Polyamorous marriage and permanent residence

[AdamEve&Steve 1]

3 minutes ago, Ontarkie said:

The side guy could be a problem, the new guy can be a problem. You never said what status he had lost? Immigration could very well believe he is using you to regain legal status. 

New guy was on F-1 status before. I mean, the only reason for denial should be if the marriage is not bona fide, which it is. Intention of regaining legal status should not be a reason for denial, right? After all, arranged marriages are done purely to get immigration benefits, which does not make them illegitimate marriages.

[Mollie09 1,543]

23 minutes ago, AdamEve&Steve said:

New guy was on F-1 status before. I mean, the only reason for denial should be if the marriage is not bona fide, which it is. Intention of regaining legal status should not be a reason for denial, right? After all, arranged marriages are done purely to get immigration benefits, which does not make them illegitimate marriages.

 

Could make your burden of proof heavier.

[NigeriaorBust 4,087]

  The biggest issue you may have is if you and Adam own anything in common.  Jointly titled homes/car/ ??    may make it appear that you had a common law relationship (  what is the common law status of your state ?)  

[Teddy B 17,252]

14 hours ago, N-o-l-a said:

This actually comes up from time to time here.  As long as you have a bonafide relationship and your marriage is legal, i.e. not polygamous, then it should not be a problem.

 

Sometimes it is better not to mention what goes on in your bedroom if not asked.

In my opinion, this is the best advice given.

 

You will need to prove a bonafide relationship/marriage with Steve. there is no need to bring up Adam unless that issue is persued by USCIS, which unless there is property in yours and Adams names together or some other official record of you two being together, it will more than likely not come up. If it does come up, I would not mention anything about a 3 way marriage, that is illegal in most, if not all states. (I say most, because at one time I believe it was legal in Utah, not sure if it still is). If it is brought up, then you are swingers. The swinging lifestyle may be frowned upon by some, but it is not illegal and not a reason for an immigration denial.

 

I'm not sure if the advice given here, including my own, may breach the VJ TOS, giving advice to circumvent the laws. If it is, mods please delete my post.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Teddy B

[Limey 551]

2 hours ago, AdamEve&Steve said:

New guy was on F-1 status before. I mean, the only reason for denial should be if the marriage is not bona fide, which it is. Intention of regaining legal status should not be a reason for denial, right? After all, arranged marriages are done purely to get immigration benefits, which does not make them illegitimate marriages.

I think that is a broad generalisation about arranged marriages. I know several people who have had them (from various cultures). Some have worked, and some haven't. The intention is normally to provide a long term marriage. All of the ones I know were between people who already had status in their various countries, so no suggestion is was done for immigration benefits (one of them was a US marriage).

 

Its not something I would opt for, but its up to those who choose to do it. You could argue that many of the marriages on these forums are for immigration reasons, if you consider that many people would have been quite happy living together unmarried, but this wasn't possible, and the only option was to marry to be together. That doesn't mean that the marriage wasn't based on love and with an intention to stay together permanently.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Limey

[aayitrun 66]

brown indian guy named 'steve'? i call bs.

 

lol

 

i think your case is somewhat unique and its going to be hard to find precedent.

if you are really marrying steve, then file AOS for him after marriage and i think the burden of proof is that you are in a real marriage that is being consummated. no form asks whether or not you sleep with other people. however when they ask who else lives with you and you mention adam and if they dive deeper, all bets are off.

[lyzdude 2]

I think it's generally a good idea not to offer the government any unrequested information.  To my recollection, there wouldn't even be any place in any paperwork where you would be providing any information about your relationship with Adam, unless you have been married to him in the past.  So unless they ask, you don't need to provide any information about Adam.

 

Now, would they ever had any reason to ask you about Adam?  Well, that's probably a very good question.

 

A green card (or more accurately a permanent resident status) will only be valid for 2 years, if the green card is based on marriage to a USC and the marriage is less than 2 years old.  Therefore, if you get married to Steve and he gets a green card before your second anniversary, his green card will only be valid for two years and you guys will need to apply for the removal of that conditional permanent residence at the end of those two years.  So it wouldn't be smooth sailing yet even after you marriage and his initial green card.

[dawning 212]

19 hours ago, NigeriaorBust said:

 Immigration isn't moral police they are enforcer laws.  Even though most people will see your relationship as immoral it is not illegal in most places assuming the 3rd member of your group is not collecting benefits as a spouse to either of the other 2 at the moment. This is especially true if you live in a no fault state where sex outside of the marriage is  NOT ground for divorce.

I think it's best if you speak for yourself.  While I myself am not really interested in practicing polyamory, I don't find consensual sex between adults in any number or combination immoral, and I think that saying "most people would say it's immoral" makes open discourse harder to have and pushes people who might be judged for being outside the norm further into the shadows.  Ten years ago many would have written that about a same-sex relationship, however we are now in a situation where a majority of the US population sees same sex relationships as just as valid as heterosexual ones.   

 

The other point that people sometimes miss is that polyamory isn't just about "what goes on in the bedroom".  As USCIS requirements show, a marriage or long-term relationship is much more than just sex.  I think the OP has a valid point in that if USCIS somehow finds out/knows that she is in a relationship with Adam at the same time as she is married to Steve they might argue that the relationship with Steve is just for immigration benefits, as the more dominant norm in the US is for people to see fidelity and the requirement of fidelity as an evidence of a bonafide relationship. I'm thinking maybe in some ways the question is not just "can I/do I have to hide my relationship to Adam" but also "If they find out will they assume we are not for genuine in our relationship?"  Which is understandable, as many people in polyamorous relationships have that experience with friends and family and casual acquaintances. Friends and family don't have the same power over us as USCIS officers, however.

 

Good luck OP.  If you do proceed perhaps you can come back and tell your experience so that others can learn from it.

[QueenComley 295]

1 hour ago, aayitrun said:

brown indian guy named 'steve'? i call bs.

 

lol

 

i think your case is somewhat unique and its going to be hard to find precedent.

if you are really marrying steve, then file AOS for him after marriage and i think the burden of proof is that you are in a real marriage that is being consummated. no form asks whether or not you sleep with other people. however when they ask who else lives with you and you mention adam and if they dive deeper, all bets are off.

Its already been established that Steve is a false name, though to describe him as a brown Indian guy was rather unique

 

OP, aayitrun is correct , marry Steve, file AOS and go from there. Whether you have consummated your marriage is neither here nor there, but you will need to provide proof of a genuine financial co-mingling relationship.

[string_beats 15]

Its a red flag, Polygamy does not exist Indian Culture. India is still very conservative and is not common that Indian man is okay with her girl friend or wife have relationship with someone else. If Steve is okay with it then Immigration officer going to grill you all to figure out if this marriage is for green card. I think Adam needs to be out of this picture in order for you all to make this work or Visa denial chances are extremely high!

Edited March 16, 2017 by string_beats

[NigeriaorBust 4,087]

4 hours ago, dawning said:

I think it's best if you speak for yourself.  While I myself am not really interested in practicing polyamory, I don't find consensual sex between adults in any number or combination immoral, and I think that saying "most people would say it's immoral" makes open discourse harder to have and pushes people who might be judged for being outside the norm further into the shadows.  Ten years ago many would have written that about a same-sex relationship, however we are now in a situation where a majority of the US population sees same sex relationships as just as valid as heterosexual ones.   

 

The other point that people sometimes miss is that polyamory isn't just about "what goes on in the bedroom".  As USCIS requirements show, a marriage or long-term relationship is much more than just sex.  I think the OP has a valid point in that if USCIS somehow finds out/knows that she is in a relationship with Adam at the same time as she is married to Steve they might argue that the relationship with Steve is just for immigration benefits, as the more dominant norm in the US is for people to see fidelity and the requirement of fidelity as an evidence of a bonafide relationship. I'm thinking maybe in some ways the question is not just "can I/do I have to hide my relationship to Adam" but also "If they find out will they assume we are not for genuine in our relationship?"  Which is understandable, as many people in polyamorous relationships have that experience with friends and family and casual acquaintances. Friends and family don't have the same power over us as USCIS officers, however.

 

Good luck OP.  If you do proceed perhaps you can come back and tell your experience so that others can learn from it.

   If you read the rest of my posts I have done nothing but support answering the questions presented without over stepping TOS .   In the modern age of inflated home prices it isn't uncommon for several couples to get a leg up on housing by buying a home jointly with a contract to sell at the end of X years so depending on where they are it may not seem abnormal.  The thing is what would the neighbors tell a field investigator.

[Ontarkie 14,565]

22 hours ago, AdamEve&Steve said:

New guy was on F-1 status before. I mean, the only reason for denial should be if the marriage is not bona fide, which it is. Intention of regaining legal status should not be a reason for denial, right? After all, arranged marriages are done purely to get immigration benefits, which does not make them illegitimate marriages.

Yes people are denied if they marry just for immigration benefits. Arranged marriages are not just for immigration, they are a  choice that couples and family make in hopes that the two will have a long successful marriage. 

 

 

[geowrian 22,338]

22 hours ago, AdamEve&Steve said:

New guy was on F-1 status before. I mean, the only reason for denial should be if the marriage is not bona fide, which it is. Intention of regaining legal status should not be a reason for denial, right? After all, arranged marriages are done purely to get immigration benefits, which does not make them illegitimate marriages.

A denial can be for many different reasons, but the marriage not being bona fide is the one most likely to be relevant here (from their perspective). Intention to regain legal status is not an issue, but they may believe that he is just using you to get a green card. Or that he paid you or promised you some benefit to help him get a green card. People do that with immigration. Proving that the relationship is real is how you overcome possible suspicions like that.

 

Arranged marriages are done purely to get immigration benefits? No, that's not at all how that works with the US. A marriage purely for that purpose should not succeed at obtaining a visa or green card. They are not just looking at if a legal marriage occurred (getting legally married is usually extremely easy) - they need to prove a legitimate relationship as well. Marrying for the purpose of obtaining a US immigration benefit is not permitted. Sure, there are people who do arranged marriages for that reason, and I'm sure some succeed, but that just means some people succeed at abusing the system (making it harder for legitimate couples).

[dawning 212]

On 3/16/2017 at 9:02 PM, NigeriaorBust said:

   If you read the rest of my posts I have done nothing but support answering the questions presented without over stepping TOS .   In the modern age of inflated home prices it isn't uncommon for several couples to get a leg up on housing by buying a home jointly with a contract to sell at the end of X years so depending on where they are it may not seem abnormal.  The thing is what would the neighbors tell a field investigator.

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you weren't being supportive or giving accurate advice.  I was just expressing an opinion that when we make statements like "most people feel your lifestyle is immoral", it has a chilling effect on open discussion, never mind that they may also not be accurate.

What the neighbors would say depends not only on how conservative the neighborhood is, but also how much the neighbors know or speculate about the OP's personal life.  Difficult to control for in any case, including non-polyamorous marriages.

[Boiler 46,312]

10 minutes ago, dawning said:

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you weren't being supportive or giving accurate advice.  I was just expressing an opinion that when we make statements like "most people feel your lifestyle is immoral", it has a chilling effect on open discussion, never mind that they may also not be accurate.

What the neighbors would say depends not only on how conservative the neighborhood is, but also how much the neighbors know or speculate about the OP's personal life.  Difficult to control for in any case, including non-polyamorous marriages.

Some years back where I lived there was a polyamorous triple, seemed that everybody knew.