Texas wife indicted after lover killed

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Without human interaction a gun will hurt no one. Not all gun owners are maniacs.

True - but I still wonder how many people own guns out of a unreasonable fear of being the victims of crime/s whose likelihood of occurrence isn't reflected statistically.

so what if they do?

exactly

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Without human interaction a gun will hurt no one. Not all gun owners are maniacs.

True - but I still wonder how many people own guns out of a unreasonable fear of being the victims of crime/s whose likelihood of occurrence isn't reflected statistically.

so what if they do?

Then accidents (like this one) would be surely be more likely, no?

Suspicion and fear and all that...

[Peikko 1,575]

The guilty should not be gunned down either. The fact is, we have a criminal justice system for a reason and the worrying aspect of this case as it is presented, is that someone has been allowed to take a person's life based on an assumption of another person's guilt. There appears to have been no threat of injury or death and I find it rather incredible that there would have been no possibility for the husband to identify the person to the police and get him arrested. Very, very wrong.

I just wonder what we don't know though.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

The guilty should not be gunned down either. The fact is, we have a criminal justice system for a reason and the worrying aspect of this case as it is presented, is that someone has been allowed to take a person's life based on an assumption of another person's guilt. There appears to have been no threat of injury or death and I find it rather incredible that there would have been no possibility for the husband to identify the person to the police and get him arrested. Very, very wrong.

I just wonder what we don't know though.

Agreed. I'm wondering if the guy had been at the bottle (but that's making an assumption that a late night card game involves alcohol consumption). Similarly, I wonder if the guy's wife had cheated on him before. Easy to speculate on the basis of a short article.

[Peikko 1,575]

That would be up to the jury. He might be acquitted because it was a crime of passion.

I don't remember the last time it was ok to kill someone for having an affair. Crime of passion entails a little bit more than being pissed off because your wife/husband can't keep their pants on.

[almaty 19]

in most states, it can be used to reduce the charges, to manslaughter, the less would be invol....most likely, vol....it is a felony...and the person can do time...or at least, be placed on probation...

[Peikko 1,575]

I wasn't very clear. What I meant was, while it could be argued a crime of passion if you shoot at the moment you find your spouse in the act, ie the heat of the moment, it become less viable as a defence the longer the gap is between the discovery and the action. There is also the point of how many shots are fired. Four shots being fired becomes more an intention to kill than an act of desperation/duress/extreme jealousy.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Without human interaction a gun will hurt no one. Not all gun owners are maniacs.

True - but I still wonder how many people own guns out of a unreasonable fear of being the victims of crime/s whose likelihood of occurrence isn't reflected statistically.

so what if they do?

Then accidents (like this one) would be surely be more likely, no?

Suspicion and fear and all that...

This wasn't an accident. The crime committed was the wife falsely calling rape. The husband intended to kill the rapist.

[Peikko 1,575]

Which is wrong, he should not be allowed to make a judgement that leads him to commit murder, rape or no rape, unless there was some extreme mitigating circumstance such as imminant danger to either himself or his wife. The victim was running away. The guy fired several shots.

No one was in danger and the crime could have been reported and the 'perpetrator' could have been 'brought to justice'.

Falsely calling rape is very wrong and demands jail time, in my opinion, but does not warrent a murder charge.

However, I don't think we have all the facts for this case.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Which is wrong, he should not be allowed to make a judgement that leads him to commit murder, rape or no rape, unless there was some extreme mitigating circumstance such as imminant danger to either himself or his wife. The victim was running away. The guy fired several shots.

No one was in danger and the crime could have been reported and the 'perpetrator' could have been 'brought to justice'.

Falsely calling rape is very wrong and demands jail time, in my opinion, but does not warrent a murder charge.

However, I don't think we have all the facts for this case.

How do you allow or not allow a person to make a split second judgment? People make good and bad judgments every day.

This is why a jury is composed of more than one person (you or me).

"I'd rather me judged by 12 than carried by 6"

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

How do you allow or not allow a person to make a split second judgment? People make good and bad judgments every day.

This is why a jury is composed of more than one person (you or me).

"I'd rather me judged by 12 than carried by 6"

Sure - but most people's bad decisions don't generally include the intentional killing of another human being. That said, I don't think there's really any justification outside of legitimate self defense (if the guy is coming at you with a knife) for taking this sort of action, and I certainly don't think someone should walk off scot-free for "bad judgement".

I think you need to look at the history of these types of cases - most of the time (at least this was the case in the UK) it comes down to whether or not the force was appropriate to the situation you are faced with. Its hardly clear-cut, and the fact that the guy was driving away at the time makes the actions a little questionable - but I think you hit the nail on the head earlier as a "crime of passion". Even so, you shouldn't be able to kill someone without some sort of legal consequence.

[Peikko 1,575]

Clearly, we don't have all the facts in this case, so it's pretty hard to come to definate conclusions. I would say that on principle, it's not ok to make a decision to take someone's life based simply on the idea that the victim has done something criminal however bad the crime or why bother to have a police force and a judicial system?

There has to be some greater ill, for example that there was immediate danger to the 'victim' of the crime or to someone who 'happens' upon the crime. This is where this case appears, at least with the facts presented, to cross the line in terms of 'reasonable force' in that the 'criminal' was attempting to get away rather than being confrontational.

Presumably, there must have been some suggestion that the husband was in a blind rage when faced with the alleged rape which is why he reacted in this fashion (hence the crime of passion scenario). However, even if this is a case of enhanced jealousy, I am still concerned that there was a time elapse between the time he caught the couple in the act and the time the shots were fired as well as the number of shots fired.

Certainly, there should be no precedent for people shooting first and asking questions later when it comes to marital infidelity, or for that matter executing rapists vigilante style.

Edited April 4, 2007 by Purple_Hibiscus

[dalegg 143]

Sure - but most people's bad decisions don't generally include the intentional killing of another human being. That said, I don't think there's really any justification outside of legitimate self defense

How about just cleaning up the scum?

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

We are in 100% agreement over not having all the facts.

I would still hunt down anyone that raped my wife. I only need one person on a jury to see it my way.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Sure - but most people's bad decisions don't generally include the intentional killing of another human being. That said, I don't think there's really any justification outside of legitimate self defense

How about just cleaning up the scum?

Harry Callahan: Well, when an adult male is chasing a female with intent to commit rape, I shoot the #######. That's my policy.

The Mayor: Intent? How did you establish that?

Harry Callahan: When a naked man is chasing a woman through an alley with a butcher's knife and a hard-on, I figure he isn't out collecting for the Red Cross!