Spicer hints Obama's Russian sanctions 'politically motivated

[MarkPerry 488]

18 hours ago, ccneat said:

Does Russia have an issue with ISIS or ISIS inspired attacks?

[millefleur 5,046]

22 minutes ago, MarkPerry said:

Does Russia have an issue with ISIS or ISIS inspired attacks?

It's not that common here. There have been terror incidents but I don't recall anything claimed by ISIS.

 

The Russian police aggressively target "Muslim-looking" men carrying bags and other suspicious materials in the metro/city centers here. The police racially profile people, in short. It has been claimed that this has stopped many attacks. I'm not saying this is a good thing, but Russia (so far, *crosses fingers*) has had significantly fewer attacks than in other countries it seems.

 

I guess the idea is: live in a less-free country, get fewer terror attacks? Trade a little bit of your freedoms/standards of living for safety? Something along those lines.

Edited January 3, 2017 by millefleur

[MarkPerry 488]

23 minutes ago, millefleur said:

It's not that common here. There have been terror incidents but I don't recall anything claimed by ISIS.

 

The Russian police aggressively target "Muslim-looking" men carrying bags and other suspicious materials in the metro/city centers here. The police racially profile people, in short. It has been claimed that this has stopped many attacks. I'm not saying this is a good thing, but Russia (so far, *crosses fingers*) has had significantly fewer attacks than in other countries it seems.

 

I guess the idea is: live in a less-free country, get fewer terror attacks? Trade a little bit of your freedoms/standards of living for safety? Something along those lines.

I have no issue of them racially profiling "muslim-looking". It seems as if it is very effective in Russia. 

 

At some point if we in USA keep having this terrorist stuff rising, we have to do something more aggressive.  We have let a lot of people in from countries where ISIS has a presence.   Protect America and our people at all cost, if you have to racial or religious profile, then I am good with it.

[bcking 3,157]

1 minute ago, MarkPerry said:

I have no issue of them racially profiling "muslim-looking". It seems as if it is very effective in Russia. 

 

At some point if we in USA keep having this terrorist stuff rising, we have to do something more aggressive.  We have let a lot of people in from countries where ISIS has a presence.   Protect America and our people at all cost, if you have to racial or religious profile, then I am good with it.

What about "our people" who are "muslim-looking"? You realize we have citizens who are "muslim-looking"? So you are saying profile and assume US citizens are guilty on the street to benefit everyone else?

 

Perhaps something should be done about immigration/illegals, however racial profiling I don't think is the answer because US citizens end up suffering as well.

[MarkPerry 488]

12 minutes ago, bcking said:

What about "our people" who are "muslim-looking"? You realize we have citizens who are "muslim-looking"? So you are saying profile and assume US citizens are guilty on the street to benefit everyone else?

 

Perhaps something should be done about immigration/illegals, however racial profiling I don't think is the answer because US citizens end up suffering as well.

I was taken for an Iranian back when they took the Embassy in Iran. Yes I am aware we have US citizens that are "muslim-looking".

 

If the issue continues or gets worst, then yes I am good with it.   

[bcking 3,157]

31 minutes ago, MarkPerry said:

I was taken for an Iranian back when they took the Embassy in Iran. Yes I am aware we have US citizens that are "muslim-looking".

 

If the issue continues or gets worst, then yes I am good with it.   

Ya we clearly differ (surprise surprise) since I would have a problem with it. Muslim Citizens are a minority. So first it would be the "White majority" allowing racial profiling. What can the muslim citizens do? They are a minority. If we put it to a vote, they lose. Next step is some sort of "list" of all muslim citizens, where they have to identify themselves. Again, they are a minority so what can they do? Then after that we figure won't it be easier for us to watch them if we put them into small communities? Again, what can they do? Those communities then become internment camps.

Where do we draw the line? Every US Citizen is a US citizen and deserves the same rights as everyone else. I agree that it is a problem when terrorists look a certain way and some citizens look the same. However I don't think our country should make a smaller group of citizens suffer because of that. We have to find other ways to fix the problem. Maybe it would be easy to do it that way, but I think what should separate the US from some other countries (Like Russia) is that sometimes we don't let ourselves choose the easiest path when that path is wrong.

[MarkPerry 488]

4 minutes ago, bcking said:

Ya we clearly differ (surprise surprise) since I would have a problem with it. Muslim Citizens are a minority. So first it would be the "White majority" allowing racial profiling. What can the muslim citizens do? They are a minority. If we put it to a vote, they lose. Next step is some sort of "list" of all muslim citizens, where they have to identify themselves. Again, they are a minority so what can they do? Then after that we figure won't it be easier for us to watch them if we put them into small communities? Again, what can they do? Those communities then become internment camps.

Where do we draw the line? Every US Citizen is a US citizen and deserves the same rights as everyone else. I agree that it is a problem when terrorists look a certain way and some citizens look the same. However I don't think our country should make a smaller group of citizens suffer because of that. We have to find other ways to fix the problem. Maybe it would be easy to do it that way, but I think what should separate the US from some other countries (Like Russia) is that sometimes we don't let ourselves choose the easiest path when that path is wrong.

We have let way too many bad eggs into the country, you can see it by the constant ISIS inspired bombing, shooting, car driving over people.  We have to vet people much better for people coming into the USA.  That will help, but we need to deal with the bad eggs that are here and weed them out.  I don't like the thought or racial or religion profiling, but at some point you have to throw out being politically correct and protect your people.

[bcking 3,157]

8 minutes ago, MarkPerry said:

We have let way too many bad eggs into the country, you can see it by the constant ISIS inspired bombing, shooting, car driving over people.  We have to vet people much better for people coming into the USA.  That will help, but we need to deal with the bad eggs that are here and weed them out.  I don't like the thought or racial or religion profiling, but at some point you have to throw out being politically correct and protect your people.

When you say we've let "bad eggs" here are you talking about US citizens? Again I have a problem when you say "protect your people". Many muslims in the US are our people. They are my coworkers, my old classmates, my neighbours etc... I want to protect them just as much as I want to protect "white" Americans.

[Teddy B 17,252]

On 1/1/2017 at 7:47 PM, Dakine10 said:

  The congressional Republicans are criticizing him for not doing enough and the Trump brigade are saying he went too far. Hopefully they can all kiss and make up when they need to start working together in a couple of weeks.

 

It appears that Trump's strongest opposition might come from inside his own party. I think we're looking at 4 years of in-fighting between Trump and fellow republicans.

[MarkPerry 488]

3 minutes ago, bcking said:

When you say we've let "bad eggs" here are you talking about US citizens? Again I have a problem when you say "protect your people". Many muslims in the US are our people. They are my coworkers, my old classmates, my neighbours etc... I want to protect them just as much as I want to protect "white" Americans.

Bad eggs is anyone wanting to do harm to people living in the USA.  It seems that many are either LPR or 1st generation Americans.  I want to protect our people living here legally, white black, yellow, red, brown, albino, etc.

[bcking 3,157]

7 minutes ago, MarkPerry said:

Bad eggs is anyone wanting to do harm to people living in the USA.  It seems that many are either LPR or 1st generation Americans.  I want to protect our people living here legally, white black, yellow, red, brown, albino, etc.

Okay so you want to protect the people legally here who are "brown"? So in order to protect them you want to racially profile them and stop them on the street if they are carrying heavy bags? Perhaps like a man just leaving a store buying gifts for his wife? Is that suspicious enough because he is brown? He has a bag that could hold a bomb?

 

So we start doing that in order to "keep us safe". Then we realize we aren't safe enough. Do you want the US citizens who are muslim to be forced to register themselves like sex offenders? Okay then what that makes us no more safe, do you want to round them up and put them into camps? Where would you draw the line if the actions don't make us safe? You say you want to do it to illegals, but if you build the basis of your plan on what people look like or what religion they are you will be doing it to US citizens. Legal residents, 1st, 2nd, 3rd generations and beyond. Perhaps people who have ancestry in this country for as long as you do (maybe longer, definitely longer than some white people who wouldn't be profiled by your plan).

[MarkPerry 488]

We already register people here. I remember being a male I had to register for Selective Service when I turned 18, I don't remember any females having to do that.

 

If I want to vote I have register, if I want to live in USA I have to have health insurance or pay penalty. If I want to Drive I have to register, If I want to carry a Concealed Handgun I have to register, If I want to fish or hunt I need to register, If I want to travel outside of USA I have to register to get a passport, if I want to own a car I have to register my name on a title.  Registering is part of life in USA

[bcking 3,157]

5 minutes ago, MarkPerry said:

We already register people here. I remember being a male I had to register for Selective Service when I turned 18, I don't remember any females having to do that.

 

If I want to vote I have register, if I want to live in USA I have to have health insurance or pay penalty. If I want to Drive I have to register, If I want to carry a Concealed Handgun I have to register, If I want to fish or hunt I need to register, If I want to travel outside of USA I have to register to get a passport, if I want to own a car I have to register my name on a title.  Registering is part of life in USA

So then why don't we form registries for all religions? The religion question is always optional, when it even appears. If we are going to force one group to register due to their religion, we should register everyone according to their religion. For Christians, we can ask people specifically what church they belong to. 

 

And again, are you okay with US citizens suffering to make yourself safer?

[MarkPerry 488]

36 minutes ago, bcking said:

And again, are you okay with US citizens suffering to make yourself safer?

Of Course

 

We already do it.  I used to go hop on a plane board with a hot pizza and a bottle of Crown Royal. Once we got in the air the waitress would pour me and my companions drinks and we would stand around the plane and chat and have a good time. 

 

We suffer already , it is part of life

[bcking 3,157]

2 minutes ago, MarkPerry said:

Of Course

 

We already do it.  I used to go hop on a plane board with a hot pizza and a bottle of Crown Royal. Once we got in the air the waitress would pour me and my companions drinks and we would stand around the plane and chat and have a good time. 

 

We suffer already , it is part of life

My point is a specific group of citizens being made to suffer. Yes of course we all suffer and we all have limitations. However I'd like to think that we don't impose those limitations on citizens of specific religions only. You aren't being made to suffer specifically because you are a white guy. You are asking for "brown" us citizens to be treated differently just because of their skin colour or religious orientation. I can't agree with that.