Marriage Agreements

[KarenCee 3]

Even if you both come to an arrangement and decide to pursue the K1 path, have either of you figured out how to convince the CO of the validity of your relationship? You have already stated you are "close" to loving her and that she's not there yet. Kinda hard to see this as a fiancé/fiancée relationship when your feelings are so uncertain.

As to your original question, lots of couples do the arrangement thing...prenuptial if you will. Something like that is best taken up with a lawyer as I'm sure you already know. Maybe getting to know her a bit more will give you a clearer idea of what she's wanting. JMHO.

[TimsDaisy 0]

And here we are again at that great question: so what is marriage, exactly? And a better question: what is marriage to United States Citizenship and Immigration Services.

It's a contract - as one poster pointed out. Anything beyond that comes from our personal/religious/cultural assumptions about the institution.

If you're concerned about a prenuptual contract, the best thing you can do is find a qualified family attorney to guide you through the process - better yet, one who knows immigration law as well.

Side note: "California is a community division state so if we got divorced we would split things anyway." Yeah, that's a popular misconception, I'm pretty sure. While CA and many US states are community property states, that doesn't mean you have a right to half your spouse's property upon dissolution of the union. I'm not a community property attorney - but from what I recall from school, the rough outline is what's yours before marriage and your spouse's before marriage goes with you respectively when you divorce. What you earn during marriage *may* be subject to being split down the middle. But a whole ton of exceptions, rules, and laws apply.

If anyone has substantial assets and doubts about the life span of the marriage - and a rather cooler calculation of vows - then a pre-nup is probably the way to go. Find a lawyer - or better yet - find a counselor and see if you're really ready for this kind of commitment - of the heart and of your bank account.

[genem 0]

And here we are again at that great question: so what is marriage, exactly? And a better question: what is marriage to United States Citizenship and Immigration Services.

It's a contract - as one poster pointed out. Anything beyond that comes from our personal/religious/cultural assumptions about the institution.

If you're concerned about a prenuptual contract, the best thing you can do is find a qualified family attorney to guide you through the process - better yet, one who knows immigration law as well.

Side note: "California is a community division state so if we got divorced we would split things anyway." Yeah, that's a popular misconception, I'm pretty sure. While CA and many US states are community property states, that doesn't mean you have a right to half your spouse's property upon dissolution of the union. I'm not a community property attorney - but from what I recall from school, the rough outline is what's yours before marriage and your spouse's before marriage goes with you respectively when you divorce. What you earn during marriage *may* be subject to being split down the middle. But a whole ton of exceptions, rules, and laws apply.

If anyone has substantial assets and doubts about the life span of the marriage - and a rather cooler calculation of vows - then a pre-nup is probably the way to go. Find a lawyer - or better yet - find a counselor and see if you're really ready for this kind of commitment - of the heart and of your bank account.

Hey everyone, thanks for all the opinions and advice. My first step was to email my fiancee' and ask her what she wanted to be included in the agreement and what her concerns were about assurance of our marriage. I am waiting for her reply. I do not think she is concerned about money, only that if something should happen to me or our marriage, what would she be able to do in a foreign country without a green card.

[Fandango 1,439]

I don't even know what to say really.

Again, like everyone...HUGE red flags. And alarm bells.

But it's not cos of the love factor...although why anyone would want to sponsor someone they don't love is beyond me. And one also has to ask oneeself why a woman would pull up her whole life and uproot her kid if not for love. But nowhere in the K1 does it say anything about 'love'.

Although both parties should be on the same page.

Here's one of the most worrying bits I read:

but we have only been together 2 times and corresponded for 4 months and no one knows what the future will bring. Thanks for your comments.

And here you are, OP on VJ asking us questions that we would have no way of answering. 'What did she mean?' 'How much might she want?' etc all screams COMMUNICATION PROBLEM and tbh - and I'm sorry to be so frank but - how in the world are you going to protect yourself from the mess you may be putting yourself in? You have children of your own as well, so their well being is tied up in this also.

I cannot see how you can vouch for this woman as it is clear you don't know her well enough, and since you're not madly in love with her, I cannot even begin to comprehend why you'd even be going down this path at this time.

But try to work on the communication issues, for your own sake....

[JoeMama 0]

Genem,

I do not mean to upset you even more than what you are but let me tell you something.....MANY MANY MANY russian women will agree into anything just to come to US. I am NOT saying all of them but MANY. One of the things that got into my mind is this : why was/is she in such a rush to leave Russia??? I think we all know the answer to that and cost of living in Moscow and St. Petersburg is up the roof. It looks like one of her main reasons why she wants to leave Russia is because of her son so he could have many opportunities in here and many open doors which are not that easy in Russia unless you got money. Why is she thinking about "what if marriage won't work" before you guys even got married? Why does she want an agreement? It sounds as if she's ONLY AFTER YOUR MONEY AND GREEN CARD. Be VERY CAREFUL. I am Russian myself ( but came here when i was 12 through a LEGAL IMMIGRATION as a refugee, when many Russian-Jews were immigrating) I know many russian people who will use each other for green card and are willing to pay up to $30,000 for fraud marriage. Sounds like your SO got herself into a better deal, she doesn't have to pay all that to get in US. I have read on many russian dating sites that ladies were looking for a "foreign lover" especially someone from US so obviously what your fiancee is saying is a huge RED FLAG. She should be thinking about happy love and marriage she'll have with you and everything that will come along with it rather than thinking " how much will you leave her if things don't work out" Be very careful.

Do some test on her...........tell her that you loved St. Petersburg so much that you want to move there and live there and see what she'll say. If she'll agree then she truly loves you and it won't matter where the two of you are but if she'll still hint about coming to US then her intentions are documents only.

Best of luck and hope things work out for the best!

P.S. I did NOT try to offend anyone who is bring anyone from russia or ukraine!!!!!!!

NYGirl, I agree with all you had said. Especially, about telling the fiance about moving to their country to live. That is the one thing I've always mentioned and you are absolutely right. Their response to that comment will give an obvious answer whether to proceed ahead with the relationship toward marriage. All in all, because I have 3 young daughters here which I love and am devoted to them. I would consider moving to my fiancee's country later in life if she wanted to go back. Unlike the original poster of this topic that was started, I declared right away that I do not possess any assests or am wealthy in the least. I barely make it month to month with my girls. Thanks to the ex, she really did a number on me being able to earn a great living like I used to. But I learned that all that hard work to earn money was not worth it. My focus is on my own family's love and happiness within our home. My fiancee shares this philosophy and family is what our focus is on and all we talk about. She comes from a middle-class background like me. That's the only time when financial matters were discussed. But she is adamant about wanting to go to work when she is able after being here to help ease some of the burden of me being a single parent. Since we will be married, she wants to contribute to our family as much as she can.

My only advice to the original poster is that he should have never filed without knowing for sure he was in love. If his fiancee is already looking at if their marriage will fail before it ever starts, it is more than likely that it certainly will.

Edited February 28, 2007 by altimixdj