Dutch test immigrants with gay kiss

[Melo 1]

I truly believe that immigration should be disallowed if the immigrant wants to bring his or her value system to the country they are migrating to... if you go to Bradford in Yorkshire it would seem almost like a city in Asia... schoolgirls dressed in burqa going to school... so on and so forth.... why migrate to a western country if you want to live the same kind of life-style as in the country you came from??? Most Asians in the United Kingdom say they are Pakistani, Indian blah blah... since they do not consider themselves English boot them out is what I say!!! The west has bent over backwards for these immigrant populations losing their own identity in the process. I think it is time to stop. It is time to say hey Christmas holidays are Christmas holidays... why should it be termed otherwise??? I hate bias of any kind so I am not advocating discrimination... but I am advocating booting those out who do not integrate. For example - my uncle who lives in New Malden, Surrey has friends who own the corner shop... they are immigrants form Punjab who have been there for over 40 years and do not speak a word of English... I find this unnacceptable. My personal opinion is they should be sent back to where they came from... anyway this is my take on things

[pax 0]

Much immigration happens for economic opportunity (not the kind we're all involved with here, but we're only a small piece of the pie, after all). So I suppose my question to immigrants who would rather not tolerate "Western" values is this: How do you think societies become economically prosperous? Not by shutting up half their populations in the house and refusing to allow them to drive, vote, show their faces in public, or even work outside the home at all. Not by threatening half their populations with violence or death for the most minor of infractions. Not by demanding that every single person in a given region follow the same flavor of any particular faith.

I'm a liberal and I believe in a diversity of ideas, opinions, and ways of life. But I also believe in human rights, and I do very strongly believe that human rights are just that--human rights. Not American rights, or Western rights, or European rights. I do not believe that any country, the Netherlands or anyone else, should tolerate or accept behaviors that violate human rights just because the violators happen to be immigrants. If they want to immigrate, they should be welcomed and given the chance to do so, but the laws of the lands to which they are coming ought to be respected in the process.

Particularly if the immigrants happen to be coming to enjoy greater economic prosperity, they must realize that much of Western economic success has come from the traditions of liberal democracy, and the contributions of women, gays, and persons of all faiths are crucial to our continued survival and success. If they cannot at least tolerate that, then they are welcome to go elsewhere, or stay home.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

They should show them pictures of women driving and voting too.

[Sister Fracas 5]

I truly believe that immigration should be disallowed if the immigrant wants to bring his or her value system to the country they are migrating to... if you go to Bradford in Yorkshire it would seem almost like a city in Asia... schoolgirls dressed in burqa going to school... so on and so forth.... why migrate to a western country if you want to live the same kind of life-style as in the country you came from??? Most Asians in the United Kingdom say they are Pakistani, Indian blah blah... since they do not consider themselves English boot them out is what I say!!! The west has bent over backwards for these immigrant populations losing their own identity in the process. I think it is time to stop. It is time to say hey Christmas holidays are Christmas holidays... why should it be termed otherwise??? I hate bias of any kind so I am not advocating discrimination... but I am advocating booting those out who do not integrate. For example - my uncle who lives in New Malden, Surrey has friends who own the corner shop... they are immigrants form Punjab who have been there for over 40 years and do not speak a word of English... I find this unnacceptable. My personal opinion is they should be sent back to where they came from... anyway this is my take on things

sheesh...

Yeah, boot 'em out if they want to be be Muslim....they should all convert to Christianity when they move to the UK! grrrrrrrrrr

[pax 0]

Immigrants of any faith should not be compelled to change their religious beliefs, or lack thereof. But they should be expected to act in accordance with the laws of their new land, and they should also expect to be confronted with new values and ways of life that may not be those to which they are accustomed. And immigrants do not get a free pass because they are immigrants when they commit crimes that violate human rights.

Example: an immigrant who follows a religion that says that homosexuality is a sin punishable by death. He is free to continue to believe that, but not to harass or harm gay people because of it. It's really no different from what we expect from native-born citizens.

Note that I'm not saying anything about other aspects of culture. I really don't give a toss if immigrants choose not to adopt the language, dress, art, whatever of a new culture (as far as language goes, they're only hurting themselves by not adopting it, but whatever). I'm limiting my comments here to actions (not ideas or beliefs) that violate laws established by the country of immigration.

Edited March 15, 2006 by pax

[Sister Fracas 5]

Immigrants of any faith should not be compelled to change their religious beliefs, or lack thereof. But they should be expected to act in accordance with the laws of their new land, and they should also expect to be confronted with new values and ways of life that may not be those to which they are accustomed. And immigrants do not get a free pass because they are immigrants when they commit crimes that violate human rights.

Example: an immigrant who follows a religion that says that homosexuality is a sin punishable by death. He is free to continue to believe that, but not to harass or harm gay people because of it. It's really no different from what we expect from native-born citizens.

Note that I'm not saying anything about other aspects of culture. I really don't give a toss if immigrants choose not to adopt the language, dress, art, whatever of a new culture (as far as language goes, they're only hurting themselves by not adopting it, but whatever). I'm limiting my comments here to actions (not ideas or beliefs) that violate laws established by the country of immigration.

nothing to disagree with there...

Also, in regards to:

since they do not consider themselves English boot them out is what I say!!!

When a thread went around awhile back about national identity, I asked this question ....would I be considered "English" when I some day immigrate to the UK or would I continue to be considered an American. I was told I'd be considered American. So what's the difference? Why shouldn't Pakistani or Indian immigrants be considered just that? I see no problem with them maintaining any part of their identity/culture as long as they follow the laws of the land.

[mawilson 2,133]

sheesh...

Yeah, boot 'em out if they want to be be Muslim....they should all convert to Christianity when they move to the UK! grrrrrrrrrr

The question is, why were all these foreigners allowed to move to the UK in the first place?

If you don't let 'em in, you don't have to boot 'em out.

Unlike America, the UK is *not* a country of immigrants and has been traditionally xenophobic.

The same is true of every other European country.

[almaty 19]

sheesh...

Yeah, boot 'em out if they want to be be Muslim....they should all convert to Christianity when they move to the UK! grrrrrrrrrr

The question is, why were all these foreigners allowed to move to the UK in the first place?

If you don't let 'em in, you don't have to boot 'em out.

Unlike America, the UK is *not* a country of immigrants and has been traditionally xenophobic.

The same is true of every other European country.

good point

[Sister Fracas 5]

sheesh...

Yeah, boot 'em out if they want to be be Muslim....they should all convert to Christianity when they move to the UK! grrrrrrrrrr

The question is, why were all these foreigners allowed to move to the UK in the first place?

If you don't let 'em in, you don't have to boot 'em out.

Unlike America, the UK is *not* a country of immigrants and has been traditionally xenophobic.

The same is true of every other European country.

something to be proud of, eh?

Oh, and I'll remember that when I immigrate there...I'll not expect to be welcomed...

[pedroh 21]

I truly believe that immigration should be disallowed if the immigrant wants to bring his or her value system to the country they are migrating to... if you go to Bradford in Yorkshire it would seem almost like a city in Asia... schoolgirls dressed in burqa going to school... so on and so forth.... why migrate to a western country if you want to live the same kind of life-style as in the country you came from??? Most Asians in the United Kingdom say they are Pakistani, Indian blah blah... since they do not consider themselves English boot them out is what I say!!! The west has bent over backwards for these immigrant populations losing their own identity in the process. I think it is time to stop. It is time to say hey Christmas holidays are Christmas holidays... why should it be termed otherwise??? I hate bias of any kind so I am not advocating discrimination... but I am advocating booting those out who do not integrate. For example - my uncle who lives in New Malden, Surrey has friends who own the corner shop... they are immigrants form Punjab who have been there for over 40 years and do not speak a word of English... I find this unnacceptable. My personal opinion is they should be sent back to where they came from... anyway this is my take on things

PWNED

[Melo 1]

I think that the very fact they do not make the slightest attempt to integrate is a real problem... religion and their country of origin counts for more than the country they have migrated to. What happened in London on the 7th July is testimony to that.

Personally if religion is done away with - most of the world's problems would cease to exist. Recognise that religion was created by man - based on myths that cannot be substantiated.

[rclouse 0]

I think that the very fact they do not make the slightest attempt to integrate is a real problem... religion and their country of origin counts for more than the country they have migrated to. What happened in London on the 7th July is testimony to that.

True that. I think that's exactly what the Dutch are trying to show to prospective immigrants. Holland is a very liberal country and as a resident you will be required to respect those values. If you can't handle seeing naked breasts in public or gay PDAs, then Holland probably isn't the place for you.

It really galls me when people immigrate, getting away from an arguably bad situation, but then try to wall themselves off and create the same kinds of conditions that led to the reasons they immigrated in the first place!

Look at all of the countries in the world that base their laws on sharia. Their governments are repressive, or their economies are the pits, or both. Why do they come to a country like GB, enjoy economic opportunities and liberties their countrymen back home can only dream about, and then try to enact sharia-like laws or rules for their communities that will just lead to what they left?

Not that sharia was a bad thing. Back 1400 years ago, it was a huge step forward. But the way it's implemented today, it's a tool of oppression.

[Sister Fracas 5]

Recognise that religion was created by man - based on myths that cannot be substantiated.

That may be true and certainly religion has caused more wars than anything....BUT...just because you choose not to follow any particular faith, it doesn't mean that there aren't a hell of a lot of people who find peace and comfort in their chosen faith. If you want people to respect your right to not practice a faith, you have to allow the same for them.

[mawilson 2,133]

something to be proud of, eh?

Not something to be proud of, but it's a fact. Pretending we're America doesn't make it so.

Oh, and I'll remember that when I immigrate there...I'll not expect to be welcomed...

We love Yanks, really. We'll make you a nice cuppa tea and you'll feel right at home

[Tobester 0]

There are some major exemptions. EU nationals, asylum-seekers and skilled workers who earn more than $54,000 per year will not be required to take the 30-minute computerized exam.

Also, citizens of the United States, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, Japan and Switzerland are exempt.

source: yahoo news

So if you make enough money you are more likely to integrate?

Are you less likely to be a terrorist?

It has to do what the people stand for, not where they are from or how much they make.

A well educated, financially independant extremist is still an extremist, muslim, extreme right/left wing or otherwise.