DCF available?

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Why not apply anyways... it would be a good excuse for you to go back and visit when it's complete... To let UK Citizenship slip through your fingers... it think you would really come to regret that...

Maybe if I was from a country with a lot of unrest...but I don't feel that not having UK citizenship would in any way hinder me later in life. If we ever wanted to come back here...and right now it's not very likely, I can't wait to get out of this country...I'll just reapply for a resident visa which was ridiculously easy to get the first time.

Plus, I object on principle to pledging an oath of loyalty to a monarch. If the UK didn't have that particular step built into its naturalization process, I might consider it. But as long as I have to pledge allegiance to someone whose only accomplishment was to emerge from the correct birth canal, I refuse on principle.

I agree on all points! I loved living here for ages, but now I can't wait to get out -- neither can Bruce. I've managed 11 years here without a red passport and even though my work will bring me back to London 3 or 4 times a year I don't see myself ever wanting to resettle here permanently again. But as you say, if I need to come back I'll get the ILR stamp again. For those of us who have this option, it's not a biggie.

And I know some will disagree with me, but I resent having to take a test to prove I will be a clued-up member of British society -- I think I've proved that through the way I have paid my taxes, created networks of friends and colleagues, and participated in civic life. I'm a native English speaker with multiple academic qualifications, most of them earned in Britain. I think there is definitely merit in such a test for newcomers to Britain, but for those of us with long-term residence in the UK such actions should be taken into account.

(Which is of course to say that I want special treatment, dash it!)

[homesick_american 1]

Why not apply anyways... it would be a good excuse for you to go back and visit when it's complete... To let UK Citizenship slip through your fingers... it think you would really come to regret that...

Maybe if I was from a country with a lot of unrest...but I don't feel that not having UK citizenship would in any way hinder me later in life. If we ever wanted to come back here...and right now it's not very likely, I can't wait to get out of this country...I'll just reapply for a resident visa which was ridiculously easy to get the first time.

Plus, I object on principle to pledging an oath of loyalty to a monarch. If the UK didn't have that particular step built into its naturalization process, I might consider it. But as long as I have to pledge allegiance to someone whose only accomplishment was to emerge from the correct birth canal, I refuse on principle.

I agree on all points! I loved living here for ages, but now I can't wait to get out -- neither can Bruce. I've managed 11 years here without a red passport and even though my work will bring me back to London 3 or 4 times a year I don't see myself ever wanting to resettle here permanently again. But as you say, if I need to come back I'll get the ILR stamp again. For those of us who have this option, it's not a biggie.

And I know some will disagree with me, but I resent having to take a test to prove I will be a clued-up member of British society -- I think I've proved that through the way I have paid my taxes, created networks of friends and colleagues, and participated in civic life. I'm a native English speaker with multiple academic qualifications, most of them earned in Britain. I think there is definitely merit in such a test for newcomers to Britain, but for those of us with long-term residence in the UK such actions should be taken into account.

(Which is of course to say that I want special treatment, dash it!)

A lot of these new hoops are Labour's reactionary cr@p anyway and are in response to the xenophobic garbage in the Daily Mirror and The Sun. The inmates are truly running the asylum here...can't wait to get out. Even US under Bush has to be better than this place.

[LadyUK 0]

I, too, established one of my degrees and numerous other qualifications while living here, including paying the extra £7000 per year for foreign education fees. I have been here nearly ten years and have established friendships, businesses, and have only ever recieved 1 speeding ticket.

I volunteer in my community, am an avid voter, pay through the nose in tax for items priced 300% higher than on the continent, recieve crappy service and sometimes hold my tongue, contribute to my local police meetings, volunteer for the local police authority, have protested issues, been involved in the anti-war movement (and the impeach Bush movements), created support networks for hundreds of people with concerns over certain medical issues and have even been subjected to catching MRSA while I have been here (which should be classed as a British "thing" since it is so bloody common).

I have even had Phd students who are writing their thesis on the Taliban in my home - surely that could be classed as fitting in with a British group?

Why should I have to take a test about what being British is all about when I clearly know more than most of the people around me? It sometimes sickens me when some people tell me they have never left the country, don't know where Wales is or even eaten spaghetti - its all foreign, you know.

I am very interested and involved in poilitics - can you tell?

Even US under Bush has to be better than this place.

Bush is one of the main reasons I have avoided going back to the US until now.

As much as I hate the monarchy and the doleys, chavs, NHS, speed camera money makers (safety my a*se) and all of the new citizen tests to make more money for the government, I would much rather be here and as far away from that war-mongering, lying, fear-enducing, election-stealing, uneducated, over-privledged, murdering idiot named Bush as possible.

I often feel as though I have to apologize for being an American - how many of you feel the same?

I hate feeling ashamed of my nationality because of one man.

Sure Clinton got someone doing the dirty with him when he was in office, but he did his job, and I thought he was a great president. I was proud to be an American then.

I love many many many things about the UK, the government is NOT one of them, but I am happy to have waited and to be going back nearer the time that Bush is going out.

/end rant LOL

[homesick_american 1]

Even US under Bush has to be better than this place.

Bush is one of the main reasons I have avoided going back to the US until now.

I lived in Texas the entire time he was governor, so I know what we'll be dealing with when we get back. (I left shortly after he took office in April 2001.) It's better now because he's a lame duck, his approval ratings are in the toilet, and there's a Democrat congress. The guy is basically hog-tied until January 2009 and we all know it. Don't let him worry you.

As much as I hate the monarchy and the doleys, chavs, NHS, speed camera money makers (safety my a*se) and all of the new citizen tests to make more money for the government, I would much rather be here and as far away from that war-mongering, lying, fear-enducing, election-stealing, uneducated, over-privledged, murdering idiot named Bush as possible.

So you can be under that war-mongering, lying, fear-inducing idiot Tony Blair?

I often feel as though I have to apologize for being an American - how many of you feel the same?

I hate feeling ashamed of my nationality because of one man.

Sure Clinton got someone doing the dirty with him when he was in office, but he did his job, and I thought he was a great president. I was proud to be an American then.

I love many many many things about the UK, the government is NOT one of them, but I am happy to have waited and to be going back nearer the time that Bush is going out.

/end rant LOL

Oh...I feel like people EXPECT me to apologize for being American, but I refuse to apologize for something I had no control over. I think it pisses off some British people that I'm not appropriately penitent for my Americanness, but I don't really care what they think. (Not caring about what they think also tends to piss them off.)

Right now I can't think of anything about the UK that I love. I can ENJOY some aspects of life here, but those aspects aren't unique to the UK. I honestly have no love for this country.

[meauxna 15]

hunh---it's great to finally hear the other side of the conversation--usually I read the threads of (mainly Brits, cause it's a Brit expat group..) with all their reasons why they would never pledge allegiance to the US. I always wondered vaguely what the other side would have to say (the complaints look vaguely similar, btw). I've maintained that the reason I'll never wind up with my red passport is because I couldn't bear to live over there the requisite 3 years (neither could he). My advantage focus was always on the ease of living elsewhere in the EU.

And LadyUK, oh yes on the apologies. I was in Greece on 9/11 and didn't get back to the US til a couple of years later. My folks have been living in Spain part time since then too and have experienced the same.

Be ready for a shock when you get back here, gals. It's a wacky world.

[homesick_american 1]

hunh---it's great to finally hear the other side of the conversation--usually I read the threads of (mainly Brits, cause it's a Brit expat group..) with all their reasons why they would never pledge allegiance to the US. I always wondered vaguely what the other side would have to say (the complaints look vaguely similar, btw). I've maintained that the reason I'll never wind up with my red passport is because I couldn't bear to live over there the requisite 3 years (neither could he). My advantage focus was always on the ease of living elsewhere in the EU.

And LadyUK, oh yes on the apologies. I was in Greece on 9/11 and didn't get back to the US til a couple of years later. My folks have been living in Spain part time since then too and have experienced the same.

Be ready for a shock when you get back here, gals. It's a wacky world.

I've visited since then; I'm sure it won't be terribly shocking after living inside George Orwell's '1984' for six years. I feel so SPIED ON in this country; I hate it. It's such a nanny state too; you can't make any decision for yourself.

One of the things that drives me REALLY nuts is the culture at work. In every company I worked for in Texas, if your boss told you to do something...you did it. Project due on Friday? Project READY on Friday. Software release next Tuesday? Software READY to release next Tuesday, or at least we busted our asses trying. Here, you have to practically BEG some people to do their jobs. There's this guy at work who is driving us nuts; the boss told him he needed to shift his database from Access 97 to SQL Server, and booked some time with me to help him with the transition. The guy...whom I'll call Bob...has dragged his feet petulantly throughout the entire process and has not taken on board anything I've told him. It has been like pulling teeth to get any information out of him whatsoever, and now he's full of excuses as to why he can't do any work on this particular project even though the boss has told him it takes HIGHEST priority over anything else he's doing. Bob just won't listen. The boss came up to me the other day and said "How can I convince Bob to do his job?" I was like..."Hell if I know; where I come from we'd have fired him by now."

...also...this job is NOTHING compared to my last one. I could write a book about the last company I worked for.

[LadyUK 0]

yep, I work in the same field, the company "a friend" is currently contracted to has a few like this.

Deadlines are very relaxed & goalposts are always being moved.

Its why the company has been working on this piece of software for over 3 years with no releases (my "friend" has only been with them for about 18 months).

Because employees have so many rights here in the UK, the ones who are slackers take advantage knowing that if you have employed them for over a year, firing them is damn near impossible.

Making their workday hell isn't, if you are careful.

If you don't trust them with getting work done, don't give them anything of importance to work on.

Make them responsible for typing up letters and administrative tasks and task them with impossible deadlines.

Take away any and all responsibility, especially of staff, and make them report to you daily.

Someone at "a friend's workplace" came to work one day (project manager of this software thats taking so long to have any outcome, who lied on his CV to get the job and really has no IT qualifications or experience) to find that not only has his role moved to the side, he has no more staff management duties, he has no say over decisions, his only role is to type up specifications, and one of his staff members was now his boss.

Everyone in their office is waiting patiently to see how it all ends up.

But this guy is a right b*stard and loves to bully people. Now that he has no power, he can't and it kills him.

Make sure that you adhere to every minute detail of their contract and your employee handbook, but nothing more.

They will soon leave on their own accord, but you may have to be patient.

I have no patience for slackers and timewasters. As Larry the Cable Guy says, Get Er Done!

Edited April 14, 2007 by LadyUK

[homesick_american 1]

Someone at "a friend's workplace" came to work one day (project manager of this software thats taking so long to have any outcome, who lied on his CV to get the job and really has no IT qualifications or experience) to find that not only has his role moved to the side, he has no more staff management duties, he has no say over decisions, his only role is to type up specifications, and one of his staff members was now his boss.

Everyone in their office is waiting patiently to see how it all ends up.

But this guy is a right b*stard and loves to bully people. Now that he has no power, he can't and it kills him.

Make sure that you adhere to every minute detail of their contract and your employee handbook, but nothing more.

They will soon leave on their own accord, but you may have to be patient.

I have no patience for slackers and timewasters. As Larry the Cable Guy says, Get Er Done!

Be careful with that guy; he might be able to get your company for constructive dismissal. Making someone's life hell so they'll quit because you can't fire them is basically the same as firing them. I would think lying on his CV about his qualifications would be enough to fire him outright; if it isn't, it makes me more glad we're going to TX! Wooo!

This job isn't bad; it's not a place I'd want to work forever, and they did offer me a permanent position. I turned it down because we're leaving, but even if we weren't I probably would have turned it down anyway. The two people I work with 90% of the time are great; some of the others of them are annoying, but it's easy enough to deal with them when I know I'm leaving.

[LadyUK 0]

Well, I have not heard anyone outright say that that is what they are doing - but its pretty obvious.

I have written proof that this guy hasn't developed some of the sites/software he has claimed to have worked on - funnily enough the UK Home Office. They have never heard of him and weren't happy that he has made these claims.

The directors at this particular company where this guy is are always very hesitant to fire someone - I don't understand the reasoning - in fact I have yet to see it done - they just get moved to a different office/role.

I suppose SOMEONE has to type up the specifications and documents, and I am sure glad it isn't me

[homesick_american 1]

Well, I have not heard anyone outright say that that is what they are doing - but its pretty obvious.

I have written proof that this guy hasn't developed some of the sites/software he has claimed to have worked on - funnily enough the UK Home Office. They have never heard of him and weren't happy that he has made these claims.

The directors at this particular company where this guy is are always very hesitant to fire someone - I don't understand the reasoning - in fact I have yet to see it done - they just get moved to a different office/role.

I suppose SOMEONE has to type up the specifications and documents, and I am sure glad it isn't me

Yeah; documentation sucks. I was in SQA for 8 years and a good deal of what I did was documentation; unlike programmers, quality analysts have to write down everything they do. Now that I'm programming I find writing documentation to be a pain in the rear and I rarely do it; since I test my own app it hasn't been an issue.