I think my friend is falling victim to marriage fraud. Advice?

[IguanaCouple 26]

Oh and btw, I highly recommend not confronting your friend. Trust me you are gonna come off as jealous and petty.

You need to think from her POV. She is madly in love with this guy and honestly believes he loves her, too which he may or may not. If he dumps her you get to comfort her and have a friend for life, if they are happy together at least you can be happy for them.

Au contraire, if you lose your friend now you will have lost her for good no matter what happens. Just saying.

[Cathi 5,784]

I may have missed it, do we know her religion, if any?

no idea what her religion is, but that poster asked if she was willing to convert to Islam. She doesn't have to, nor should it be expected

[mananto 36]

Okay, here is what I am thinking. I will report the marriage to whatever authorities I can find. I know it won't do anything according to you guys. But at least it might make someone slightly more suspicious and to look closer at this thing than they otherwise would.

I could tell other friends about her marriage plans - the secrecy is truly bizarre in my opinion. I mean, I get the feeling that some of you think this could be legitimate...but how is asking someone to marry them in under a week normal? How is the marriage being kept secret normal?

I have no idea how things work in foreign countries with different cultures, but in America those things are signs that something is way off.

I also don't understand why you guys saying me reporting this to the authorities will have no effect. I know in America at least the interview process can be pretty detailed...surely something in the folder from a friend that is suspicious will at least add extra scrutiny. Its my understanding that marriage fraud is taken very seriously...is that not the case?

Trust me. Reporting your so called suspicious will do nothing-squat. Watch them say that they guy rejected you and you are bitter about it and you will end up feeling like a total jerk. First of all, you are running her life. She is 29 years old for heaven's sake. But since you are not listening just like you say your friend is not, you go find out for yourself. The government does not deal with hearsay it deals with facts. What do you have to prove fraud? Then you will be asked what business is it of yours. I am sorry but if I were a government agent, I would think you are bitter because i am not sure how you get to decide for a grown up. Your warning signs may be wrng. There are people who have married each other even after a month with no Green card involved. I am not sure there is not more you are not saying.

[mananto 36]

To be honest I don't even want to be friends with her anymore. I do. But this is too painful being able to see the potential outcome.

The only thing I can compare this too is my sister being addicted to pain medication. I kept telling her there was a problem and she would not listen. And now her life is ruined.

How does this end for most women if is fraud. Can they eventually get over it? It seems like the type of thing that will leave permanent scars. We are both still so young. She could have any guy she wanted...why take this risk.

She dumped her boyfriend didn't she? The same feelings her ex-boyfriend had, the same feelings she will have.

[Mick & Janni 11]

It's hard for someone else to know what's going on between two people in love. No one in my circle of friends or my family knows what me and my fiancé talk about on the phone, in texts, chat or when we see each other IRL. They know the big parts, that we're madly in love and that we're preparing for marriage and a life together, but they don't read our chats, they don't listen to our conversations. I assume it's the same way with you, you don't know what your friend and her new bf are talking about, how they act towards each other, how they get along and what their feelings are. There might be a real, true love growing there - do you really want to be the one standing in the way of her happiness?

Me and my fiancé talked about marriage very early on, way before we even met IRL. At least your friend has already met her man in person, maybe my situation would've be considered a red flag in comparsion to your friend's (back when we hadn't even met yet). There was an instant connection. I know, and I did already early on, that this is the man I want to spend the rest of my life with and I would never let any "friend" stand in the way of our happiness and future. If you have any concerns, voice them once and be done with it. Anyone who claims to be a friend should also act like one.

//The foreigner

Edited February 18, 2016 by Mick & Janni

[Ebunoluwa 6,136]

Give your friend the gift of choice without the need to control her and undermining their relationship.

You have overstepped your boundary, start respecting her choices whether you agree with them or not.

On one hand you say she is like your sister and on the other you want to end the friendship because of her choices.

Time to let go of the outcome and be there if she crashes, like a real friend would. It is life's lesson for you to re evaluate where your boundaries

are in regards to other adults around you. Your assumption that she can't survive a betrayal without you stepping in to "rescue" her

is frankly a co dependency trait. There may be just as much to learn for you from all of this than there is for her.

You have no facts and wanting to go behind her back and report assumptions to the agency is childish and a betrayal.

Stop trying to rescue and fix others and allow them freedom of choice, experience and growth in the path they have chosen for themselves.

[berber_wife 90]

I did marry a Moroccan I met on vacation and we are going strong after 4.5 years together and almost 2 years of marriage.

However, we took things a lot slower. We didn't exchange ILYs until the three month mark and we spent 2.5 years visiting each other, traveling together and getting to know each other before tying the knot.

I tend to think fast marriages aren't a super good idea for anyone- foreign or not. However, I was worried when my nephew's mom married her second husband after only knowing each other six months. Eight years later, they are still going strong.

Unfortunately, I think you were too aggressive about voicing your opinion early on. For one, if it is legitimate (and you have to consider that possibility too), you will probably lose a friend for good if you don't back off. And if it's not, she's still going to dig in her heels and be more intent on marrying him because people love to prove others wrong when it comes to matters of love.

I think you need to let it go and let her come to you with concerns. If she does, I agree it's a good idea to talk up the K1 vs the CR1. If things fall apart during the K1 process, it's only a broken engagement and not a divorce she has to go through. Also, you could put the bug in her ear about moving to Morocco instead (i.e. Easier process, cheaper cost of living).

[Wintertime 0]

Happy Chic,

You have to realize the reason my approach may seem heavy handed is because I've already tried talking to her. The problem here is that she doesn't seem to be able to slow down at all, or consider that at least a small amount of caution and scepticism is needed here. There is absolutely no reason for her to be keeping a legitimate marriage secret from friends and family, and there is no reason she shouldn't slow down a little bit. She gains nothing by jumping into this thing. The whole reason for a courtship is to find out about the person. Almost every relationship I've been in I've found things about the guy I didn't like as time went on. Early on people only show their good side, you don't fight. It takes time to really see what being with the person would be like. I completely get that maybe these two have genuine feelings for each other. But secrecy and rushing into marriage? It makes no sense for her to do that. It doesn't make sense for him to rush into it either unless he's in it for a green card.

And I know some people do rush into marriage and it does work out. That doesn't mean it makes sense. It just means you got lucky.

I've done what I can at this point. I explained to her the need for caution here, and she won't listen so it's her problem.

It seems to me that one of the only ways she can tell if this guy is sincere or not is pushing off marriage. By getting married early on she is getting rid of one of her only ways of telling whether he is sincere or not.

[caliliving 606]

Happy Chic,

You have to realize the reason my approach may seem heavy handed is because I've already tried talking to her. The problem here is that she doesn't seem to be able to slow down at all, or consider that at least a small amount of caution and scepticism is needed here. There is absolutely no reason for her to be keeping a legitimate marriage secret from friends and family, and there is no reason she shouldn't slow down a little bit. She gains nothing by jumping into this thing. The whole reason for a courtship is to find out about the person. Almost every relationship I've been in I've found things about the guy I didn't like as time went on. Early on people only show their good side, you don't fight. It takes time to really see what being with the person would be like. I completely get that maybe these two have genuine feelings for each other. But secrecy and rushing into marriage? It makes no sense for her to do that. It doesn't make sense for him to rush into it either unless he's in it for a green card.

And I know some people do rush into marriage and it does work out. That doesn't mean it makes sense. It just means you got lucky.

I've done what I can at this point. I explained to her the need for caution here, and she won't listen so it's her problem.

It seems to me that one of the only ways she can tell if this guy is sincere or not is pushing off marriage. By getting married early on she is getting rid of one of her only ways of telling whether he is sincere or not.

what has been said about filing for the paperwork for K1 or CR1? have you talked to her and does she understand it could take 2 years?? i wonder about this because so many people think as soon as you get married you get a gc and can move here and i am wondering if she knows the process? maybe she thnks she will get married and they will hop on a plane together and spend their life together

and maybe just send her links on morrocan guys ect that seek out americans to marry?? i mean, you cant tell her anything but maybe if you show her something. ask why does doesnt move to morocco??

Like i said, if he is scamming her he understands the process and is willing to wait 2+ years bc he knows he will get a guaranteed GC as soon as he enters and probably never even meet her at the airport:/ I am also wondering if that is why he is doing the marriage route instead of fiance route???

[Amhara 460]

She gains nothing by jumping into this thing. The whole reason for a courtship is to find out about the person. Almost every relationship I've been in I've found things about the guy I didn't like as time went on. Early on people only show their good side, you don't fight. It takes time to really see what being with the person would be like. I completely get that maybe these two have genuine feelings for each other. But secrecy and rushing into marriage? It makes no sense for her to do that. It doesn't make sense for him to rush into it either unless he's in it for a green card.

Just to add my two cents about something like this: My husband and I decided to get engaged rather quickly into our relationship. I realized that I was developing feelings for him that were not appropriate and I decided I needed to end our friendship. In the meantime, he sent me a few messages that made me think he was developing feelings too, and it turns out he was feeling the same way about me. While we are both of different religions, we don't believe in casual dating; we both believe that courtship should lead to marriage. That being said, I agree that marriage shouldn't be executed fast - it's a serious commitment.

That's just a perspective that you may be able to support, that being engaged is a serious commitment, and so should dating. Thus, it should lead to marriage, not so much feelings. I think our timeline went pretty fast, given he's Afghan. We met in person eight months after we got engaged and by the time he got his visa and we married, we had been together for more than a year. Many international couples have a longer relationship, but many more have a shorter one too.

We weren't too secret about things. I told some friends of mine that I was talking to him, but waited for the visa to tell others. I was marvelously surprised when people's heads weren't blowing off their shoulders, actually. I was expecting to be lectured, although my younger brothers kinda disowned me (but they sort of needed to also - no harm no foul). I appreciated that the ones I told were open and asked me meaningful questions. As for my husband, he had to keep it pretty secret too. He only told mom and dad, then his brother. He brother objected and convinced mom and dad to disagree about our relationship, but dad saved us. Shortly before he died, he told mom that he accepted our engagement and he wanted her to also. He later told his younger sisters and his brother eventually agreed too. I say all that to say, it could be that she's only being secretive with you and a few. She seems to have allowed the other friend in a position to see "marriage documents", but you don't know what those documents really were. They could have been something she printed off and not legally binding at all. (You know how us women start writing the guy's last name to our name after the first date? LOL!)

I say all that to say, it's good to be concerned, but give her a little benefit of the doubt. With her being rather impulsive, you know how to handle her in her moments. Just don't forget mutual respect. Hers for you and yours for her. You probably would feel more comfortable with the whole thing if she had confided more with you. Why not talk to her about that? Why not just tell her you feel uncomfortable and you would like to get it all out on the table? If she doesn't want to discuss it, then you know you need to bow out. I know that I would have welcomed the opportunity to calm any of my friend's nerves about my engagement. If she has something to hide, let her hide it.

[Wintertime 0]

what has been said about filing for the paperwork for K1 or CR1? have you talked to her and does she understand it could take 2 years?? i wonder about this because so many people think as soon as you get married you get a gc and can move here and i am wondering if she knows the process? maybe she thnks she will get married and they will hop on a plane together and spend their life together

and maybe just send her links on morrocan guys ect that seek out americans to marry?? i mean, you cant tell her anything but maybe if you show her something. ask why does doesnt move to morocco??

Like i said, if he is scamming her he understands the process and is willing to wait 2+ years bc he knows he will get a guaranteed GC as soon as he enters and probably never even meet her at the airport:/ I am also wondering if that is why he is doing the marriage route instead of fiance route???

From my understand it is CR1 - that means shes getting married there and coming here on spousal visa right?

Already sent her links about green card marriages, and Moroccans in particular. She seemed to think it could be a problem for other people, but not her guy. I'm sure she thinks she will be spending a large amount of time in Morocco - I have no idea what his plans are though. He can tell her something she wants to hear.

So your last comment. Can you explain how that works. Are you saying all he has to do is get married in his country and then wait two years...then the second he comes to America he gets the greencard. He doesn't have to interview with American officials at all? I think our other friend said that she had brought up fiance route, and he preferred to get married in his country.

If she does get married can she divorce him anytime during that two year period? Will she still owe him financially from the divorce even if he never steps foot in this country?

By the way - one thing I should add. I have other friends that are in international marriages. I have no doubt that they can work, and I had no doubts when these other couples were engaged. There was no secrecy. There was no rush. There is something different about this situation that is really making me suspicious.

Edited February 18, 2016 by Wintertime

[Georgia16 2,858]

From my understand it is CR1 - that means shes getting married there and coming here on spousal visa right?

Already sent her links about green card marriages, and Moroccans in particular. She seemed to think it could be a problem for other people, but not her guy. I'm sure she thinks she will be spending a large amount of time in Morocco - I have no idea what his plans are though. He can tell her something she wants to hear.

So your last comment. Can you explain how that works. Are you saying all he has to do is get married in his country and then wait two years...then the second he comes to America he gets the greencard. He doesn't have to interview with American officials at all? I think our other friend said that she had brought up fiance route, and he preferred to get married in his country.

If she does get married can she divorce him anytime during that two year period? Will she still owe him financially from the divorce even if he never steps foot in this country?

Sounds like he already knows the process way to well to know he won't get the K-1 visa and therefore wants the CR-1 visa!

[Boiler 46,125]

From my understand it is CR1 - that means shes getting married there and coming here on spousal visa right?

Already sent her links about green card marriages, and Moroccans in particular. She seemed to think it could be a problem for other people, but not her guy. I'm sure she thinks she will be spending a large amount of time in Morocco - I have no idea what his plans are though. He can tell her something she wants to hear.

So your last comment. Can you explain how that works. Are you saying all he has to do is get married in his country and then wait two years...then the second he comes to America he gets the greencard. He doesn't have to interview with American officials at all? I think our other friend said that she had brought up fiance route, and he preferred to get married in his country.

If she does get married can she divorce him anytime during that two year period? Will she still owe him financially from the divorce even if he never steps foot in this country?

By the way - one thing I should add. I have other friends that are in international marriages. I have no doubt that they can work, and I had no doubts when these other couples were engaged. There was no secrecy. There was no rush. There is something different about this situation that is really making me suspicious.

The whole process takes about a year from filing, lots of paperwork and fees. But she is not even married yet and then there will be AP so that is where the 2 year number is coming from.

And yes he will enter and obtain a Greencard, there is a subsequent interview at the 2 year mark and he would either need to be in a valid marriage or divorced to remove conditions.

Divorce settlements, well that depends.

[Wintertime 0]

Sounds like he already knows the process way to well to know he won't get the K-1 visa and therefore wants the CR-1 visa!

Can you explain this more. This is all very confusing. The K-1 is harder to get than the CR-1? Why do people get turned down for K-1?

Edited February 18, 2016 by Wintertime

[Georgia16 2,858]

Can you explain this more. This is all very confusing. The K-1 is harder to get than the CR-1?

K-1 is the fiancé visa and CR-1 is the spousal visa.

From Marocco it is harder to get the K-1 visa.

Like I said before. If you really are concerned for your friend you tell her family.