The Law Is on the N.F.L. Players’ Side

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 hour ago, bcking said:

Employment issues aside...

 

We've ready covered that dumping Coke on someone can be considered battery and I could press charges.

 

So please go ahead and be petty and immature and dump a coke on me. I'll gladly take you to court. I have enough friends who would gladly do it for free. 

Cool story.  Problem is, any judge in his right mind would laugh you out of court.  Stop trying to pretend like it’s cool to disrespect your country/flag/anthem.  Just makes you sound... well, lots of VJ unfriendly words.    Suffice it to say, less than cool.

 

And before you go to sleep all smug, thinking you’d win...  “Usually battery is prosecuted as a crime only in cases involving serious harm to the victim.”

Edited October 27, 2017 by IDWAF

[bcking 3,157]

8 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

Cool story.  Problem is, any judge in his right mind would laugh you out of court.  Stop trying to pretend like it’s cool to disrespect your country/flag/anthem.  Just makes you sound... well, lots of VJ unfriendly words.    Suffice it to say, less than cool.

 

And before you go to sleep all smug, thinking you’d win...  “Usually battery is prosecuted as a crime only in cases involving serious harm to the victim.”

I would disregard. It doesn't matter why you did it. It is still battery. 

 

It is actually a quite simple case. It is unwanted touching via a proxy. Pretty text book case. Harm doesn't need to be physical. The legal definition can include psychological harm which would include being touch in an unwanted way.

 

All this aside,

Stop trying to pretend kneeling for a National Anthem is such a big deal and everyone in the country would be outraged. 

 

These are all pointless arguments but it's still cute to see you respond.

 

I am perfectly content in the way I'm going to bed. Both in my position with you, and NB. 

 

Take care now.

[TBoneTX 46,282]

5 hours ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

collective barging agreement

This sounds like what would occur in the Houston Ship Channel.

Another good, succinct NB coinage.

[jayjayj 571]

4 hours ago, IDWAF said:

Cool story.  Problem is, any judge in his right mind would laugh you out of court.  Stop trying to pretend like it’s cool to disrespect your country/flag/anthem.  Just makes you sound... well, lots of VJ unfriendly words.    Suffice it to say, less than cool.

 

And before you go to sleep all smug, thinking you’d win...  “Usually battery is prosecuted as a crime only in cases involving serious harm to the victim.”

My good friend, who happens to be a high-powered criminal defense attorney, agrees with your post.  

[bcking 3,157]

2 hours ago, jayjayj said:

My good friend, who happens to be a high-powered criminal defense attorney, agrees with your post.  

That question I had already run by two friends who are lawyers.

 

That is what a lot of people like about law. It's open to interpretation and there can be multiple answers depending how who you ask.

[jayjayj 571]

18 minutes ago, bcking said:

That question I had already run by two friends who are lawyers.

 

That is what a lot of people like about law. It's open to interpretation and there can be multiple answers depending how who you ask.

Of course, lawyers get paid to find different interpretations of the law, depending on which side they fall.

 

In any event, someone walking past could easily "trip" and accidentally spill some liquid that might unintentionally fly in the direction of another person.

[bcking 3,157]

16 minutes ago, jayjayj said:

Of course, lawyers get paid to find different interpretations of the law, depending on which side they fall.

 

In any event, someone walking past could easily "trip" and accidentally spill some liquid that might unintentionally fly in the direction of another person.

Yes that could happen. Then we could potentially argue negligence if they didn't take well reasoned steps to avoid the liquid flying onto another person.

 

If there were witnesses they could attest to whether it was truly an accident. Etc...

 

By the textbook it is battery. Then it depends on practically how the lawyers "sell it".

 

Perhaps to help I could go see a psychiatrist and get diagnosed with a psychological condition following the event. Perhaps now I have nightmares of cold liquid flying on my face. Perhaps I get flashbacks of the event... (I'm just having fun at this point)

[bcking 3,157]

7 hours ago, IDWAF said:

Cool story.  Problem is, any judge in his right mind would laugh you out of court.  Stop trying to pretend like it’s cool to disrespect your country/flag/anthem.  Just makes you sound... well, lots of VJ unfriendly words.    Suffice it to say, less than cool.

I focused on the latter part of your post last night. An additional thought -

 

Do you not find it at least a little ironic that you advocate personally disrespecting (dumping a drink on someone is at the very least disrespectful) a fellow Americans citizen for their freedom of expression as it relates to the National Anthem?

 

If you are so pro-America why don't you respect the values we were founded on? It is very unAmerican to disrespect someone just because they choose to express themselves differently. We are supposed to have personal freedoms and yet in this instance you would choose to disrespect a person for using those freedoms. There is nothing that says if an American doesn't show respect to the National Anthem that they are no longer American and no longer can enjoy their unalienable rights. I realize you wouldn't be stopping me, but as I said you would surely be disrespecting me for my freedom of expression. I find that extremely unAmerican, in the traditional sense. Though in today's America I guess it has become commonplace (on both sides of the political spectrum mind you, not just R -> L but also L -> R).

 

 

TL;DR - Your actions towards your fellow citizens speak far louder than your body posture during our National Anthem. If you can to support America you should support American values which include freedom of expression. You should be respectful to your fellow citizens who choose to exercise those freedoms.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

I respected your right to disobey 36 USC p. 301.  Then I showed you the error of your ways. My actions, while you find objectionable and possibly the cause of your new life-long fear of cold sodas, might very well keep your butt out of future trouble.

 

The same way I told the Japanese tourists who were chattering at the Arizona Memorial to stop talking, as requested by the guide as we paused to remember the dead. 

 

When I first said the soda thing, I was mostly joking.  But it's been amusing to keep the dialogue alive for a bit.   But seriously... what would YOU do if you saw someone kneeling in front of you, or turning their back towards the flag, or wearing their hat during the anthem?  What action would you take?

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

2 hours ago, bcking said:

That question I had already run by two friends who are lawyers.

 

That is what a lot of people like about law. It's open to interpretation and there can be multiple answers depending how who you ask.

Wrong 

[Dashinka 24,888]

1 hour ago, jayjayj said:

Of course, lawyers get paid to find different interpretations of the law, depending on which side they fall.

 

In any event, someone walking past could easily "trip" and accidentally spill some liquid that might unintentionally fly in the direction of another person.

Isn’t that what a good lawyer does, tells us that 2 + 2 = 7 when the side that is paying them feels that way?

[bcking 3,157]

1 minute ago, IDWAF said:

I respected your right to disobey 36 USC p. 301.  Then I showed you the error of your ways. My actions, while you find objectionable and possibly the cause of your new life-long fear of cold sodas, might very well keep your butt out of future trouble.

 

The same way I told the Japanese tourists who were chattering at the Arizona Memorial to stop talking, as requested by the guide as we paused to remember the dead. 

 

When I first said the soda thing, I was mostly joking.  But it's been amusing to keep the dialogue alive for a bit.   But seriously... what would YOU do if you saw someone kneeling in front of you, or turning their back towards the flag, or wearing their hat during the anthem?  What action would you take?

I realize you were joking, as was I. I find these discussions entertaining.

 

To me I see a big difference between telling someone politely to stop what they are doing, and something like throwing a drink on them. I would likely do the same with the Japanese tourists, and have done similar things in situations where I believe it is reasonable and respectful to remain silent. I would not dump my drink on them. That level of disrespect goes above what they are showing so I don't think it's justified.

 

To be honest I was thinking about the last time I had the opportunity to sit/stand/kneel for the Anthem. I don't go to sports games very often (...or ever) so I honestly can't remember. I believe I've always stood, but mostly because everyone else does. I don't really see that much value in a "National Anthem". I think you can show respect/loyalty and what have you without standing for a song, and standing for a song doesn't really mean much in the way of respect/loyalty. 

 

So honestly if someone decided to stay seated, or kneel, during the National Anthem I would probably do nothing. I would choose to do what I wanted to do, and let them choose to do what they wanted. They aren't keeping me from doing whatever I feel I should do in order to show respect. If they were doing something disruptive (yelling, laughing, jumping up and down) I would likely tell them to stop.

 

Again, I wouldn't dump a drink on them though. I still think doing something like that to someone freely exercising their rights is far far more unAmerican than kneeling for the National Anthem.

1 minute ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

Wrong 

Good morning, welcome back

 

You're still wrong.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

1 hour ago, bcking said:

I realize you were joking, as was I. I find these discussions entertaining.

 

To me I see a big difference between telling someone politely to stop what they are doing, and something like throwing a drink on them. I would likely do the same with the Japanese tourists, and have done similar things in situations where I believe it is reasonable and respectful to remain silent. I would not dump my drink on them. That level of disrespect goes above what they are showing so I don't think it's justified.

 

To be honest I was thinking about the last time I had the opportunity to sit/stand/kneel for the Anthem. I don't go to sports games very often (...or ever) so I honestly can't remember. I believe I've always stood, but mostly because everyone else does. I don't really see that much value in a "National Anthem". I think you can show respect/loyalty and what have you without standing for a song, and standing for a song doesn't really mean much in the way of respect/loyalty. 

 

So honestly if someone decided to stay seated, or kneel, during the National Anthem I would probably do nothing. I would choose to do what I wanted to do, and let them choose to do what they wanted. They aren't keeping me from doing whatever I feel I should do in order to show respect. If they were doing something disruptive (yelling, laughing, jumping up and down) I would likely tell them to stop.

 

Again, I wouldn't dump a drink on them though. I still think doing something like that to someone freely exercising their rights is far far more unAmerican than kneeling for the National Anthem.

Good morning, welcome back

 

You're still wrong.

You get bad free legal advice 

[bcking 3,157]

2 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

You get bad free legal advice 

You're wrong (This can actually be fun and entertaining, who knew?)

 

And honestly no offense here but I'll trust a personal friend who went to Columbia law over this website for any legal matter. 

[Steeleballz 7,550]

7 hours ago, jayjayj said:

My good friend, who happens to be a high-powered criminal defense attorney, agrees with your post.  

 

   If you forget to mention the premeditated part to your friend, you may want to run it by him again.