Trump donates first quarter salary to National Park Service

[Transborderwife 4,666]

5 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

He saved a Billion on Air Force one right off the bat. So he is a billion up already 

Is he paying for his maintenance on his jet or are we, the people?

[smilesammich 10,727]

1 minute ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

He saved a Billion on Air Force one right off the bat. So he is a billion up already 

proof? i haven't seen anything other than trump's tweets. which mean absolutely nothing to me.

[bcking 3,157]

19 minutes ago, SRVT said:

Absolutely not. I'm merely taking a wait-and-see approach. If the guy is spending more than Obama, i'd first like to see a justification of why, then weigh if it was really worth the extra costs. I know you probably are expecting a reactionary response but even with Obama my response was the same.. wait and see. I'm already quite used to seeing people from both parties reacting to every single story according to their party line, I don't really care for it. See the above post for the type of partisan reaction I'm talking about.

That is reasonable. Though I think there are a couple of problems with taking a truly unbiased approach to it. 

 

1. How will you calculate the value of the "justification"? If we are talking specifically about going to Florida every weekend; I'm sure deals are being made there, and dignitaries are being entertained. However, how can you reasonably judge whether those same meetings and deals couldn't have been reached in DC? Sure hands may be shaken at Mar-A-Lago, but the location may not matter. It would be very difficult to really calculate "how much" was gained from the trips, while it is very easy to calculate how much is being spent

2. As I said before, even if we "wait and see", the current amount is already quite startling. If he stopped all unnecessary travel for the next 2 years he would catch up with Obama. That isn't likely. Even if he cuts it down by half during the next 3 years he will still have spent more than Obama by a huge margin (more than double). Cut it down by a 4th? (1 weekend per month, instead of 4 weekends per month), still doesn't come down to Obama's level.

Edited April 4, 2017 by bcking

[IAMX 3,055]

2 minutes ago, bcking said:

That is reasonable. Though I think there are a couple of problems with taking a truly unbiased approach to it. 

 

1. How will you calculate the value of the "justification"? If we are talking specifically about going to Florida every weekend; I'm sure deals are being made there, and dignitaries are being entertained. However, how can you reasonably judge whether those same meetings and deals couldn't have been reached in DC? Sure hands may be shaken at Mar-A-Lago, but the location may not matter. It would be very difficult to really calculate "how much" was gained from the trips, while it is very easy to calculate how much is being spent

2. As I said before, even if we "wait and see", the current amount is already quite startling. If he stopped all unnecessary travel for the next 2 years he would catch up with Obama. That isn't likely. Even if he cuts it down by half during the next 3 years he will still have spent more than Obama by a huge margin (more than double). Cut it down by a 4th? (1 weekend per month, instead of 4 weekends per month), still doesn't come down to Obama's level.

The President clearly consults with family on how he conducts business.

 

If it's anything to do with a trip where he's making Presidential decisions or doing Presidential work, why would I care if it's a trip to Florida, where he owns significant property and regularly visited anyways?

 

If he's just taking vacations for his family and it has little or nothing to do with Presidential activities, or his own properties, as long as the President reimburses for travel costs and isn't neglecting their job, I don't see the big deal.

 

Details matter significantly.. treating things as if they're one and the same for every President generally is a bad idea, and something party fanatics do.

[bcking 3,157]

4 minutes ago, SRVT said:

 

If it's anything to do with a trip where he's making Presidential decisions or doing Presidential work, why would I care if it's a trip to Florida, where he owns significant property and regularly visited anyways?

 

Because a trip to Florida costs a lot of money. He is flying a lot of people down there, a lot of people need to book places to stay. There is a lot that goes into a trip. He isn't just walking across the lawn at the White House for a weekend.

 

What Presidential decisions/work REQUIRE him to be in Florida? While perhaps it may boost his negotiating skills in certain situations (wooing someone with a fancy golf resort), that is very hard to add up. Maybe the value is there, but 3 million per weekend is a pretty high goal post.

[IAMX 3,055]

Just now, bcking said:

Because a trip to Florida costs a lot of money. He is flying a lot of people down there, a lot of people need to book places to stay. There is a lot that goes into a trip. He isn't just walking across the lawn at the White House for a weekend.

 

What Presidential decisions/work REQUIRE him to be in Florida? While perhaps it may boost his negotiating skills in certain situations (wooing someone with a fancy golf resort), that is very hard to add up. Maybe the value is there, but 3 million per weekend is a pretty high goal post.

Everything the President does costs a lot of money. He doesn't sit around in the White House twiddling his thumbs. I'd be pretty irritated if he did.

 

If you'd gladly break down everything the Presidents are billing taxpayers for, by whether or not the President is conducting the nations business or otherwise, I'd gladly talk about it.. but right now you're outraged at a specific very small number of trips in a very small time period. Why am I supposed to be outraged?

[bcking 3,157]

Just now, SRVT said:

Everything the President does costs a lot of money. He doesn't sit around in the White House twiddling his thumbs. I'd be pretty irritated if he did.

 

If you'd gladly break down everything the Presidents are billing taxpayers for, by whether or not the President is conducting the nations business or otherwise, I'd gladly talk about it.. but right now you're outraged at a specific very small number of trips in a very small time period. Why am I supposed to be outraged?

The estimates for each weekend to Florida are that they cost approximately 3 million dollars that would not otherwise be spent if he conducted business at the White House, as is typical.

 

There is really no other way to explain this. If either hear it, or you keep your head in the sand.

[IAMX 3,055]

2 minutes ago, bcking said:

The estimates for each weekend to Florida are that they cost approximately 3 million dollars that would not otherwise be spent if he conducted business at the White House, as is typical.

 

There is really no other way to explain this. If either hear it, or you keep your head in the sand.

I want substance, not reaction or outrage, not an unreasonable thing to demand, so if you can't give it to me, then there's no choice other than to not give a toss.

[bcking 3,157]

Just now, SRVT said:

I want substance, not reaction or outrage, not an unreasonable thing to demand, so if you can't give it to me, then there's no choice other than to not give a toss.

What other substance would you like?

Yes everything a President does costs money, but we are still able to look at one particular topic objectively without considering "everything" that costs money. Toss out everything that is a "constant" (like all of his weekdays since whether he goes on the weekend to Florida doesn't change what he does on a weekday). Then you consider him staying at the White House. Security, employees etc.. They all have permanent places there. There is no "extra" cost associated with him being at the White House. It is status quo.

 

Then you consider travelling to Florida. You add up all the expenses involved in that. Hotel rooms, travel costs. That money is "additional" to the "status quo".

 

Seriously these are pretty basic concepts man.

[IAMX 3,055]

Just now, bcking said:

What other substance would you like?

Yes everything a President does costs money, but we are still able to look at one particular topic objectively without considering "everything" that costs money. Toss out everything that is a "constant" (like all of his weekdays since whether he goes on the weekend to Florida doesn't change what he does on a weekday). Then you consider him staying at the White House. Security, employees etc.. They all have permanent places there. There is no "extra" cost associated with him being at the White House. It is status quo.

 

Then you consider travelling to Florida. You add up all the expenses involved in that. Hotel rooms, travel costs. That money is "additional" to the "status quo".

 

Seriously these are pretty basic concepts man.

It would seem to me your intention with all this stuff is to gauge whether or not the President is wasting money. That's of course assuming your intentions are simply critical and not partisan. Not only is it virtually impossible to know all of what Trump is doing right now and whether or not he's doing business on behalf of the country (instead of solely vacationing), but there's far more that goes into budgeting than the comparisons of vacation spending cited. It's a tiny tidbit of data that without a doubt does not even tell the entire story. The only way to know is going to be when fiscal year budgets account for prior spending vs. future budget estimates, but more fairly, would make sense to judge on a term by term basis. There's no logic behind criticizing this what, 10 weeks into his Presidency? This was done to Obama and made just as little sense.

[bcking 3,157]

Just now, SRVT said:

It would seem to me your intention with all this stuff is to gauge whether or not the President is wasting money. That's of course assuming your intentions are simply critical and not partisan. Not only is it virtually impossible to know all of what Trump is doing right now and whether or not he's doing business on behalf of the country (instead of solely vacationing), but there's far more that goes into budgeting than the comparisons of vacation spending cited. It's a tiny tidbit of data that without a doubt does not even tell the entire story. The only way to know is going to be when fiscal year budgets account for prior spending vs. future budget estimates, but more fairly, would make sense to judge on a term by term basis. There's no logic behind criticizing this what, 10 weeks into his Presidency? This was done to Obama and made just as little sense.

I'm not trying to distinguish between vacationing and working. I fully admit that he is "working" in Florida. I'm not saying he has taken a lot of vacation since he started.

 

Yes as I've said we can wait and look at what it amounts to after 4 years, but I also think it is reasonable to look at what has occured so far. He has flown about 1,800 miles round trip every single weekend since taking office. Even if those are all working weekends, that is still extraordinary compared to anything past Presidents have done. Yes maybe it's just the first couple of months and he is just building up his stamina and he will turn it around, but even if he did 8 consecutive "weekend trips" to the same location is unprecedented, to my knowledge.

 

Unfortunately I have meetings now so have to leave my office, as fun as our multiple conversations have been.

[IAMX 3,055]

2 minutes ago, bcking said:

I'm not trying to distinguish between vacationing and working. I fully admit that he is "working" in Florida. I'm not saying he has taken a lot of vacation since he started.

 

Yes as I've said we can wait and look at what it amounts to after 4 years, but I also think it is reasonable to look at what has occured so far. He has flown about 1,800 miles round trip every single weekend since taking office. Even if those are all working weekends, that is still extraordinary compared to anything past Presidents have done. Yes maybe it's just the first couple of months and he is just building up his stamina and he will turn it around, but even if he did 8 consecutive "weekend trips" to the same location is unprecedented, to my knowledge.

 

Unfortunately I have meetings now so have to leave my office, as fun as our multiple conversations have been.

No surprise really, Trump has been repeatedly in the news about his hard work ethic... which must be a surprise to the media. Recall the campaign trail?

 

 

 

 

[smilesammich 10,727]

16 minutes ago, SRVT said:

No surprise really, Trump has been repeatedly in the news about his hard work ethic... which must be a surprise to the media. Recall the campaign trail?

 

 

 

 

 

wonder why trump in a picture on the phone with stacks of paper surrounding him is supposed to prove work ethic. so so transparent.

[Transborderwife 4,666]

5 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

 

wonder why trump in a picture on the phone with stacks of paper surrounding him is supposed to prove work ethic. so so transparent

 

6 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

 

wonder why trump in a picture on the phone with stacks of paper surrounding him is supposed to prove work ethic. so so transparent.

Some people like a clean desk 

[IAMX 3,055]

7 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

 

wonder why trump in a picture on the phone with stacks of paper surrounding him is supposed to prove work ethic. so so transparent.

Can lead a horse to water..