K-3 Denial - Morocco, of course

[aicha 0]

wow... this is nuts... you are Actually Living together.. and they still need more proof??? What more do they want??

Thank you for that - I appreciate that someone sees the irony in this case.

[chiquita 0]

We have an attorney and the CO hear will not even speak with him even after repeated tries.

this is new to me. most attorneys are able to speak with CO's. has he sent an e mail to the consulate?

He approved my rebuttal because it was very precise - he only made a few changes in it. I am continuing our fight here in Morocco

there is nothing you can do in Morocco. your case is no longer there. the consulate will have nothing to do with you at all. once your case is sent back which i would guess has had to occured since it has been almost a month now the consulate will do nothing. hope you understand this.

while he is working on presenting case law to USCIS in the states as well as watching for the final approval of our CR1

it is going to take at least 6 months for your case to get to CSC. does your attorney know this? your I-130 is still pending with CSC or is it at the NVC?

The CO did make assumptions and turned around things said to fit their own desire to return the papers. Why does this CO do the things they do? Who knows, but they do and it does happen - yes they realize that the USCIS will have the final say in this, but it does not mean that they can't delay it and also,

this very true. USCIS will send you a NOIR and make a decision on your response. but i caution you that the consulate can and does deny a second time.

let us be reminded we all wonder sometimes where money comes from in the US - we the fees for the VISA are paid up front at the CO and they are not refunded if the CO says no, so if they keep making you come back - they keep getting more money for something that is not being issued.

the medical is good for one year. the consulate does not charge for the 2nd interview.

chi

[aicha 0]

We have an attorney and the CO hear will not even speak with him even after repeated tries.

this is new to me. most attorneys are able to speak with CO's. has he sent an e mail to the consulate?

Yes - my attorney tried to contact them the day after the interview - no one there will reply to our attorney.

He approved my rebuttal because it was very precise - he only made a few changes in it. I am continuing our fight here in Morocco

there is nothing you can do in Morocco. your case is no longer there. the consulate will have nothing to do with you at all. once your case is sent back which i would guess has had to occured since it has been almost a month now the consulate will do nothing. hope you understand this.

Yes - I got confirmation finally, that the papers were sent back on April 4, but they are still talking to me.

while he is working on presenting case law to USCIS in the states as well as watching for the final approval of our CR1

it is going to take at least 6 months for your case to get to CSC. does your attorney know this? your I-130 is still pending with CSC or is it at the NVC?

My CR1 is at the NVC - my mawyer has already got this information.

The CO did make assumptions and turned around things said to fit their own desire to return the papers. Why does this CO do the things they do? Who knows, but they do and it does happen - yes they realize that the USCIS will have the final say in this, but it does not mean that they can't delay it and also,

this very true. USCIS will send you a NOIR and make a decision on your response. but i caution you that the consulate can and does deny a second time.

I am aware of this and prepared for that.

let us be reminded we all wonder sometimes where money comes from in the US - we the fees for the VISA are paid up front at the CO and they are not refunded if the CO says no, so if they keep making you come back - they keep getting more money for something that is not being issued.

the medical is good for one year. the consulate does not charge for the 2nd interview.

Thank you for that information - it helps.

chi

[aicha 0]

Your letter's a good start, but it might help to strip it of some of the background. They're not going to give a damn that he was tired or had a long commute or was mistakenly asked for originals if none of that figured in the 221g.

You are right in this and I am aware of that - our lawyer just merely wanted on record, so to say, all events and circumstances surrounding the interview. He wanted this to be able to build case law on this. It was meant to be a little personal and also at the same time to be detailed in the steps that took place.

You say in it you've studied philosophy, so you know how arguments work. Grant the assumption; undermine the premises. I'd start with the correspondence they gave you that explains why they denied it. Analyze it into reasons: no common language, including reliance on translators; way of meeting that looks like he went American hunting; and no intimate knowledge of your life.

Then rebutt those one by one with evidence. Are they wrong on the facts? Then show how. Are they wrong on the interpretation but right on the facts? Show them why your interpretation is better. Did they misunderstand him during the interview? Explain what he meant and back it up with documents.

My main reasoning and providing proof will obviously come into play in the instance it is needed. My deatiled letter may have been a little colored for purpose of record, but my arguments that are being worked up right now are quite a bit different. I did mention in my letter that maybe there was miscommunication and misunderstandings or misstatements for a reason. They will be proved in other manners. This again was just a mere answer to there reasons and colored for purpose. Maybe it makes sense and maybe it does not, but there are reasons behind it.

Another thing I thought of as I was brainstorming how I would prove that C. and I were real if it came up....: do the two of you have e-mails where you discuss your future plans, not just get to the USA plans, but things like whether you'd have kids, or whether you'd want private school for them, or whether you think ballet is good for girls or leads to eating disorders? or your favorite memories or stories of your grandma or the little stuff that doesn't look like anything but forms the fabric of the relationship? Things that show that the two of you know each other well that doesn't look like a laundry list of common facts.

My husband and I have daily conversations that show many talks about our future plans and things we want for our future and our plans for that. Believe me - we even had many conversations of what we would do if VISA was never granted, so yes to your question. We talked for anywhere between 6 to 13 hours a day, everyday. The only time my hsuband and I did not communicate was when I was in the travel process to and from Morocco.

[chiquita 0]

if you are in need of any further assistance you know how to conatct me

chi

[aicha 0]

I just wanted to put an end note on here -

Thank you for all of your advice. Whether you understood me or not does not really matter - I have learned that people are all individuals in their own rights and that each person can see things in different lights - that is what makes this world so very diverse. I may not agree with some of the things said here and others may not agreee with me, but only me and my husband and our families need to worry about our situation and all the details thereof.

I know we will overcome our situation and no one can ever change that - one day these people will see what we have together and then they will feel like the fools - because anyone out there who knows us, knows that we communicate perfectly, probably better than most people who speak perfectly the same language and born in the same country. My husband and QI have never needed translators or anything of that kind. Our communication and the strength in our love is stronger than most because we work hard to always communicate and to make sure we speak in ways that are understood.

Thank you again for all of your opinions whether agreed with or not - we are all individuals here.

[hmm1 0]

I was vasked about my situation and if I had informed the VJ of my situation - No I had not as of yet - been really caught up in the process of fighting this denial. I did update my timeline and put a note in my profile - but now I will try to give details of our situation.

Our interview for a K-3 VISA was on March 21, 2007 at 8 am with the wonderful Casablanca, Morocco consulate. I know this consulate has had a lot of mixed review and according to our lawyer this consulates denial rate is over 50 percent. I would love to add our detailed step by step interview, but it is quite large. Through many daily contacts and lies from the consulate - I finally got the confirmation date of return of our papers and also the reason for denial. Mind you I contacted them daily and finally sent out a very long letter to the Ambassador, the Consulate General and teh Cosulate Chief Officer - with this I got the specific reasons for denial. Here is that response:

This is in response to your recent e-mail message to Ambassador Riley and Consul General Greene regarding the Immigrant Visa case of your husband, Mr. Mourad Hattari..

The record indicates that, despite the assistance of an English-, French- and Arabic-speaking interpretor during the interview, Mr. Hattari could provide very few details about is his relationship with you other than your name, occupation, number of children, and birthday. When asked how you met and communicate, he could not specify the website via which you initally made contact, simply saying that it was shown to him by a friend. He also said that he largely relies on friends not only to handle written e-mail communication with you while you were in the U.S., but also for verbal communication when you're in Morocco.

Mr. Hattari was given numerous opportunities during the interview to provide information in his native language about you and your relationship, but was only able to provide the bare minimum cited above. Therefore, the Consular Officer returned the file including the original I-130 petition (which is standard procedure in such cases) to the Department of Homeland Security's United States Citizenship and Immigration Service (USCIS) via the National Visa Center for a further review of the of the relationship. Unfortunately, this office has no authority over the case at this time and to seek information about its status, you need to contact the USCIS National Customer Service Center at 1-800-375-5283.

I trust you find this information helpful.

Do I find it helpful - lol - NO! This whole report of what the CO wrote in her report was fabricated. She took details from our interview to turn them into something else that was never said. Example - her question "How did you learn english?" My hsuband's response "I learned from friends." The translator was provided for one question - that question was what is the member directory? ( referring to yahoo personals member directory) and my hsuband had a hard time trying to explain the details of how that system works, so he was provided a translator for that one purpose. The woman through this entire interview used norrible body language, hand gestures and made numerous disgraceful faces - what a nice impression she made. She finally at the end of the interview asked my hsuband for our proof of rrelationship and as he was trying to show her everything, including my residency here, she handed him the 221(g) and walked away not even allowing him the chance to show her anything. This is a rundown of our experience and I even have a lawyer - the consulate will not respond to him at all, not even one time. The Consulate Chief Officer told me in the reply above that he returned our I-130/CR1 - this was another lie of theirs - my lawyer said our CR1 is ion process at the NVC and plus I have not paid the fees on it yet, so it has never left the states to even come here yet. This is how this Consulate works - they don't! My lawyer even went on to tell me that we should divorce and marry in another country or at least try to get to anotehr country and get residency papers and then we would go through that country's consulate instead - I was applaed at my lawyer for this - I need him to do his job, not give me things that just are not an option finacially or emotionall!

Well there it is - a brief description of our journey so far - not a fun one.

OMG, I am sorry that this happened to you and your SO...

[aicha 0]

thanks hmm1 - it is okay - we will endure and be together one way or another!

[becke1 0]

I think my guy interviewed with the same lady from H*LL She was terrible!! He answered all her questions, but she kept asking him about what schools I attended when I was a child. We had never been asked about that before, and I filled the forms out myself and e-mailed them to him so he would have all my info. I know the papers asked about high school and college, which I filled out and he also told her about, but she would not listen. Then she would not believe that I have no children, because early in our relationship I had temporary custody of my best friends 2 kids. I only had them for about six months, but they are a huge part of my life and I often feel as if they are mine too. When he tried to explain about the temp. custody, she told him she did not care and did not believe him. What is that? She is crazy. She kept him there for nearly 2 hours! everybody else around him were being granted their visas and he was still dealing with the physco!! So now I am at a loss, I have never done any of this before and I have no idea what the next step is. The embassy tells me I have to wait until they send everything back here. My guy tells me he has been talking to others there that have dealt with her too and some have given up, others managed to eventually get their visas. He says that what we need to do is send an e-mail and cancel this app. and then apply for a new one with all this new info and the letter he was provided and that it would be approved within 4 months. Has anyone else experienced this? What is the right road to travel here? I am very confused and a bit distraught over the whole thing.

Any and all advice, comments would be helpful and welcome.

Thanks,

Becke