that reports news that isn't biased in some way.

 

That being said, if they provide evidence for the facts they are claiming, and that evidence is audio recordings or written recordings...it's hard to be biased about that. It is what it is.

audio and video recordings can now-a-days easily be edited ... and have been ... to promote a desired position.

 

however ... it would be darn near impossible to edit Hillary out of a less than negative stance ... 

[Steeleballz 7,550]

1 hour ago, jayjayj said:

You have no originality at all.

That's an outrageous falsehood.

Edited October 27, 2017 by Steeleballz

[bcking 3,157]

25 minutes ago, natty bumppo said:

audio and video recordings can now-a-days easily be edited ... and have been ... to promote a desired position.

 

however ... it would be darn near impossible to edit Hillary out of a less than negative stance ... 

It's funny, I'd say about the same thing for Trump. It is darn (near) impossible to not view him in a negative stance after the cumulative actions he has made as a Presidential Candidate and as President. He is honestly a disgrace. Even without the Russian investigation he is still a disgrace to our country.

 

Of course that is my opinion. We are trying to speak about facts here. The facts remain he has lied quite frequently. The most frequent of any President? I have no idea. But it comes up quite often.

[jayjayj 571]

6 minutes ago, Steeleballz said:

That's an outrageous falsehood.

[natty bumppo 297]

1 minute ago, bcking said:

It's funny, I'd say about the same thing for Trump. It is darn (near) impossible to not view him in a negative stance after the cumulative actions he has made as a Presidential Candidate and as President. He is honestly a disgrace. Even without the Russian investigation he is still a disgrace to our country.

 

Of course that is my opinion. We are trying to speak about facts here. The facts remain he has lied quite frequently. The most frequent of any President? I have no idea. But it comes up quite often.

 

Speaking (or seeking) facts about DJT on VJ's GD forum ... have you applied for a position on Mueller's team? 

 

 

 

 

 

[bcking 3,157]

5 minutes ago, natty bumppo said:

 

Speaking (or seeking) facts about DJT on VJ's GD forum ... have you applied for a position on Mueller's team? 

 

I'd like to think that people with varying political opinions can generally agree on what was said and what did happen (facts) - Particularly when it occured on camera, on twitter, in an interview etc... Obviously in certain situations even that becomes difficult (Like this issue with Russia, hence a very long investigation). But lets just focus on the obvious and easy stuff. Interviews, speeches, twitter etc... All easily verifiable (even if he deletes some of them after the fact).

 

I'd like to think where we diverge is in whether we think those facts (what was said, what happened, whether Trump or anyone else lied) are important, to what degree and how they cumulative add up to our overall response.

 

I find it hard to believe people can deny that what he says on twitter, in interviews and on camera are often complete lies. He probably even knows he is lying himself in many cases. For example his nonsense about how because the stock market is up, we suddenly have less debt. That is a lie. That isn't an opinion. The stock market has not reduced our national debt. We should all agree that it was a lie. Where we disagree may be in whether we care that he lied about it. I care, you may not. Those are our opinions.

 

It's fine if you don't think they are a big deal. We can disagree on that. That is just our opinion. But if you claim they don't happen, you "away with the fairies" as my wife says.

Edited October 27, 2017 by bcking

[natty bumppo 297]

depending on who edits and how the footage was edited can change a story 180 deg.

yellow journalism 101

 

the media decides if they report and how they report. media doesn't like something .... don't talk about it or start the spin