The First Openly Godless Member of Congress

[Fuzzness 2]

Thomas Jefferson was an atheist......

[GaryC 7]

Thomas Jefferson was an atheist......

And I am sure he had a strong moral grounding.

[Fuzzness 2]

Thomas Jefferson was an atheist......

And I am sure he had a strong moral grounding.

He did, very much so. One of the greatest presidents ever. And although he was an atheist, he never made fun of any religious people and left them alone.

[GaryC 7]

Thomas Jefferson was not an athiest.

During the presidential campaign of 1800, the Federalists attacked Jefferson as an infidel, claiming that Jefferson's intoxication with the religious and political extremism of the French Revolution disqualified him from public office. But Jefferson wrote at length on religion and many scholars agree with the claim that Jefferson was a deist, a common position held by intellectuals in the late 18th century. As Avery Cardinal Dulles, a leading Roman Catholic theologian reports, "In his college years at William and Mary [Jefferson] came to admire Francis Bacon, Isaac Newton, and John Locke as three great paragons of wisdom. Under the influence of several professors he converted to the deist philosophy."[23] Dulles concludes:

“ In summary, then, Jefferson was a deist because he believed in one God, in divine providence, in the divine moral law, and in rewards and punishments after death; but did not believe in supernatural revelation. He was a Christian deist because he saw Christianity as the highest expression of natural religion and Jesus as an incomparably great moral teacher. He was not an orthodox Christian because he rejected, among other things, the doctrines that Jesus was the promised Messiah and the incarnate Son of God. Jefferson's religion is fairly typical of the American form of deism in his day. ”

Biographer Merrill Peterson summarizes Jefferson's theology:

“ First, that the Christianity of the churches was unreasonable, therefore unbelievable, but that stripped of priestly mystery, ritual, and dogma, reinterpreted in the light of historical evidence and human experience, and substituting the Newtonian cosmology for the discredited Biblical one, Christianity could be conformed to reason. Second, morality required no divine sanction or inspiration, no appeal beyond reason and nature, perhaps not even the hope of heaven or the fear of hell; and so the whole edifice of Christian revelation came tumbling to the ground.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Jefferson

[Fuzzness 2]

that could be debated, but i see no reason to doubt the wikipedia entry

[GaryC 7]

that could be debated, but i see no reason to doubt the wikipedia entry

Regardless of his beliefs he still had a strong moral foundation contrary to what others here might say.

[Dr_LHA 3]

Didn't you hear: Christians are the only ones with morals. Its impossible to have any morals and not believe in God. I can't believe you live in America and didn't know this already?

You need to get over yourself. Whether you believe in God of not has nothing to do with having a sense of right and wrong.

The point were I was being sarcastic was lost on you? Yes, I agree with you on this.

I find your attitude towards Christians and God disturbing.

Disturbing? That's a bit much isn't it? I have no problem with Christians or God, I have a problem when people tell me that "godless" people have no morals, which is what I was attempting to mock in my post above. Maybe you don't think this, but there are plenty of people who do, and I have encountered plenty of them.

It's your right to believe what you want but you don't have to insult those that do believe in God.

A bit touchy aren't we? I didn't really think I was insulting anyone.

[beameup 0]

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,"

Declaration of Independence, July 4, 1776

Under the Soviet System "Creator" was replaced with "State" and the Supreme State gave "rights" to its citizens as seen fit. Perhaps this is the system that this particular politician seems to prefer - being a LIBERAL DEMOCRAT.

Under the ever increasing power of the "State", the "State" has assumed far greater POWERS over the citizens daily life over the last 4 decades of Democrat Party power.

The MOST important things promised by the founding documents were: Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness.

Not envisioned in the foundation of the United States was an all powerful Central Government that had virtual total control over every aspect of your life - "from the womb to the tomb".

[Jenn! 918]

beameup, You strike me as very angry. Especially towards LIBERAL DEMOCRATS.

[Fuzzness 2]

beameup, You strike me as very angry. Especially towards LIBERAL DEMOCRATS.

how dare you blaspheme!

[mybackpages 0]

The MOST important things promised by the founding documents were: Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness.

Not envisioned in the foundation of the United States was an all powerful Central Government that had virtual total control over every aspect of your life - "from the womb to the tomb".

This may be true, but by 1789, at the Constitutional Convention, they disregarded the values of the war for independence and no mention of these ideals are part of the Contitution. In fact the Constituiton and many of the framers sought exactly the opposite - a stronger centralized government modeled after England.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Under the Soviet System "Creator" was replaced with "State" and the Supreme State gave "rights" to its citizens as seen fit. Perhaps this is the system that this particular politician seems to prefer - being a LIBERAL DEMOCRAT.

Communism and godlessness aren't mutually exclusive. In fact, Jesus was a communist.

[mybackpages 0]

Under the Soviet System "Creator" was replaced with "State" and the Supreme State gave "rights" to its citizens as seen fit. Perhaps this is the system that this particular politician seems to prefer - being a LIBERAL DEMOCRAT.

Communism and godlessness aren't mutually exclusive. In fact, Jesus was a communist.

Or at least a good socialists as any reading of the real Marx will show.

Think: Liberation Theology

Edited March 26, 2007 by mybackpages

[Caladan 19]

Better an openly godless representative than one who goes about proclaiming how Christian he is before buggering the country.

[GaryC 7]

Communism and godlessness aren't mutually exclusive. In fact, Jesus was a communist.

Not true. Jesus wasn't advocating a form of government, he was putting forward a personal relationship with God. Remember: "Give unto Cesar what is Cesar's' and give unto God what is God's" The two were not intended to mix.

Edited March 26, 2007 by Iniibig ko si Luz forever