Trump vs N.K. Final threat....playing with fire😕

[jayjayj 571]

8 minutes ago, cyberfx1024 said:

We do care about civilians in Japan, SK, and Guam. You forget but we have bases in all three of these locations with American boots on the ground ready to defend the soil that they are standing on, not to mention the family members that accompanied their SO to these places. There is alot at stack right now. I watched/listened to the whole speech that Trump did and honestly it was a good speech I thought. 

 

But honestly how far are you willing to let this go until? Do you want to let it go until he launches a nuclear missile to hit our country or someone else, or just let them cause a massive EMP attack on us? Basically if we keep doing what we have been doing for the last 20 years that will happen. 

I agree.  The appeasement and containment policy of previous administrations has just kicked the issue down the road.  It gets more dangerous with every passing day.

 

I think China could actually resolve the matter, if they had the will and enough motivation.  They could act with a surgical strike on NK leadership, followed by a massive Chinese "peacekeeping" force.  I don't think the NK military would resist Chinese forces, especially after a North Korean leadership decapitation.  Then flood NK with humanitarian aid (food, medical, etc.), but process and send it all through China.  Allow China to occupy and treat NK as a protectorate for a few years, while they work toward reunification with South Korea.  Fund everything with U.N. money that would be otherwise wasted.  

 

It would take time, lots of money, and some loss of life, but it seems like that is the only way this could be resolved without all-out war.  Like I mentioned before, China caused the current problem by entering into the Korean War.  If they had stayed out of it, the war would have been over in a couple years, tens of thousands of U.S. soldiers wouldn't have died, and Korea would be one unified country today.  They need to step up, take responsibility, and deal with the Rocket Man!  

[bcking 3,157]

8 hours ago, cyberfx1024 said:

We do care about civilians in Japan, SK, and Guam. You forget but we have bases in all three of these locations with American boots on the ground ready to defend the soil that they are standing on, not to mention the family members that accompanied their SO to these places. There is alot at stack right now. I watched/listened to the whole speech that Trump did and honestly it was a good speech I thought. 

 

But honestly how far are you willing to let this go until? Do you want to let it go until he launches a nuclear missile to hit our country or someone else, or just let them cause a massive EMP attack on us? Basically if we keep doing what we have been doing for the last 20 years that will happen. 

While yes we have military bases, that is a far cry from having a metropolitan area of 25 million people around 50 miles from the border.

 

I don't think NK has any intention of ever attacking us. They want better weapons as a means of protecting themselves. I think the regime is incredibly paranoid and strongly believes that if they don't employ the "strong man" approach, they will be destroyed. I think in KJU's mind he wants to get to the point where there is "shared mutual destruction" as opposed to "unilateral destruction" in the event of a war (with USA). As it stands now he knows that he can barely a nuisance to us if we go to war (but can do serious damage to our allies). I think that makes him very afraid. He would rather be a position where he could actually threaten us.

 

I'm not saying that taking a military option right now isn't the best decision. It may very well be. Unfortunately I just don't have that much faith in our current Presient to decide on what the best option is as it stands. Last time he bombed someone he couldn't even name the right country.

[bcking 3,157]

7 hours ago, jayjayj said:

I think China could actually resolve the matter, if they had the will and enough motivation.  They could act with a surgical strike on NK leadership, followed by a massive Chinese "peacekeeping" force.  I don't think the NK military would resist Chinese forces, especially after a North Korean leadership decapitation.  Then flood NK with humanitarian aid (food, medical, etc.), but process and send it all through China.  Allow China to occupy and treat NK as a protectorate for a few years, while they work toward reunification with South Korea.  Fund everything with U.N. money that would be otherwise wasted.  

 

It would take time, lots of money, and some loss of life, but it seems like that is the only way this could be resolved without all-out war.  Like I mentioned before, China caused the current problem by entering into the Korean War.  If they had stayed out of it, the war would have been over in a couple years, tens of thousands of U.S. soldiers wouldn't have died, and Korea would be one unified country today.  They need to step up, take responsibility, and deal with the Rocket Man!  

You think too highly of China. They can quote historical texts to argue that the Korean Penisula is there's. You let them move in with a "peacekeeping force" and I doubt they would ever leave.

[jayjayj 571]

1 hour ago, bcking said:

You think too highly of China. They can quote historical texts to argue that the Korean Penisula is there's. You let them move in with a "peacekeeping force" and I doubt they would ever leave.

I couldn't think lower of China, but I can't imagine how this issue could be resolved without their intervention.  The NK army and NK people wouldn't resist a Chinese occupation force.  China could send millions of troops in to NK to keep things calm.

 

I just don't see any other viable options.  Anything else ends with nuclear weapons being detonated on the Korean Peninsula.  

 

I also tend to wonder if South Korea really wants reunification.  Look what happened when East and West Germany merged.  Germany's economy was essentially destroyed for decades.  A merger of North and South Korea would be 100 times worse than that.   

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

On 9/19/2017 at 11:28 AM, Merrytooth said:

lol.. unless USA is prepared to receive refugees from NK..

 

China /  East Asia do not want swarm of NK refugees in their backyard either..

 

So it is better for USA to step back and MYOB

Mind our own business?  Isn't putting NK in their place and demanding denuclearization minding our own business?  Considering that NK is threatening Japan, South Korea and Guam, where we have thousands of our American soldiers stationed to help protect those countries, I think it IS our own business.  And let's not forget that NK has openly threatened to use nukes against the US.  

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

2 hours ago, bcking said:

While yes we have military bases, that is a far cry from having a metropolitan area of 25 million people around 50 miles from the border.

 

I don't think NK has any intention of ever attacking us. They want better weapons as a means of protecting themselves. I think the regime is incredibly paranoid and strongly believes that if they don't employ the "strong man" approach, they will be destroyed. I think in KJU's mind he wants to get to the point where there is "shared mutual destruction" as opposed to "unilateral destruction" in the event of a war (with USA). As it stands now he knows that he can barely a nuisance to us if we go to war (but can do serious damage to our allies). I think that makes him very afraid. He would rather be a position where he could actually threaten us.

 

I'm not saying that taking a military option right now isn't the best decision. It may very well be. Unfortunately I just don't have that much faith in our current Presient to decide on what the best option is as it stands. Last time he bombed someone he couldn't even name the right country.

Why?  What could any country other than China ever want to attack NK for?  There is nothing there worth fighting over.  Except a tall flag pole.  That would look better in my back yard than Kijong-dong.

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

[bcking 3,157]

23 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

Why?  What could any country other than China ever want to attack NK for?  There is nothing there worth fighting over.  Except a tall flag pole.  That would look better in my back yard than Kijong-dong.

I'm not saying I agree, I'm saying that is the mindsight of KJU. He is paranoid, that doesn't make it true.

 

If he just stopped pursuiing nuclear weapons and kept to himself no one would care. Sure he would be treating thousands of his people like dirt and there would be humanitarian issues, but that wouldn't be enough to go to war over. 

 

He doesn't realize that. I think he truly believes that if he does not develop a means of "mutually assured destruction" with the USA that we will destroy him.

 

The irony that we are more likely to destroy him BECAUSE he is trying to develop those means is lost on him.

[Merrytooth 5,748]

1 hour ago, IDWAF said:

Mind our own business?  Isn't putting NK in their place and demanding denuclearization minding our own business?  Considering that NK is threatening Japan, South Korea and Guam, where we have thousands of our American soldiers stationed to help protect those countries, I think it IS our own business.  And let's not forget that NK has openly threatened to use nukes against the US.  

Precisely there are 'enemies' (Japan, South Korean, US soldiers) at NK's doorstep that NK develops nuclear weapons (I don't agree with nuclear weapons here).

NK sees those joint military exercises as provocations.

So you think other countries should not have means to defend themselves from any future military attacks? 

 

AND CHINA does not want US troops right at their doorstep as well.

 

Very simple:

- US attacks NK, China will help NK.

- If NK attacks US, China most likely will stand on US side.

 

IMHO,

US should take a step back, let China takes the lead in NK issue, instead of barking a mad dog like that fatty Kim.

There are already many disasters in US. Focus on rebuild our home here first before going around stirring the hornet nest in other parts of the world, trying to install 'so-called democracy' in other countries.

[OriZ 3,157]

IMO N. Korea is playing with fire. I don't think Trump is the type that will hesitate to burn the whole place to the ground; and I won't fault him for it.

[JayJayH 546]

On 9/19/2017 at 6:28 AM, Merrytooth said:

lol.. unless USA is prepared to receive refugees from NK..

 

China /  East Asia do not want swarm of NK refugees in their backyard either..

 

So it is better for USA to step back and MYOB

 

Judging from history, Americans only really care when the refugees are Muslims from the Middle East. 1.5 million Vietnamese, a couple million Soviets, Africans and Jews never made headlines.

 

13 hours ago, Merrytooth said:

Precisely there are 'enemies' (Japan, South Korean, US soldiers) at NK's doorstep that NK develops nuclear weapons (I don't agree with nuclear weapons here).

NK sees those joint military exercises as provocations.

So you think other countries should not have means to defend themselves from any future military attacks? 

 

AND CHINA does not want US troops right at their doorstep as well.

 

Very simple:

- US attacks NK, China will help NK.

- If NK attacks US, China most likely will stand on US side.

 

IMHO,

US should take a step back, let China takes the lead in NK issue, instead of barking a mad dog like that fatty Kim.

There are already many disasters in US. Focus on rebuild our home here first before going around stirring the hornet nest in other parts of the world, trying to install 'so-called democracy' in other countries.

If it was pretty much any other country, I would agree. NK is a case of its own though.

 

What's forgotten all too often is that the Kim dynasty isn't just another power hungry, dictatorial Muammar Ghadafi, Fidel Castro, Saddam Hussein, Ayatollah Khomeini or Bashar al-Assad. Those guys like to torture people here and there, meddle in some mustard gas, kill some political opponents for fun, invoke a little Sharia now and then to keep the Islamist crazies in check, you know, normal dictator stuff. But otherwise, life in Tehran, Havana, Baghdad, Tripoli and Damascus is pretty much day-to-day routine. Essentially, if you're an average Joe in Tehran, your life isn't dependent on Ayatollah Khamenei's daily mood swings. If you're Joe Schmoe in Havana, you really don't want the US Airforce dropping bombs on you, even if you dislike the Castro dynasty. You can send a few people here and there into torture dungeons and the world won't do S#!T. As long as you don't make it too obvious, you'll just get a standard letterhead from the United Nations "condemning it." Perhaps a sanction or two. Nothing that would threaten your dictatorial gold plated toilet seats and copious amounts of French cognac.

 

Aside from ISIS, North Korea is the closest thing we have today to Nazi Germany and communist Cambodia, two of the most horrendously murderous regimes in human history. North Korea is one big concentration camp. Basically, a 25 million person hostage situation. Allowing NK to exist is basically like turning the other cheek to Hitler's massacre of Jews or Pol Pot's annihilation of 35% of Cambodia's population. I'm not saying an artillery barrage against Seoul and a makeshift nuke hitting Guam is a good alternative, but if a situation ever arises where a surgical strike against NK is possible.. So be it.

Edited September 22, 2017 by JayJayH

[Dashinka 24,497]

23 hours ago, bcking said:

While yes we have military bases, that is a far cry from having a metropolitan area of 25 million people around 50 miles from the border.

 

I don't think NK has any intention of ever attacking us. They want better weapons as a means of protecting themselves. I think the regime is incredibly paranoid and strongly believes that if they don't employ the "strong man" approach, they will be destroyed. I think in KJU's mind he wants to get to the point where there is "shared mutual destruction" as opposed to "unilateral destruction" in the event of a war (with USA). As it stands now he knows that he can barely a nuisance to us if we go to war (but can do serious damage to our allies). I think that makes him very afraid. He would rather be a position where he could actually threaten us.

 

I'm not saying that taking a military option right now isn't the best decision. It may very well be. Unfortunately I just don't have that much faith in our current Presient to decide on what the best option is as it stands. Last time he bombed someone he couldn't even name the right country.

You are absolutely correct.  The Kim family is only worried about one thing and that is the Kim family and they will do anything they can to stay in power and perpetuate their perverted style of leadership.  There are stories out there of border guards killing people that attempt to defect, and a huge crackdown of people with Chinese phones  In my opinion this is to do whatever the Kim family can to eliminate the amount of outside news from entering the country.  Kim knows that the ROK, Trump or any other US president will not attack the country in a first strike attempt due to the losses that would be felt by the people of the ROK and potentially Japan and even China, and his biggest threat is from people inside the DPRK.  Rhetoric is bombastic, but it will most likely lead to nothing, but in the meantime the people of the DPRK are suffering.

 

A great site that tells many day-to-day stories about the people of NK can be found at The DailyNK.

 

22 hours ago, bcking said:

You think too highly of China. They can quote historical texts to argue that the Korean Penisula is there's. You let them move in with a "peacekeeping force" and I doubt they would ever leave.

I would like to see China do one big policy change, anyone that does get out gets treated as an ROK citizen (I believe the ROK has said that any DPRK citizen is also an ROK citizen) and are allowed to go to the ROK embassy/consulate instead of repatriating them back to the DPRK.  It may lead to an initial mass defection, but it would also send a big message to Kim.

Edited September 22, 2017 by Bill & Katya

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

10 hours ago, OriZ said:

IMO N. Korea is playing with fire. I don't think Trump is the type that will hesitate to burn the whole place to the ground; and I won't fault him for it.

 

[Umka36 781]

10 hours ago, JayJayH said:

 

Judging from history, Americans only really care when the refugees are Muslims from the Middle East. 1.5 million Vietnamese, a couple million Soviets, Africans and Jews never made headlines.

 

If it was pretty much any other country, I would agree. NK is a case of its own though.

 

What's forgotten all too often is that the Kim dynasty isn't just another power hungry, dictatorial Muammar Ghadafi, Fidel Castro, Saddam Hussein, Ayatollah Khomeini or Bashar al-Assad. Those guys like to torture people here and there, meddle in some mustard gas, kill some political opponents for fun, invoke a little Sharia now and then to keep the Islamist crazies in check, you know, normal dictator stuff. But otherwise, life in Tehran, Havana, Baghdad, Tripoli and Damascus is pretty much day-to-day routine. Essentially, if you're an average Joe in Tehran, your life isn't dependent on Ayatollah Khamenei's daily mood swings. If you're Joe Schmoe in Havana, you really don't want the US Airforce dropping bombs on you, even if you dislike the Castro dynasty. You can send a few people here and there into torture dungeons and the world won't do S#!T. As long as you don't make it too obvious, you'll just get a standard letterhead from the United Nations "condemning it." Perhaps a sanction or two. Nothing that would threaten your dictatorial gold plated toilet seats and copious amounts of French cognac.

 

Aside from ISIS, North Korea is the closest thing we have today to Nazi Germany and communist Cambodia, two of the most horrendously murderous regimes in human history. North Korea is one big concentration camp. Basically, a 25 million person hostage situation. Allowing NK to exist is basically like turning the other cheek to Hitler's massacre of Jews or Pol Pot's annihilation of 35% of Cambodia's population. I'm not saying an artillery barrage against Seoul and a makeshift nuke hitting Guam is a good alternative, but if a situation ever arises where a surgical strike against NK is possible.. So be it.

Reading the accounts of the following article is disgusting if found to be true:

 

11 musicians executed with anti-aircraft guns in North Korea – Defector

 

http://uncova.com/11-musicians-executed-with-anti-aircraft-guns-in-north-korea--defector

[Merrytooth 5,748]

39 minutes ago, Umka36 said:

Reading the accounts of the following article is disgusting if found to be true:

 

11 musicians executed with anti-aircraft guns in North Korea – Defector

 

http://uncova.com/11-musicians-executed-with-anti-aircraft-guns-in-north-korea--defector

The chinese netizens have already deemed it as fake news..

 

Fake news pandering to the western media and frenzy