How long after RFE at interview for process to play out?

[Sascafig 12]

Any information from someone with answers is appreciated!

My husband had his citizenship interview today at the Houston field office. He passed through the questions and language assessments with ease. He presented the required IDs and copies of my proof of citizenship. He also handed over the packet I had helped him prepare that included our 2012-2015 joint tax returns, a printout from my work benefits site showing that he has been listed and insured as my dependent since 2012 and his four sons listed as such since 2014, our water bill in both names, the summary pages from two banks where we have joint checking accounts with both our names on it, and our car insurance ID with us both listed as drivers. He also had with him a notarized letter from his sons' mother saying he paid child support while they were with her, and I included their registration summary sheet from the student accounts of their high school to show they currently live with us and attend school here, just in case there was any questions concerning his character insofar as child support went (he never got that far). Since his appointment was on a weekday morning and I was not able to get out of work to go with him for moral support, I wrote a letter for him to bring where I said as much, and gave my contact information just in case they wondered why I didn't come. Sure enough, the IO asked. My husband gave her my letter and she said that wasn't sufficient, that I should be there. Ok, so if that was a requirement I would have asked for time off without pay and risked the reprimand at the office. But it was never stated in any communication from USCIS that I had to be there; I just sent the letter as a courtesy, just-in-case, CYA worst-case-scenario type deal. Other than using that as the basis for denial, she also said she needed to see all three years of car insurance IDs to prove our relationship over time (apparently me having him and the kids as dependents on our health insurance wasn't proof over time?). I'm sorry, but who keeps three years worth of expired insurance IDs around? She also was mad that I only sent in the summary pages of the statements. They show our bank account number, both our names, starting balance and ending balance to show movement. I didn't think I would have to print out an extra 20 pages of transactions to have it count. She told him the pages were useless. She would not give him specifics as to what to prepare to satisfy the RFE, told him that he would have been approved had I "bothered to come" (I'm sorry, we have six children to support, both of us losing a day of work is a little rough, and I think she could have been understanding about that), and that he has to wait 10 days for the RFE letter, has 30 days to respond, and then they have "by law" 100 days to issue a decision.

So here's the question: How long will this take? Two of our boys are already too old for parent-based citizenship, but two are still minors and we were hoping they would be able to derive citizenship along with their dad and save themselves the nightmare and financial hardship of having to go through all this when they turn 21. The oldest of those turns 18 at the end of August, which is nail-bitingly close, if not a pipe-dream based on the time frame this woman gave my husband. Has anyone gone through this process recently that can give us hope that it might move faster?

[JimmyHou 611]

Any information from someone with answers is appreciated!

My husband had his citizenship interview today at the Houston field office. He passed through the questions and language assessments with ease. He presented the required IDs and copies of my proof of citizenship. He also handed over the packet I had helped him prepare that included our 2012-2015 joint tax returns, a printout from my work benefits site showing that he has been listed and insured as my dependent since 2012 and his four sons listed as such since 2014, our water bill in both names, the summary pages from two banks where we have joint checking accounts with both our names on it, and our car insurance ID with us both listed as drivers. He also had with him a notarized letter from his sons' mother saying he paid child support while they were with her, and I included their registration summary sheet from the student accounts of their high school to show they currently live with us and attend school here, just in case there was any questions concerning his character insofar as child support went (he never got that far). Since his appointment was on a weekday morning and I was not able to get out of work to go with him for moral support, I wrote a letter for him to bring where I said as much, and gave my contact information just in case they wondered why I didn't come. Sure enough, the IO asked. My husband gave her my letter and she said that wasn't sufficient, that I should be there. Ok, so if that was a requirement I would have asked for time off without pay and risked the reprimand at the office. But it was never stated in any communication from USCIS that I had to be there; I just sent the letter as a courtesy, just-in-case, CYA worst-case-scenario type deal. Other than using that as the basis for denial, she also said she needed to see all three years of car insurance IDs to prove our relationship over time (apparently me having him and the kids as dependents on our health insurance wasn't proof over time?). I'm sorry, but who keeps three years worth of expired insurance IDs around? She also was mad that I only sent in the summary pages of the statements. They show our bank account number, both our names, starting balance and ending balance to show movement. I didn't think I would have to print out an extra 20 pages of transactions to have it count. She told him the pages were useless. She would not give him specifics as to what to prepare to satisfy the RFE, told him that he would have been approved had I "bothered to come" (I'm sorry, we have six children to support, both of us losing a day of work is a little rough, and I think she could have been understanding about that), and that he has to wait 10 days for the RFE letter, has 30 days to respond, and then they have "by law" 100 days to issue a decision.

So here's the question: How long will this take? Two of our boys are already too old for parent-based citizenship, but two are still minors and we were hoping they would be able to derive citizenship along with their dad and save themselves the nightmare and financial hardship of having to go through all this when they turn 21. The oldest of those turns 18 at the end of August, which is nail-bitingly close, if not a pipe-dream based on the time frame this woman gave my husband. Has anyone gone through this process recently that can give us hope that it might move faster?

1) You were not required to attend. She could have asked for the same information and given you and RFE even if you were there. She was in a bad mood or didn't like your husband... assuming there's nothing else to the story. It makes absolutely no sense that simply seeing you would make her think that your relationship was legitimate... she's questioning the fact that you have joint finances, not the fact that you exist, so I don't see what seeing you in the waiting room (you wouldn't have been allowed in the interview room) proves.

2) They actually have 120 days from the time they receive your response, but they sometimes go over that by months. Legally, you can file a lawsuit to ask a judge to force them to make a decision, but who's got time and money for that?

3) In all likelihood, your husband will be approved shortly after sending in the required information. The interviewer may be unreasonable, but the best thing is to giver her what she wants or something close to it... if you don't have the insurance cards, get a letter from your provider stating that you've both on the policy since xx/xx/xxxx.

4) I'd say you've got a good chance of being done before your son turns 18 in August. There are oath ceremonies in Houston on 05/18, 06/22, 07/27, and 08/24... hopefully your husband will be approved and naturalized at one of those ceremonies.

[Sascafig 12]

1) You were not required to attend. She could have asked for the same information and given you and RFE even if you were there. She was in a bad mood or didn't like your husband... assuming there's nothing else to the story. It makes absolutely no sense that simply seeing you would make her think that your relationship was legitimate... she's questioning the fact that you have joint finances, not the fact that you exist, so I don't see what seeing you in the waiting room (you wouldn't have been allowed in the interview room) proves.

2) They actually have 120 days from the time they receive your response, but they sometimes go over that by months. Legally, you can file a lawsuit to ask a judge to force them to make a decision, but who's got time and money for that?

3) In all likelihood, your husband will be approved shortly after sending in the required information. The interviewer may be unreasonable, but the best thing is to giver her what she wants or something close to it... if you don't have the insurance cards, get a letter from your provider stating that you've both on the policy since xx/xx/xxxx.

4) I'd say you've got a good chance of being done before your son turns 18 in August. There are oath ceremonies in Houston on 05/18, 06/22, 07/27, and 08/24... hopefully your husband will be approved and naturalized at one of those ceremonies.

That is very useful information to have, I didn't know the ceremonies had a set schedule available, so thank you! Right now I'm trying to be optimistic, hopefully they don't sit on their thumbs like they have done for his ROC process.

I really don't understand why she made such a big deal about me not being there either, I knew I'd be stuck in the waiting room anyway. She really threw us for a loop with that one. And putting so much weight on not having every page of our joint statements when we showed that we do have joint bank accounts and also have filed joint taxes for the past three years. Someone definitely pissed her off this morning because usually people take an instant liking to my husband. Who knows

[JimmyHou 611]

That is very useful information to have, I didn't know the ceremonies had a set schedule available, so thank you! Right now I'm trying to be optimistic, hopefully they don't sit on their thumbs like they have done for his ROC process.

I really don't understand why she made such a big deal about me not being there either, I knew I'd be stuck in the waiting room anyway. She really threw us for a loop with that one. And putting so much weight on not having every page of our joint statements when we showed that we do have joint bank accounts and also have filed joint taxes for the past three years. Someone definitely pissed her off this morning because usually people take an instant liking to my husband. Who knows

Houston holds oath ceremonies at the M. O. Campbell Education Center in north Houston. Since it's an event facility that they have to rent, they need to set up the ceremonies well in advance.

Clarification: The dates were not published officially by USCIS, but were published on a Houston immigration Law website, which must have got them from USCIS or from the Center. While they are from an unofficial document, the dates for January, February, March, and April have turned out to be correct.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/588306-2016-oath-ceremonies-in-houston/?p=8044461

Edited April 29, 2016 by JimmyHou

[ryna 132]

That is very useful information to have, I didn't know the ceremonies had a set schedule available, so thank you! Right now I'm trying to be optimistic, hopefully they don't sit on their thumbs like they have done for his ROC process.

I really don't understand why she made such a big deal about me not being there either, I knew I'd be stuck in the waiting room anyway. She really threw us for a loop with that one. And putting so much weight on not having every page of our joint statements when we showed that we do have joint bank accounts and also have filed joint taxes for the past three years. Someone definitely pissed her off this morning because usually people take an instant liking to my husband. Who knows

I'm the USC spouse and this, specifically, scares me because I told my wife when she sent in her N-400 that USCIS only needed to see a couple of the summary pages covering each of the last 4 years and not every page. I really don't understand why USCIS would need to know every time someone used their debit card at the 7-11, wrote a check to the DMV or any other transaction for that matter?

Hopefully, the interviewer was just in a bad mood, asking for that isn't normal and your husband's case will be completed soon!

[Sascafig 12]

I'm the USC spouse and this, specifically, scares me because I told my wife when she sent in her N-400 that USCIS only needed to see a couple of the summary pages covering each of the last 4 years and not every page. I really don't understand why USCIS would need to know every time someone used their debit card at the 7-11, wrote a check to the DMV or any other transaction for that matter?

Hopefully, the interviewer was just in a bad mood, asking for that isn't normal and your husband's case will be completed soon!

Yes, that's exactly what I thought! I figured I'd save a few trees because, since my husband and I use our debit cards so much, we have pages and PAGES for each statement. I was worried we'd make the IO mad if he handed her dozens of bank sheets to go through. I had no idea she'd take the complete opposite tack. Thank you for the well-wishes, hopefully it was just a freak incident and you won't have this issue!

[charmander 692]

Any information from someone with answers is appreciated!

Maybe you never updated your approval but the timeline on your signature page does not show if your ROC was approved or not. It says in red "over a year and no news..." I am assuming it is approved after this long, but if it is still pending, could that be why the officer wanted you to be there? Maybe they wanted to have a joint ROC - N400 interview?

[squareleg 69]

I can understand your frustration. However, based on your timeline, it appears that your ROC was not approved (or the process was never completed). I am not certain if you have a 10-year greencard or not. If your ROC was never approved, you should have attended the interview.

Also, did you miss the first citizenship interview? Anyways, the officer question the legitimacy of the marriage/relationship and hence, the need for additional documentation to be furnished as evidence.

What I stated above compounded with in a bad mood officer (given that there is nothing more to the story) caused the situation to turn against you.

[Sascafig 12]

Maybe you never updated your approval but the timeline on your signature page does not show if your ROC was approved or not. It says in red "over a year and no news..." I am assuming it is approved after this long, but if it is still pending, could that be why the officer wanted you to be there? Maybe they wanted to have a joint ROC - N400 interview?

It is possible I suppose, but if they planned on giving a Stokes interview (which is the only case I've seen where they even dignify the USC spouse during the interview process), would they not be required to notify us of that in order for us to plan accordingly? I think it's a little strange to not issue notice that the spouse needs to be in attendance and then find fault in the fact that they did not attend. Like I said, it would have been difficult for me to go, but had they said I had no other option, I would have been there.

I can understand your frustration. However, based on your timeline, it appears that your ROC was not approved (or the process was never completed). I am not certain if you have a 10-year greencard or not. If your ROC was never approved, you should have attended the interview.

Also, did you miss the first citizenship interview? Anyways, the officer question the legitimacy of the marriage/relationship and hence, the need for additional documentation to be furnished as evidence.

What I stated above compounded with in a bad mood officer (given that there is nothing more to the story) caused the situation to turn against you.

Unless I am mistaken the N-400 says you must have been a permanent resident for a specified amount of time. A conditional permanent resident is still a permanent resident. I know I have seen cases on here where the citizenship ceremony takes place while the ROC process is still going on. Right now we have been in the ROC process for 16 months with no end in sight. No RFE, no movement at all. My husband has called many times, we have gotten letters saying "Hey! Thanks for your call, we'll jump right on that!" (in the incredibly frustrating USCIS-speak, of course), promising we would get a decision in 30 days (three months ago). So with us pushing to get this done before August, there was no way to not send off for the N-400.

And yes, we never received notice of the first interview, we just got a notice that we had missed it. That's a whole other nightmare with another department of the Federal gov't, the post office. For some reason, they refuse to deliver our mail. We finally had to give a friend's address as a mailing address to make sure we get important mail. If you'll notice, we didn't receive either of the NOA1 letters either. Fingerprint appointment letters, yes. There's no rhyme or reason, our post office is just a joke.

Edited April 29, 2016 by Sascafig

[charmander 692]

It is possible I suppose, but if they planned on giving a Stokes interview (which is the only case I've seen where they even dignify the USC spouse during the interview process), would they not be required to notify us of that in order for us to plan accordingly? I think it's a little strange to not issue notice that the spouse needs to be in attendance and then find fault in the fact that they did not attend. Like I said, it would have been difficult for me to go, but had they said I had no other option, I would have been there.

Unless I am mistaken the N-400 says you must have been a permanent resident for a specified amount of time. A conditional permanent resident is still a permanent resident. I know I have seen cases on here where the citizenship ceremony takes place while the ROC process is still going on. Right now we have been in the ROC process for 16 months with no end in sight. No RFE, no movement at all. My husband has called many times, we have gotten letters saying "Hey! Thanks for your call, we'll jump right on that!" (in the incredibly frustrating USCIS-speak, of course), promising we would get a decision in 30 days (three months ago). So with us pushing to get this done before August, there was no way to not send off for the N-400.

It looks like that is what it was. They were going to concurrently adjudicate the ROC and N400 but since you weren't there they issue RFE. As you said, they should have informed you guys what to expect ahead of time but I read on some other forums before the local office failed to inform about the joint interview. I also read before people get naturalized without having ROCs approved but the USCIS guidelines say otherwise. N400 shall not be approved before approving the ROC. https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Laws%20and%20Regulations/Memoranda/cond_perm_resident_.pdf Page 4, section 2A.

That being said, the officer could certainly behave much nicer and explain why you needed to be there and excuse for not informing you guys ahead of time. Not sure what caused her to behave like. Call it a bad day. I hope they don't delay your case any further and whole thing resolves as soon as possible. Good luck!

[Sascafig 12]

It looks like that is what it was. They were going to concurrently adjudicate the ROC and N400 but since you weren't there they issue RFE. As you said, they should have informed you guys what to expect ahead of time but I read on some other forums before the local office failed to inform about the joint interview. I also read before people get naturalized without having ROCs approved but the USCIS guidelines say otherwise. N400 shall not be approved before approving the ROC. https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Laws%20and%20Regulations/Memoranda/cond_perm_resident_.pdf Page 4, section 2A.

That being said, the officer could certainly behave much nicer and explain why you needed to be there and excuse for not informing you guys ahead of time. Not sure what caused her to behave like. Call it a bad day. I hope they don't delay your case any further and whole thing resolves as soon as possible. Good luck!

Well, that would certainly make sense if their "action within 30 days" meant they were shipping off our case to the field office for processing and just failed to notify us about it. I'm wondering now if the people who completed naturalization were in the same boat as me, where their ROC was completed at the same time and they just had no idea that's what happened. If he had been approved today I would be under the impression that the ROC was still flapping in the breeze somewhere when in fact it had been decided jointly with the citizenship. Thank you for the insight, I really think you hit the nail on the head. I'll just hope they can get us back in there quickly which is my only concern. The marriage is valid and we have no shortage of evidence, I'll just know to be less environmentally conscious next time and bring enough papers to wipe out a small woodland forest. Oh! And of course show up whether I'm invited or not! I hope this can help someone else that comes along later with the same situation, spare them the frustration I'm feeling right now.

[TBoneTX 45,292]

*** Thread is moved from the US Citizenship main forum to the Case Progress subforum. ***

[JimmyHou 611]

I think that with all the new information shared, the officer's request does not seem at all strange now. Maybe she was rude, but not at all outside normal practice. My response above was based on the information shared in the OP's first post. I didn't realize that the applicant had not successfully removed conditions. THAT is why the interviewer wanted both applicant and spouse present. Still, USCIS instructions aren't clear and it's an understandable oversight. Most people don't read these forums and have no idea what's required because USCIS is bad at just stating it outright.

Best of luck to the OP. Give them the information they want, but the wait may be longer than I implied on my reply.

Edited April 30, 2016 by JimmyHou

[JimmyHou 611]

It looks like that is what it was. They were going to concurrently adjudicate the ROC and N400 but since you weren't there they issue RFE. As you said, they should have informed you guys what to expect ahead of time but I read on some other forums before the local office failed to inform about the joint interview. I also read before people get naturalized without having ROCs approved but the USCIS guidelines say otherwise. N400 shall not be approved before approving the ROC. https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Laws%20and%20Regulations/Memoranda/cond_perm_resident_.pdf Page 4, section 2A.

That being said, the officer could certainly behave much nicer and explain why you needed to be there and excuse for not informing you guys ahead of time. Not sure what caused her to behave like. Call it a bad day. I hope they don't delay your case any further and whole thing resolves as soon as possible. Good luck!

I can understand your frustration. However, based on your timeline, it appears that your ROC was not approved (or the process was never completed). I am not certain if you have a 10-year greencard or not. If your ROC was never approved, you should have attended the interview.

Also, did you miss the first citizenship interview? Anyways, the officer question the legitimacy of the marriage/relationship and hence, the need for additional documentation to be furnished as evidence.

What I stated above compounded with in a bad mood officer (given that there is nothing more to the story) caused the situation to turn against you.

Great feedback guys.

This thread should be helpful to anyone filing for naturalization while awaiting action on ROC.

[mananto 36]

I'm the USC spouse and this, specifically, scares me because I told my wife when she sent in her N-400 that USCIS only needed to see a couple of the summary pages covering each of the last 4 years and not every page. I really don't understand why USCIS would need to know every time someone used their debit card at the 7-11, wrote a check to the DMV or any other transaction for that matter?

Hopefully, the interviewer was just in a bad mood, asking for that isn't normal and your husband's case will be completed soon!

Just print out as many as you can and give the officer at the interview. That should fix it.

Edited May 7, 2016 by mananto