Fewer Democrats Are Voting This Year In (Surprise!) States With Strict New Voter Laws

[yuna628 9,676]

This seems to be a stretch from a cause and effect standpoint. Maybe the reason the Democrat numbers are down is due to the lack of enthusiasm for their choices. You also have to factor in which of the state's that voted so far are open or closed primaries and how many Dems voted in the Repub primary/caucus instead. Not a real clear cut analysis unless of course you are very much against voter ID laws. In my opinion voting is a privilege since it entails proper registration as well as being governed by age requirements, therefore it is the responsibility of the citizen eligible to vote to have the proper requirements necessary to vote. If the parties want to help out then why don't they put together a plan to assist those that do not have identification get it, similar to how they run registration drives (also a requirement to vote).

Voting isn't considered a privilege though, it's defined as a right Constitutionally. And while I can understand the thinking behind it actually being closer to a privilege, anything that causes a citizen to be delayed or impeded from voting can be a problem. Voter ID laws make sense on the face of things, but as such, laws always have unintended consequences. The more complex you make a process to obtain an ID for some Americans, causes many of those Americans to just not bother. If many of those Americans are elderly, parties may find them to be 'acceptable losses'.. the person may vote against you after all. What this article talks about involving our aging generation is true: http://www.aarp.org/politics-society/government-elections/info-01-2012/voter-id-laws-impact-older-americans.html I can't see parties coming together to help people like this, when the person's own children grow increasingly frustrated with getting through the red tape to help themselves. Helping the poor to get one is some aspect, but there are as I said tons of reasons why obtaining documents needed to get an ID can be complex to near impossible for some, which in of itself contributed to the mess. One woman in my state tried for 15 years, and eventually went to a lawyer for help.

I don't think we can know for certain the true impact voter ID laws have on voter turnout, because each election cycle has so many different factors going on. Weak candidates and poor enthusiasm has got to be one of the biggies.

Expat1

Excuse me if I don't believe that in 70 years she couldn't get any sort of ID

Oh, I didn't say she never at any point had one (and actually never had a need for it in those years until recently). What happens if however during the time she may have had one, it becomes expired or even out of validity due to changing laws and regulations? What happens when she goes to renew the expiring item and discovers all the things she had obtained to get it previously are no longer useable requirements.. and that the new requirements require a valid ID itself? What happens if you have no birth certificate? Maybe you lost all your documents in a fire? Maybe you were born in a house and not a hospital? What if you have a birth document that is no longer considered a valid birth document? What if you have no passport? No need to drive?

Suffice to say if my dad hadn't of obtained a driver's license in his teens, when all the laws were different, he'd be having one hell of a problem getting a new one today (I discovered that little problem while digging around to see what to do for mom). My sister's case was no better, ya know. I basically had to beg someone out of their own kindness at the vitals office to cough up her birth certificate. Because no ID = no certificate.

Edited March 6, 2016 by yuna628

[Rob L 3,811]

Voting isn't considered a privilege though, it's defined as a right Constitutionally. And while I can understand the thinking behind it actually being closer to a privilege, anything that causes a citizen to be delayed or impeded from voting can be a problem. Voter ID laws make sense on the face of things, but as such, laws always have unintended consequences. The more complex you make a process to obtain an ID for some Americans, causes many of those Americans to just not bother. If many of those Americans are elderly, parties may find them to be 'acceptable losses'.. the person may vote against you after all. What this article talks about involving our aging generation is true: http://www.aarp.org/politics-society/government-elections/info-01-2012/voter-id-laws-impact-older-americans.html I can't see parties coming together to help people like this, when the person's own children grow increasingly frustrated with getting through the red tape to help themselves. Helping the poor to get one is some aspect, but there are as I said tons of reasons why obtaining documents needed to get an ID can be complex to near impossible for some, which in of itself contributed to the mess. One woman in my state tried for 15 years, and eventually went to a lawyer for help.

I don't think we can know for certain the true impact voter ID laws have on voter turnout, because each election cycle has so many different factors going on. Weak candidates and poor enthusiasm has got to be one of the biggies.

Oh, I didn't say she never at any point had one (and actually never had a need for it in those years until recently). What happens if however during the time she may have had one, it becomes expired or even out of validity due to changing laws and regulations? What happens when she goes to renew the expiring item and discovers all the things she had obtained to get it previously are no longer useable requirements.. and that the new requirements require a valid ID itself? What happens if you have no birth certificate? Maybe you lost all your documents in a fire? Maybe you were born in a house and not a hospital? What if you have a birth document that is no longer considered a valid birth document? What if you have no passport? No need to drive?

Suffice to say if my dad hadn't of obtained a driver's license in his teens, when all the laws were different, he'd be having one hell of a problem getting a new one today (I discovered that little problem while digging around to see what to do for mom). My sister's case was no better, ya know. I basically had to beg someone out of their own kindness at the vitals office to cough up her birth certificate. Because no ID = no certificate.

Very articulate and passionate statement, thank you

[Póg mo 1,749]

Republicans also move and get married. Wonder why they're not effected.

Perhaps in States with Republican majorities, a tightening of voter ID laws might not have the same effect on the Republican vote. What do you think?

[Dashinka 24,492]

Voting isn't considered a privilege though, it's defined as a right Constitutionally. And while I can understand the thinking behind it actually being closer to a privilege, anything that causes a citizen to be delayed or impeded from voting can be a problem. Voter ID laws make sense on the face of things, but as such, laws always have unintended consequences. The more complex you make a process to obtain an ID for some Americans, causes many of those Americans to just not bother. If many of those Americans are elderly, parties may find them to be 'acceptable losses'.. the person may vote against you after all. What this article talks about involving our aging generation is true: http://www.aarp.org/politics-society/government-elections/info-01-2012/voter-id-laws-impact-older-americans.html I can't see parties coming together to help people like this, when the person's own children grow increasingly frustrated with getting through the red tape to help themselves. Helping the poor to get one is some aspect, but there are as I said tons of reasons why obtaining documents needed to get an ID can be complex to near impossible for some, which in of itself contributed to the mess. One woman in my state tried for 15 years, and eventually went to a lawyer for help.

I don't think we can know for certain the true impact voter ID laws have on voter turnout, because each election cycle has so many different factors going on. Weak candidates and poor enthusiasm has got to be one of the biggies.

Oh, I didn't say she never at any point had one (and actually never had a need for it in those years until recently). What happens if however during the time she may have had one, it becomes expired or even out of validity due to changing laws and regulations? What happens when she goes to renew the expiring item and discovers all the things she had obtained to get it previously are no longer useable requirements.. and that the new requirements require a valid ID itself? What happens if you have no birth certificate? Maybe you lost all your documents in a fire? Maybe you were born in a house and not a hospital? What if you have a birth document that is no longer considered a valid birth document? What if you have no passport? No need to drive?

Suffice to say if my dad hadn't of obtained a driver's license in his teens, when all the laws were different, he'd be having one hell of a problem getting a new one today (I discovered that little problem while digging around to see what to do for mom). My sister's case was no better, ya know. I basically had to beg someone out of their own kindness at the vitals office to cough up her birth certificate. Because no ID = no certificate.

How do you prove that you are a US citizen eligible to vote when you register to vote? Do they just assume everyone is honest when saying "Yes, I am a US citizen"?

[yuna628 9,676]

How do you prove that you are a US citizen eligible to vote when you register to vote? Do they just assume everyone is honest when saying "Yes, I am a US citizen"?

For MD, currently at least a full ID is not required if you go into the board and present your application. You need to give them an SSN. Our DMV once had the habit of sort of forcibly registering everyone without bothering to ask (that made me nervous when my husband got his license), which made people pretty annoyed. So yes, pretty much they assume in the honesty of the person presenting their application, and I think that has worked pretty okay so far in election history don't you think? A lot of the shady stuff that goes on has more to do with double registration, missing ballots, count fraud, and of course our terrible system rigging of electronic machines that I think they got rid of this year. Non citizen voter fraud happens (they are often prosecuted and it does have long term consequences), I'm sure but you can look at the studies and it's impact is barely felt in elections. While I'd say again that having some sort of an ID to vote is helpful in ensuring fairness for all, the laws to obtain one can vary and be complex, and in some cases exclude, delay, and deter well-meaning Americans from acting on their right to vote. Should we discount them as an acceptable loss for the greater good?

[Expat1 971]

Perhaps in States with Republican majorities, a tightening of voter ID laws might not have the same effect on the Republican vote. What do you think?

I'm registered in Texas. You wanna vote in Texas, you gotta have an ID. If the Republicans there whine about it tough luck. You want to discuss some more red states?

Edited March 7, 2016 by Expat1