Maintain full time student status after Interview?

[-Trinity- 513]

Our interview is end of this month and I was planning to travel back home shortly after to see my family. I'm on a student visa here since 2015 and I have always maintained my status.
So I was thinking after the interview I can fly to the Netherlands and spend time with my family and when I come back I will continue my study if I get back on time.
Getting back on time depends on couple things I have to take care of in the Netherlands: sell my house for an instance and some other stuff.
No one can predict what the outcome will be of the interview, we believe we have  enough proof that shows that our marriage is bona fide, but who knows what an IO sees and thinks?

I have read enough horror stories on this forum of couple's who thought exactly the same, so I understand that nothing is guaranteed. 

Anyhow, I called the DSO of my school and told him that I wasn't sure whether I will enroll for fall semester or not. Reason I don't want to enroll yet is that the fees need to be paid immediately. And when we come back from the Netherlands we most likely will move because of my husbands work so I won't be able to attend this college anyway. Problem is, we don't know yet where he will be located.The DSO told me that it's tricky cause if I get rejected for the green card I automatically go back to F-1 student status, which means I have to maintain my full time status. To me that doesn't make sense,  i'm already in the AOS procedure and the interview is upcoming and even if my green card gets denied during the interview it doesn't mean a permanent denial, right? In that case we probably have to provide additional information to proof our marriage. 

 

Bottom line is: at what point during the AOS process are you no longer required to maintain full time status as an F-1 student?

Edited July 11, 2017 by Dutchie2016
Edited topic title

[xillini 71]

4 hours ago, Dutchie2016 said:

 

Bottom line is: at what point during the AOS process are you no longer required to maintain full time status as an F-1 student?

Technically, since you have applied to AOS officially signing your intention to obtain permanent status in U.S., 
you are no longer qualified for non-immigrant student visa at this point even if your current visa status is F-1.

 

It is gray area where there is no court-decision, so no body has final interpretation on this gray area until court decisions are made,
(and this is how USCIS can exercise flexible discretion and effectively final decisions) but yet if you believe your marriage to your spouse is bona-fide, which it sounds like to me, you no longer have to worry about it too much. 

 

At the interview, unless you show convincing evidence that your marriage is completely sham marriage, 
it is almost impossible to get rejected at the spot. or making compelling false statement can lead to rejection to ASO (so don't lie, because even if your marriage is bona-fide, USCIS can reject your AOS based on the fact that you lied, and therefore anything that you have submitted can not be trusted, which is actually the most frequent reason to get rejected for bona-fide married couples)

 

If you do not convince the IO at the interview, the IO will ask for RFE, followed by second interview.
The second interview is where you and your spouse will be intensively asked questions that normal married couples would know and they will give final decisions. 

 

In the worst case, where you are rejected, which I would say it still happens for good faith married couples, 
you can still reapply for AOS with more convincing evidences.  

 

Lastly, it depends on your school. I believe it sounds like university you are enrolled, but in case if you are enrolled at language school just to extend your valid I-20 and visa status, the interview might be more intensive and IO will ask you more about your record of attending classes such as transcript, how to procure your living expenses, and even syllabus (if you heard about some language school immigration fraud such as prodee university)

 

So I would recommend you get confident and do your best at the interview, proving that your marriage is bona-fide. In the end of days, it may take some time for USCIS to make final decisions, but every good faith married couples get green card as they are entitled. 

Edited July 11, 2017 by xillini

[-Trinity- 513]

3 hours ago, xillini said:

Technically, since you have applied to AOS officially signing your intention to obtain permanent status in U.S., 
you are no longer qualified for non-immigrant student visa at this point even if your current visa status is F-1.

 

It is gray area where there is no court-decision, so no body has final interpretation on this gray area until court decisions are made,
(and this is how USCIS can exercise flexible discretion and effectively final decisions) but yet if you believe your marriage to your spouse is bona-fide, which it sounds like to me, you no longer have to worry about it too much. 

That was exactly my thought too. In case we don't get approved for the green card ( I keep that possibility open until we really get the approval) , I still can't use my I-20 for traveling for example because it's void.

My husband believes that we will get approved, but he never reads on VJ and isn't familiar with the whole process. I would never lie and there is for us no need to do so. I think part of it is because it feels so unnatural to proof that our marriage is real. I have never been in a situation that I had to do that.. So it's just weird to think: oh this picture will be perfect as evidence. Does that make any sense?

 

Lol, any way i'm not going to worry about it to much and we will see within two weeks. In worst case scenario we move to the Netherlands and do the whole process again, but then i'm the petitioner.

[-Trinity- 513]

Thank you for your response by the way. It really helped putting things in perspective.

[azblk 338]

4 hours ago, xillini said:

Technically, since you have applied to AOS officially signing your intention to obtain permanent status in U.S., 
you are no longer qualified for non-immigrant student visa at this point even if your current visa status is F-1.

 

That is not true. AOS doesn't not invalidate your visa or your status as long you don't do anything else to loose it. For instance if she remains in school full time then she would not loose her status if AOS is denied for reasons other than deport-able ones.

[xillini 71]

12 hours ago, azblk said:

That is not true. AOS doesn't not invalidate your visa or your status as long you don't do anything else to loose it. For instance if she remains in school full time then she would not loose her status if AOS is denied for reasons other than deport-able ones.

Yes, you have your point.

 

There is no specific court decision or case so it differs but after she had applied to her AOS, showing her intention of immigration, which conflicts to F1 non-immigrant status, she is inadmissible using her F-1 visa. Once she uses Combo card, or advanced parole, then her F1 visa status becomes invalid. 

 

In addition, since she had applied to AOS, she may no longer be qualified to apply to OPT or OPT extension as a privileges of F1 non-immigrant status. She may apply to OPT, but the application to OPT may result in unfavorable decisions of her AOS. 

Yes she can remain in school as full time or other allowable regulations, but that is all she can do now that she has applied to AOS. 

In addition, out of status is not big issue at the interview for marriage to USC. 

 

In other words, she is valid F-1 visa status, but she no longer is available to take advantage of any F1 visa benefits, which is what I meant by gray area. It is not invalid, but effectively she can't do anything such as travel outside U.S. (unless she wants to do consular processing: going outside of U.S. is completely free, but entering U.S. is completely different story as always), as well as not application to OPT I-765. 

 

It is because F1 non immigrant visa does not have dual intent like in the case of H1B or L1 visa status. 

 

[-Trinity- 513]

9 minutes ago, xillini said:

Yes, you have your point.

 

There is no specific court decision or case so it differs but after she had applied to her AOS, showing her intention of immigration, which conflicts to F1 non-immigrant status, she is inadmissible using her F-1 visa. Once she uses Combo card, or advanced parole, then her F1 visa status becomes invalid. 

 

In addition, since she had applied to AOS, she may no longer be qualified to apply to OPT or OPT extension as a privileges of F1 non-immigrant status. She may apply to OPT, but the application to OPT may result in unfavorable decisions of her AOS. 

Yes she can remain in school as full time or other allowable regulations, but that is all she can do now that she has applied to AOS. 

In addition, out of status is not big issue at the interview for marriage to USC. 

 

In other words, she is valid F-1 visa status, but she no longer is available to take advantage of any F1 visa benefits, which is what I meant by gray area. It is not invalid, but effectively she can't do anything such as travel outside U.S. (unless she wants to do consular processing: going outside of U.S. is completely free, but entering U.S. is completely different story as always), as well as not application to OPT I-765. 

 

It is because F1 non immigrant visa does not have dual intent like in the case of H1B or L1 visa status. 

 

I can see where it is a grey area. I believe that's also the reason why so many DSO's advice their students to stay full time enrolled.

Kind of a 'better safe then sorry' approach.

 

[xillini 71]

15 hours ago, Dutchie2016 said:

I think part of it is because it feels so unnatural to proof that our marriage is real. I have never been in a situation that I had to do that.. So it's just weird to think: oh this picture will be perfect as evidence. Does that make any sense?

 

 

I would say, don't get over reacted. 1st, the definition of boan fide marriage is according to USCIS, it enters marriage with a good faith. 

But then question goes after the definition of "good faith". 

 

As you may know US federal court has different jurisdiction, and liberal federal jurisidiction such as California defines "the good faith" as "not to evade immigration regulations"

while other federal court jurisdiction such as Texas defines it as "to establish life-long union between two persons" (well it used to be man and woman but now that same sex marriage is legal, it changes) 

 

It sounds the same, but when it goes to federal court decisions, it really changes a lot that in california federal court, prosecutors have high responsibility to convince the judges that the defendant intentionally enters marriage to evade other immigration regulations, while in texas federal court, prosecutors still have responsibility to convince the judges, but it is much easier to show the evidences the defendent did not enter life-long union marriage.

 

For instance, as you mentioned that you want to visit your family shortly after the interview, texans prosecutors may use that as an evidence that your visit to home country right after the interview is an indicator that your marriage to him may not be bona-fide , which can reasonably bring some suspicion along with other evidences, while californian prosecutors may not use your visit against you, because your visit is nothing about to evade immigration regulations. 

 

In fact, this is what President Trump lamented as "judges hopping" (because pro immigrant organization sued his travel ban EO at Hawaii, one of the most liberal states) 

and to be fair, during Obama's administration, anti immigrant organization sued Obama's OPT STEM extension EO at Louisiana (which is the deep south state and one of the most conservative states)

 

So, USCIS just holds "good faith" marriage, of which definition is interpreted differently by different federal court judges. 

 

In the end, you just need to be yourself and show relation with your spouse, which is more than enough to get approval, disregarding all this bunch of legal perspectives.

Good luck! 

Edited July 12, 2017 by xillini

[-Trinity- 513]

2 hours ago, xillini said:

 

For instance, as you mentioned that you want to visit your family shortly after the interview, texans prosecutors may use that as an evidence that your visit to home country right after the interview is an indicator that your marriage to him may not be bona-fide , which can reasonably bring some suspicion along with other evidences, while californian prosecutors may not use your visit against you, because your visit is nothing about to evade immigration regulations. 

 

In the end, you just need to be yourself and show relation with your spouse, which is more than enough to get approval, disregarding all this bunch of legal perspectives.

Good luck! 

I had no clue, and it is terrifying ( I won't loose any sleep over it though) but it almost sounds like every action can be hold against you. Depending on what state and what the circumstances are. I mean, to me it sounds perfectly fine that I didn't violate any rules by not traveling out and back into the country after we got married.  I cold have gone at the end of the year, I already had my ticket. But at that time we didn't adjust status yet so i knew that coming back on F-1 might be considered violating the rules. My intent at that time has changed since I married a US citizen, we just didn't applied for AOS yet.

 

Anyhow, I think e should be fine and i just miss my family. My brothers  had children last year and I haven't met anyone of my new nieces and nephew yet. And my sister is expecting her second child end of this year and I really want to see her.

 

Thank you for the input, I appreciate sharing this kind of information.

[azblk 338]

8 hours ago, Dutchie2016 said:

I had no clue, and it is terrifying ( I won't loose any sleep over it though) but it almost sounds like every action can be hold against you. Depending on what state and what the circumstances are. I mean, to me it sounds perfectly fine that I didn't violate any rules by not traveling out and back into the country after we got married.  I cold have gone at the end of the year, I already had my ticket. But at that time we didn't adjust status yet so i knew that coming back on F-1 might be considered violating the rules. My intent at that time has changed since I married a US citizen, we just didn't applied for AOS yet.

 

Anyhow, I think e should be fine and i just miss my family. My brothers  had children last year and I haven't met anyone of my new nieces and nephew yet. And my sister is expecting her second child end of this year and I really want to see her.

 

Thank you for the input, I appreciate sharing this kind of information.

Now that is total nonsense. You could have traveled as long as you had approved advance parole. Leaving and returning on advance parole would simply secure your AOS but not jeopardize your f-1 status if you had so chosen to remain on that status. Again you do not loose your immigration status simply because you filed for AOS. Most people on F-1 though do abandon their status because for one its is much much cheaper to continue school on AOS pending than staying on as F-1.

[-Trinity- 513]

2 minutes ago, azblk said:

Now that is total nonsense. You could have traveled as long as you had approved advance parole. Leaving and returning on advance parole would simply secure your AOS but not jeopardize your f-1 status if you had so chosen to remain on that status. Again you do not loose your immigration status simply because you filed for AOS. Most people on F-1 though do abandon their status because for one its is much much cheaper to continue school on AOS pending than staying on as F-1.

How is it nonsense to avoid the risk traveling without AP?  I don't think you abandon your Visa when you adjust status, but your intent has changed from non immigrant to immigrant.

 

Mind you I'm talking about the time period between our marriage and AOS and receiving the AP. I don't know about other people but I didn't take the risk to go anywhere outside of the US with my F-1.  

[azblk 338]

33 minutes ago, Dutchie2016 said:

How is it nonsense to avoid the risk traveling without AP?  I don't think you abandon your Visa when you adjust status, but your intent has changed from non immigrant to immigrant.

 

Mind you I'm talking about the time period between our marriage and AOS and receiving the AP. I don't know about other people but I didn't take the risk to go anywhere outside of the US with my F-1.  

I guess I misunderstood you. I thought you had approved AP but were scared to use it because it would jeopardize you F-1 status.

[-Trinity- 513]

1 hour ago, azblk said:

I guess I misunderstood you. I thought you had approved AP but were scared to use it because it would jeopardize you F-1 status.

Oh no, if I had AP I would perfectly fine to travel :-)

 

[Boiler 45,510]

As soon as you travel using the AP or Work using EAD however why are you concerned about the interview, most unusual for there to be an issue and all the cases I have seen have been pretty obvious.

[-Trinity- 513]

45 minutes ago, Boiler said:

As soon as you travel using the AP or Work using EAD

 

however why are you concerned about the interview, most unusual for there to be an issue and all the cases I have seen have been pretty obvious.

I don't understand your first sentence.

 

Why I'm concerned? I usually like to know what to expect and can't handle uncertain situations well.
Even if they seem to be obvious.