Trump's U - turns

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

Well dictators are certainly leaders, but in able to lead they have to get men foolish enough to follow whatever they say.

It may be me, but I didn't know Dictators won fair elections. Just saying

[Rob L 3,811]

Ummmm, the feelings and the opinions of the people of this country have already been heard. Did you forget Nov 8th already?

Two memorable days in US history... 9/11 and 11/9.

I was talking about the undue influence of Putin on US policy, even in the debates Trump announced we were folding.

and I think the voters are beginning to see that they were dupped...people are saying

[yuna628 9,673]

It may be me, but I didn't know Dictators won fair elections. Just saying

Well now you know, because historically, it happens.

[Dakine10 5,452]

It may be me, but I didn't know Dictators won fair elections. Just saying

Actually Hitler did if you wan't something interesting to read up on, but yeah, it usually doesn't happen that way.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

Actually Hitler did if you wan't something interesting to read up on, but yeah, it usually doesn't happen that way.

That I did not know. Did he actually hold elections once seized power?

[Dakine10 5,452]

That I did not know. Did he actually hold elections once seized power?

I don't think they did, at least not a legitimate one.

[B_J 2,752]

Once again, people totally misunderstand the Duterte popularity.

He was elected with 39% of the vote. Read that again to make sure you understand. 39%. The vast majority did not want him. His margin of victory was not as much as Estrada's and his total votes was only slightly more than Aquino and both of them had a smaller total population of voters. His win was nothing spectacular at all.

Next, people will try to point out how popular he is based on polling results. Keep in mind that it is traditional for a new President of the Philippines to have early wide spread support (BTW, I think that is a good thing). Even his often quoted 91% is nothing too spectacular. Aquino was at 87% in the same poll at the same time, His popularity is actually quite normal. When polled on job satisfaction, he actually scored lower than Ramos did in the same poll at the same time.

In the beginning, there was support for his war on drugs. As odd as it may seem to us, most Filipinos were, to some extent, okay with what he was doing. However, most Filipinos view the US much more favorably than they do China. So, his switch to an alliance with China, along with his negative comments toward the US, are quite the opposite of the opinions of the average Filipino. And now the country is also divided on the Marcos burial controversy.

I guess I am now obligated to point out that I also know many Filipinos, both here and there, and most are not supporting what he is doing except for the drug war. They are especially angry at the things he has said about the US - and before anybody says it, he is anti-US, not anti-Obama. He has always disliked the US, either because he was denied a visa when he was younger, or due to the fiasco in Davao with the explosion involving the "treasure hunter", or simply because of his communist background. What ever the reason, he has never liked the US.

Now, with his comment about suspending the writ of habeas corpus, my friends and family are even more worried, especially those who remember living during the Marcos years. He is bringing up too many bad memories for some.

Just my two cents.

[MarkPerry 488]

Once again, people totally misunderstand the Duterte popularity.

He was elected with 39% of the vote. Read that again to make sure you understand. 39%. The vast majority did not want him. His margin of victory was not as much as Estrada's and his total votes was only slightly more than Aquino and both of them had a smaller total population of voters. His win was nothing spectacular at all.

Next, people will try to point out how popular he is based on polling results. Keep in mind that it is traditional for a new President of the Philippines to have early wide spread support (BTW, I think that is a good thing). Even his often quoted 91% is nothing too spectacular. Aquino was at 87% in the same poll at the same time, His popularity is actually quite normal. When polled on job satisfaction, he actually scored lower than Ramos did in the same poll at the same time.

In the beginning, there was support for his war on drugs. As odd as it may seem to us, most Filipinos were, to some extent, okay with what he was doing. However, most Filipinos view the US much more favorably than they do China. So, his switch to an alliance with China, along with his negative comments toward the US, are quite the opposite of the opinions of the average Filipino. And now the country is also divided on the Marcos burial controversy.

I guess I am now obligated to point out that I also know many Filipinos, both here and there, and most are not supporting what he is doing except for the drug war. They are especially angry at the things he has said about the US - and before anybody says it, he is anti-US, not anti-Obama. He has always disliked the US, either because he was denied a visa when he was younger, or due to the fiasco in Davao with the explosion involving the "treasure hunter", or simply because of his communist background. What ever the reason, he has never liked the US.

Now, with his comment about suspending the writ of habeas corpus, my friends and family are even more worried, especially those who remember living during the Marcos years. He is bringing up too many bad memories for some.

Just my two cents.

Actually it was considered a landslide win in Philippines Elections. I believe they had 5 candidates running for President.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

Actually it was considered a landslide win in Philippines Elections. I believe they had 5 candidates running for President.

Ever notice when you don't agree with people that are wrong, it's because you can't understand

[MarkPerry 488]

Ever notice when you don't agree with people that are wrong, it's because you can't understand

Yeep in my best Dave Hester voice

Well dictators are certainly leaders, but in able to lead they have to get men foolish enough to follow whatever they say.

Duterte was elected into office just a few months ago, I believe his term is 6 years

[Dakine10 5,452]

Ever notice when you don't agree with people that are wrong, it's because you can't understand

I can't tell if you intended that sentence to be as funny as it turned out to be.

[millefleur 5,046]

The US has a rather dubious ally in Saudi Arabia if we're looking at it from a moral/ethical standpoint. So, there's that.

On the Russia situation: Russia's military is peanuts compared to the US...they have only one single aircraft carrier (which was built in the Soviet Union, so you can imagine how "up-to-date" it is) compared to the US's 10 (or 19 depending)...Russia is having a severe economic downturn right now, they won't be able to just vaporize money out of nothing to build up their military. Oil is limited and not exactly the hot commodity it used to be. A lot of the fat cat oligarchs have grown used to their comfortable lifestyle and I don't think they'd care or be willing to start living poorer in order to go and conquer the Baltic States in Europe. This isn't the Red Army willing to die to defend the Motherland we're talking about, it's quite a different situation. Russia likes playing an influence game with propaganda in Europe and the US, but it pretty much ends there. They just don't have the funds and military to back up anything beyond that. If they didn't have nukes, they wouldn't even be considered a threat at all to the West. Of course, as well all know, Europe basically has even less of a military than Russia due to the NATO agreement, so I get why Europe would see Russia as threat. But if Russia were stupid enough to declare war/start invading Europe....it would be the WW I/Russian Revolution situation all over again. History would repeat itself and Russia would revert into a Civil War/Revolution-like chaos scenario because people wouldn't have food. And when people don't have food, rulers tend to stop being popular. Same thing happened to Gorby in the 80's when the Soviet Union collapsed....food started becoming scarce in the 80's, and shortly afterwards the Iron Curtain fell. Putin is still popular because Russia still has food, still has cars, people still have all the Mod-Cons of daily life that the West has too, but if that suddenly dried up in order to go and invade Europe, I don't really see that being a popular move for Mr. Putin if it leads to further economic decay. Russia is not united by a strong ideology anymore (unlike the USSR or the Empire days) and a major war would end up being self-destructive for Russia (and therefore Putin) because of that fact and the tanking economy.

The Ukraine/Crimea thing is much more complex situation historically and culturally. It's also a propaganda thing for Putin because of the overwhelmingly Russian population and pro-Russia support in those particular regions of Ukraine. Hence why the whole war in Ukraine has basically been contained and not gone on any further than that the Russian-speaking/pro-Russian regions. That's where the Russian influence stops and the military just doesn't pack the punch to carry it any further from there without rebel groups/internal support. That's my two cents on the whole "Russia wanting to conquer Europe (again)" topic. Maybe I'm totally wrong but that's my take on it. If the US actually starting backing Putin and throwing military support behind Russia....even in Syria, let's say, then obviously Putin benefits from the US's military might. I think that's why Russia is celebrating Trump's victory right now, because they assume they will get at least that out of Trump.

Edited November 13, 2016 by millefleur

[B_J 2,752]

Actually it was considered a landslide win in Philippines Elections. I believe they had 5 candidates running for President.

Yeah, they had five candidates. They always have a lot running. But we both already knew that, right?

But I don't know about landslide. Duterte got 39.01% and the next closest was 23.45%. He didn't even get 40% and he won by 15.56%

Let's look at other elections. In 2010, Aquino got 42.08% and the next closest was 26.25%. Aquino got 40% and won by 15.83%. Seems like a bigger landslide.

Let's go back to 1998. Estrada got 39.86% and the next closest was 15.87%. He didn't get 40% but got more than Duterte, he also won by 23.99%. Obviously a bigger landslide.

Remember, Duterte is only the sixth President since Marcos. When you actually compare his results with those of others during the modern Philippines, his popularity is once again nothing special.

[MarkPerry 488]

Yeah, they had five candidates. They always have a lot running. But we both already knew that, right?

But I don't know about landslide. Duterte got 39.01% and the next closest was 23.45%. He didn't even get 40% and he won by 15.56%

Let's look at other elections. In 2010, Aquino got 42.08% and the next closest was 26.25%. Aquino got 40% and won by 15.83%. Seems like a bigger landslide.

Let's go back to 1998. Estrada got 39.86% and the next closest was 15.87%. He didn't get 40% but got more than Duterte, he also won by 23.99%. Obviously a bigger landslide.

Remember, Duterte is only the sixth President since Marcos. When you actually compare his results with those of others during the modern Philippines, his popularity is once again nothing special.

Actually I had no clue how many people run for elections in Philippines, I was thinking it was basically two since the Philippines government mirrors US government. I don't know much about the history of Philippines politics or the leaders.

[B_J 2,752]

Okay, that's cool. Since the Marcos years, it's usually a lot running, so the winner doesn't usually get a large percentage of the votes.

And I really do like the public response to a new President. They seem to always give whoever is elected a chance. Aquino was incredibly popular when elected, just like Duterte. One of the big issues for Aquino was fighting corruption. He did a really lousy job at that and his popularity sank in his six years.

People are behind Duterte when it comes to his drug war. The country is very divided on the Marcos burial and I don't know why he chose to support the Marcos's, unless he owes them favors.

But,I really think he's making a mistake in wanting to move away from the US and towards China and Russia. That definitely goes against the will of the people.

But, he really seems to like Trump. Let's just say they have similar speaking styles. If that gets Duterte to turn back towards the US, then that would be a great thing as far as I'm concerned.

Edited November 13, 2016 by B_J