Expedited Naturalization? Yet another question. Wrong advise from counselor?

[Roel 7,192]

After going through many informative websites about a possible expedited naturalization for military spouse, I finally decided to go to the immigration counselor residing on post.

 

And I feel like she gave me an advice that is completely different than what I read on VJ and USCIS websites.

 

Those are websites I'm talking about: https://www.uscis.gov/policymanual/HTML/PolicyManual-Volume12-PartG-Chapter4.html 

and https://www.uscis.gov/policymanual/HTML/PolicyManual-Volume12-PartG-Chapter5.html

 

First what the immigration advisor told me today: I'm not eligible for the expedited naturalization. I have to first remove conditions on my green card, wait a year and then (based on the 3 year rule) file for naturalization.

 

What websites says: Sure I can file for expedite naturalization anytime as long as I have military orders for my husband and me and I don't even have to do RoC.

 

(A spouse of a U.S. citizen employed abroad based on authorized employment is not required to have any specific period of residence or physical presence in order to naturalize. ^[9] Consequently, a CPR spouse is not required to file the petition to remove conditions if the spouse files his or her naturalization application before he or she reaches the 90-day filing period to remove the conditions on residence. ^[10]

A CPR spouse of a U.S. citizen employed abroad may naturalize without filing a petition to remove conditions if:

•The CPR spouse has been a CPR for less than one year and nine months; and

•The CPR spouse does not reach the 90-day filing period for the petition to remove conditions prior to the final adjudication of his or her naturalization application or the time of the Oath of Allegiance. ^[11] )

 

 

I'm genuinely confused.

 

We are PCSing to Germany either March or July (depending on our expedite request). My conditional green card expires in September. I know that this summer is when my 90 day RoC window opens.

What I'd like to do (if possible) is apply for naturalization maybe before we go to Germany or as soon as we get there, without the need of going through the RoC.

 

I'd really like for someone who went through the expedite process to advise me on what to do here. Am I eligible? When can I file? Was the immigration advisor right or are USCIS websites right?

 

Thank you in advance.

[Villanelle 4,122]

You said "We are PCSing to Germany either March or July (depending on our expedite request)" 

 

What does that mean? Do you actually have orders right now or not?

[Penguin_ie 5,993]

It sounds like you are currently in the USA?  And thus not elligible for expedite.  

[Roel 7,192]

Yes, I'm in the USA right now. Our pcs date is currently in June and that's what we have orders for. But we requested this to be expedited and possibly leave in March.

 

Well, duh, I know I can't file it from USA and not now.

 

What I want to know if I can file for expedited citizenship AFTER we get to the Germany. And if I should be doing it during 90 roc window or ... when.

 

[Villanelle 4,122]

Actually it can be filed when someone is still in the US- they just have to leave with in so many days after getting sworn in to join the spouse overseas... But anyway-

How ROC and Citizenship intersect- as you can see in the quotes you posted above its all about the timing. When you get the conditional card it 'expires' at the 2yr mark. I use the word expire lightly. Technically you need to file ROC (and you can do so up to 90 days in advance) to keep your status and get the 10 yr card. When you file the ROC form the date on your card still matters- so technically once the date in Sept occurs, you go from being a solid 2yr GC holder to a 'pending ROC approval' GC holder until you are approved and get the 10 yr GC. Does that make sense? 

 

Its a very minor technical difference because a GC holder is a GC holder for all intents and purposes EXCEPT for naturalization. For naturalization you either need to be (and have it done) in the period of time that you are a solid 2yr GC holder OR if you slip into the 'pending ROC approval' GC holder classification during the naturalization process then USCIS is required to complete the ROC process to make you a solid 10yr card holder to get the naturalization. Do you understand?

 

So its all about the timing. If you can apply and get approved for citizenship prior to the date on your current GC then you do not need to ROC. If you can not, and the date of your citizenship approval will be after the date your current card expires you need to file for ROC and they will process them both at the same time.

--------

 

I do not know why the advisor told you what they did. Often there is other info that is left out of the story? The only things I can think of is there is also clauses about how long the overseas assignment has to last. I believe they have to have at least 1 year remaining overseas AFTER you naturalize. Could that be it? The application process will take about 5 months or so. 

 

Playing with some dates- if you get approved to leave in March and go and file overseas immediately thats 5 months so around Aug? so you might not have to ROC. Anything past that and you would have to file the ROC. 

[Roel 7,192]

Thank you, Damara!

That's a very detailed answer and I think I understand now.

 

I told the advisor exactly what I read on the immigration websites but she just kept telling me what I already know about the "regular" order - 2 year card, roc, citizenship after 3 years of marriage. I didn't leave anything out.

 

We are going to be oversees for at least 3 years. If we manage to leave to Germany in March, I'll be filling for the naturalization then.

 

Thanks again!

[Roel 7,192]

On 1/7/2017 at 2:37 PM, Damara said:

Actually it can be filed when someone is still in the US- they just have to leave with in so many days after getting sworn in to join the spouse overseas... But anyway-

How ROC and Citizenship intersect- as you can see in the quotes you posted above its all about the timing. When you get the conditional card it 'expires' at the 2yr mark. I use the word expire lightly. Technically you need to file ROC (and you can do so up to 90 days in advance) to keep your status and get the 10 yr card. When you file the ROC form the date on your card still matters- so technically once the date in Sept occurs, you go from being a solid 2yr GC holder to a 'pending ROC approval' GC holder until you are approved and get the 10 yr GC. Does that make sense? 

 

Its a very minor technical difference because a GC holder is a GC holder for all intents and purposes EXCEPT for naturalization. For naturalization you either need to be (and have it done) in the period of time that you are a solid 2yr GC holder OR if you slip into the 'pending ROC approval' GC holder classification during the naturalization process then USCIS is required to complete the ROC process to make you a solid 10yr card holder to get the naturalization. Do you understand?

 

So its all about the timing. If you can apply and get approved for citizenship prior to the date on your current GC then you do not need to ROC. If you can not, and the date of your citizenship approval will be after the date your current card expires you need to file for ROC and they will process them both at the same time.

--------

 

I do not know why the advisor told you what they did. Often there is other info that is left out of the story? The only things I can think of is there is also clauses about how long the overseas assignment has to last. I believe they have to have at least 1 year remaining overseas AFTER you naturalize. Could that be it? The application process will take about 5 months or so. 

 

Playing with some dates- if you get approved to leave in March and go and file overseas immediately thats 5 months so around Aug? so you might not have to ROC. Anything past that and you would have to file the ROC. 

And just to make sure...

I have to physically be oversees to send out expedited naturalization paperwork yes?

Just having PCS orders to go there isn't enough?

[Villanelle 4,122]

Sorry- I didnt see you posted again! Im having trouble with the new forums lol.

You CAN file for naturalization from the US or from overseas it seems.  If you are in the US you need to promise to leave with in so many days after taking the oath. So its a timing thing- because if you go that route then you may have to wait to join your spouse. Im not sure if you can convert an application that you are going to complete in the US to one being completed overseas. 

I can tell you for any application (here or there) you need to meet all the qualifications to apply and have it accepted. So Im not sure if simply having the orders is enough to qualify in the US or if your spouse actually needs to be overseas for you to file in either scenario.

 

Was the person you spoke to the 'immigration consular' from the military? They are suppose to have someone in a job like that that can help you. Perhaps theres someone else or you can ask them to confer with someone in the same job but different location if they are not giving you answers that match whats written here. There is also a special 800 number for USCIS FOR MILITARY. I do not have it off hand but you can google it- its on the USCIS homepage somewhere. I know that # can give case info and stuff- so that the military people dont wait on hold forever like the ordinary folks do. They may also be able to answer these questions.

[Lenchick 133]

On 06.01.2017 at 6:44 PM, Roel said:

After going through many informative websites about a possible expedited naturalization for military spouse, I finally decided to go to the immigration counselor residing on post.

 

And I feel like she gave me an advice that is completely different than what I read on VJ and USCIS websites.

 

Those are websites I'm talking about: https://www.uscis.gov/policymanual/HTML/PolicyManual-Volume12-PartG-Chapter4.html 

and https://www.uscis.gov/policymanual/HTML/PolicyManual-Volume12-PartG-Chapter5.html

 

First what the immigration advisor told me today: I'm not eligible for the expedited naturalization. I have to first remove conditions on my green card, wait a year and then (based on the 3 year rule) file for naturalization.

 

What websites says: Sure I can file for expedite naturalization anytime as long as I have military orders for my husband and me and I don't even have to do RoC.

 

(A spouse of a U.S. citizen employed abroad based on authorized employment is not required to have any specific period of residence or physical presence in order to naturalize. ^[9] Consequently, a CPR spouse is not required to file the petition to remove conditions if the spouse files his or her naturalization application before he or she reaches the 90-day filing period to remove the conditions on residence. ^[10]

 

A CPR spouse of a U.S. citizen employed abroad may naturalize without filing a petition to remove conditions if:

 

•The CPR spouse has been a CPR for less than one year and nine months; and

 

•The CPR spouse does not reach the 90-day filing period for the petition to remove conditions prior to the final adjudication of his or her naturalization application or the time of the Oath of Allegiance. ^[11] )

 

 

I'm genuinely confused.

 

We are PCSing to Germany either March or July (depending on our expedite request). My conditional green card expires in September. I know that this summer is when my 90 day RoC window opens.

What I'd like to do (if possible) is apply for naturalization maybe before we go to Germany or as soon as we get there, without the need of going through the RoC.

 

I'd really like for someone who went through the expedite process to advise me on what to do here. Am I eligible? When can I file? Was the immigration advisor right or are USCIS websites right?

 

Thank you in advance.

you found the right information. After you file and you can file from the US, and they accept it you need to join your husband within 30-45 days after naturalization. You need to have proofs etc. tickets. You can file under 319b. If you file and then go overseas, you will have to get back for the interview and the oath. They do the same day ceremonies. You can also file from overseas. But for militaries who want to be interviewed overseas, I guess you need to remove conditions. I am not sure about details about being interviewed overseas. I am only talking about 319b for those who apply from the state or from overseas

Edited January 15, 2017 by Lenchick

[Lenchick 133]

On 07.01.2017 at 2:53 PM, Penguin_ie said:

It sounds like you are currently in the USA?  And thus not elligible for expedite.  

why to say something if you don't know. Yes, people who are in the USA can be eligible too if they meet certain requirements

[Sabrina&Chuck 32]

Now I join the conversation ..hows that process with a just 2 year GC ? Can I do this expedited naturalization for military spouse too? We will be going to Korea in August, and I do have to file 6 months prior the BBG ( I do not want to trash my German citizenship that's what the BBG is for pretty much a allowance of Germany to keep this citizenship while applying and 'joining' the US citizenship). Now I got my Green card last year in June...how do I go about this?

[Lenchick 133]

1 minute ago, Sabrina&Chuck said:

Now I join the conversation ..hows that process with a just 2 year GC ? Can I do this expedited naturalization for military spouse too? We will be going to Korea in August, and I do have to file 6 months prior the BBG ( I do not want to trash my German citizenship that's what the BBG is for pretty much a allowance of Germany to keep this citizenship while applying and 'joining' the US citizenship). Now I got my Green card last year in June...how do I go about this?

Hi! What is BBG? 

 

As for expedited naturalization, you can apply if your spouse will be stationed overseas for at least one year from the moment you file your application.  Have you already got 10 year card or is it conditional? 

[Sabrina&Chuck 32]

Ya he will be gone 2 years and I will be on the orders as well (we have a not even 1 year old yet). BBG means Beibehaltungsgesetz which pretty much is nothing else than a Law to keep your citizenship which u had from birth on..which is ridiculously stupid to me but that's the rule .if I do not apply for this BBG before I attend the Oath ceremony i'd lose my german citizenship and probably never get it back.

[Lenchick 133]

1 minute ago, Sabrina&Chuck said:

Ya he will be gone 2 years and I will be on the orders as well (we have a not even 1 year old yet). BBG means Beibehaltungsgesetz which pretty much is nothing else than a Law to keep your citizenship which u had from birth on..which is ridiculously stupid to me but that's the rule .if I do not apply for this BBG before I attend the Oath ceremony i'd lose my german citizenship and probably never get it back.

Then you need to apply for BBG first. Americans don't care if you have another citizenship. I mean their law doesn't enforce you to give it up, you only must give up allegiance to any other country and be loyal only to the US but no one will enforce you to give up your other passport or renounce officially your other citizenship. But for US you will be only a US citizen. 

[Sabrina&Chuck 32]

4 minutes ago, Lenchick said:

Then you need to apply for BBG first. Americans don't care if you have another citizenship. I mean their law doesn't enforce you to give it up, you only must give up allegiance to any other country and be loyal only to the US but no one will enforce you to give up your other passport or renounce officially your other citizenship. But for US you will be only a US citizen. 

Yes I do have this one first that's right and hope to get approved so my reasons have to be good to them..ugh..