Va. lawmakers apologize for slavery

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Check your history. There were white slaves too. My aunt's non-white family owned white slaves in Virginia. Some of you white folks that don't like what you perceive as the state "favoritism" toward blacks can maybe take some solance in that.

I never said anything about 'favoritism' towards blacks, nor do I recall anyone else doing so either.

I don't care what color the slave was, my opinion still stands.

And your implication that anyone would take solace in there being white slaves is not being culturally sensitive, is it?

Don't accuse me of trying to be culturally sensitive, please.

Edited February 26, 2007 by Green-eyed girl

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Ph.D.s in meaningful disciplines is an oxymoron.

Ya I was just thinking, I work with a guy who has a PhD in Computer Science and he is pretty much useless. A PhD has a way of fukcing up a mans mind and rendering him useless for anything but the most cerebral work. Problem is, there are a lot more PhDs out there than there are openings for actual cerebral work.

[Alex+R 0]

A major part of my argument is that since it did happen before our time, there is no apology needed. Therefore this comparison doesn't fit as Australia's situation is different.

Slavery took place "before our time", but the results of that repression are still being felt. Certainly as far as Virginia goes - slavery is a big part of their early history. Clearly its a subjective argument - but my point is that something that happens within living memory has a far stronger argument for apology.

That said as race is still a big issue in the US, tied as it is to class and economics - an apology (politically motivated as it might be) still has relevance IMO.

And imo, an apology implies guilt and does nothing to bring the races together as one people.

None of us can help what race we were born into. none of us can rewrite history. I'm certainly not going to apologize as a white woman for something some white people did long before I got here, no sir!

Perhaps that's why so many people consider the Holocaust a German problem, rather than a human one.

there you go again, lol

Hmm, I'm going to have to go with an "Amen" to erekose on that one. Unless we all accept certain things as human they will just keep happening.

Just because we weren't there for slavery doesn't mean we don't have some people in society still suffering for it and some, by extension, still benefiting from it.

eta: if slavery had no effect on our lives today, I would completely agree that since we weren't there we don't need to apologize. Trouble is, it's just not that simple.

Edited February 26, 2007 by Alex+R

[Niels Bohr 72]

Ph.D.s in meaningful disciplines is an oxymoron.

Ya I was just thinking, I work with a guy who has a PhD in Computer Science and he is pretty much useless. A PhD has a way of fukcing up a mans mind and rendering him useless for anything but the most cerebral work. Problem is, there are a lot more PhDs out there than there are openings for actual cerebral work.

Humans make mistakes. But, PH.Ds makes less mistakes. A lot more detailed orientated. If you have no experience in getting one, then you need to see if you can get one. I strongly disagree with you that he's incapable of doing his job.

[Sheriff Uling 3]

I don't believe that people comprehend the depth in which slavery has affected the plight of African Americans in this great nation. Remember, we are simply two generations away from segregation. The pain of slavery and segregation in African Americans lives on to this day and will for generations to come. It's like telling Jews to get over the Holocaust. That's not going to happen! There has been many strides taken to improve the opportunities for African Americans and others disenfranchised in this great nation. I believe the time for apologies and providing reparations for the centuries of oppression has long sailed and should have happened when slaves were freed. Today, apologies and reparations are completely unnecessary. America has many other domestic issues that need resolution and apologies should not be on that list. The American history has been carved in stone and those who come after us will judge and know the monstrous and horrible truth surrounding the foundation of this great nation. It's time to continue to quest to move forward in order to build and re-build the bridges of hope and opportunity for all Americans. God bless America!

Cheers!!!

Sheriff Uling

NOTE: These are simply my opinions…

I respect your opinion but as someone from abroad, I have a great knowledge of various African countries, as I studied it in school. yes, the whole slavery era was terrible. I do not think anyone is denying that. Was the US the first country to use slavery or was it the last? Answer is obviously no to both..

Just one quick question, can you tell me how many Will Smith's, Oprah's, Snoop Dogs, Barack Obama etc have come out from the African continent? A place where so many people drink water once every three days. Eat once a week etc..

I bet my life on it that there are so many good honest people living on the continent today that would give anything to live in America. That would give a finger to have 1/1,000 of what African-Americans have. That would give a toe not to be beaten or rapped every day.. Funny how so many African-Americans tend to hide this reality. I guess things are changing because there are a lot of great African-Americans here who have moved on, who have traveled abroad and actually realized how freakin lucky they are to be in this country rather than condemning it for it's past, ie Oprah..

Thanks Infidel. I also respect your opinion. These days I have not found myself responding to many posts that I make, but I'll make an exception today. Infidel, America would not be the "melting pout" of the world if it were not for the economic, liberal, and civil freedoms this great nation offers. With that fact, there are plenty of impoverished people across the globe that would love to be here in America (i.e. citizens of third world countries). Your attempt to make a point of how Africans would "give a toe to be beaten or raped every day" is a prime example of the insensitive nature that exists in this world. Slavery is not a means of satire to associate groups of people in order to make a point. Slavery was one of the most horrific and inhuman longstanding acts of man. Of course, that is my opinion and not an attempt to offend thee. You are right about one thing. African-Americans have made some strides in America in spite of the many obstacles they had to overcome. Yet, there is still so much improvement that needs to be made outside of the entertainment and sports industries. In fact there are many social and domestic issues that America needs to address and make strides to resolve. Hopefully, we can muster-up enough fortitude in order make strides to resolve some of those issues in the upcoming years to come.

[Fandango 1,439]

A major part of my argument is that since it did happen before our time, there is no apology needed. Therefore this comparison doesn't fit as Australia's situation is different.

Slavery took place "before our time", but the results of that repression are still being felt. Certainly as far as Virginia goes - slavery is a big part of their early history. Clearly its a subjective argument - but my point is that something that happens within living memory has a far stronger argument for apology.

That said as race is still a big issue in the US, tied as it is to class and economics - an apology (politically motivated as it might be) still has relevance IMO.

And imo, an apology implies guilt and does nothing to bring the races together as one people.

None of us can help what race we were born into. none of us can rewrite history. I'm certainly not going to apologize as a white woman for something some white people did long before I got here, no sir!

Perhaps that's why so many people consider the Holocaust a German problem, rather than a human one.

there you go again, lol

Hmm, I'm going to have to go with an "Amen" to erekose on that one. Unless we all accept certain things as human they will just keep happening.

Just because we weren't there for slavery doesn't mean we don't have some people in society still suffering for it and some, by extension, still benefiting from it.

eta: if slavery had no effect on our lives today, I would completely agree that since we weren't there we don't need to apologize. Trouble is, it's just not that simple.

What's mentioning the Germans have anything to do with the apology aspect of this conversation? Amen to what? That if VA didn't officially apologise, somehow, someday, there'd be slavery alive in America again someday?

Iirc, there's been no one here who hasn't acknowledged that slavery was a horrible low point in America's history.

So tell me, Alex...just how is this apology counteracting those in this country who are benefitting from slavery?

Btw, agreeing with Erekose...so very 'predictable' of you

tsk [/sarcasm]

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Ph.D.s in meaningful disciplines is an oxymoron.

Ya I was just thinking, I work with a guy who has a PhD in Computer Science and he is pretty much useless. A PhD has a way of fukcing up a mans mind and rendering him useless for anything but the most cerebral work. Problem is, there are a lot more PhDs out there than there are openings for actual cerebral work.

There are a few of us who make ourselves useful.

[Niels Bohr 72]

no, i'm not a state accounting analyst. but that does not preclude me from having an opinion, does it? as for the rest of your statements, i find them humorous.

Well, that tells me the maturity level I'm dealing with.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Ph.D.s in meaningful disciplines is an oxymoron.

Ya I was just thinking, I work with a guy who has a PhD in Computer Science and he is pretty much useless. A PhD has a way of fukcing up a mans mind and rendering him useless for anything but the most cerebral work. Problem is, there are a lot more PhDs out there than there are openings for actual cerebral work.

There are a few of us who make ourselves useful.

If you say so

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Ph.D.s in meaningful disciplines is an oxymoron.

Ya I was just thinking, I work with a guy who has a PhD in Computer Science and he is pretty much useless. A PhD has a way of fukcing up a mans mind and rendering him useless for anything but the most cerebral work. Problem is, there are a lot more PhDs out there than there are openings for actual cerebral work.

There are a few of us who make ourselves useful.

If you say so

I do, and my Ph.D. adds immense weight to my opinion.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Trouble is, it's just not that simple.

Certainly. Its not necessarily about 'race' either - since in the time since slavery (and lets not forget that some of the southern states practiced some form slavery well into the 1950s) was abolished, the race issue is intertwined with economics and class.

Interestingly, at least one southern state (Tennessee, I think) never rescinded its slavery laws until the mid 90's. Michael Moore (back when he did TV Nation) did a stunt down there - hired some black actors and led them around the city to celebrate the last day in which he could 'publicly demonstrate' his right to own slaves.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

What's mentioning the Germans have anything to do with the apology aspect of this conversation? Amen to what? That if VA didn't officially apologise, somehow, someday, there'd be slavery alive in America again someday?

Because one interpretation of:

I'm certainly not going to apologize as a white woman for something some white people did long before I got here, no sir!

is - "It's not my problem, why should I care?"

[Fandango 1,439]

Trouble is, it's just not that simple.

Certainly. Its not necessarily about 'race' either - since in the time since slavery (and lets not forget that some of the southern states practiced some form slavery well into the 1950s) was abolished, the race issue is intertwined with economics and class.

Interestingly, at least one southern state (Tennessee, I think) never rescinded its slavery laws until the mid 90's. Michael Moore (back when he did TV Nation) did a stunt down there - hired some black actors and led them around the city to celebrate the last day in which he could 'publicly demonstrate' his right to own slaves.

Yeah cos that's not exploitative at all.

Oh I'm sorry, it wasn't just for the movie...it was to make a strong political statement, I'm sure

[Fandango 1,439]

What's mentioning the Germans have anything to do with the apology aspect of this conversation? Amen to what? That if VA didn't officially apologise, somehow, someday, there'd be slavery alive in America again someday?

Because one interpretation of:

I'm certainly not going to apologize as a white woman for something some white people did long before I got here, no sir!

is - "It's not my problem, why should I care?"

No, again you're hitting a road block with reading comprehension. While I can empathise with the picture of what went on...and let's face it, none of us really know just how bad it was firsthand....it is not my place to apologise for something I had no part in.

Hooked on phonics maybe?

Jeez talk about reading into things, lol...but pls continue...I'm enjoying seeing you chase your tail and have your azz handed to you each time

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Trouble is, it's just not that simple.

Certainly. Its not necessarily about 'race' either - since in the time since slavery (and lets not forget that some of the southern states practiced some form slavery well into the 1950s) was abolished, the race issue is intertwined with economics and class.

Interestingly, at least one southern state (Tennessee, I think) never rescinded its slavery laws until the mid 90's. Michael Moore (back when he did TV Nation) did a stunt down there - hired some black actors and led them around the city to celebrate the last day in which he could 'publicly demonstrate' his right to own slaves.

Yeah cos that's not exploitative at all.

Oh I'm sorry, it wasn't just for the movie...it was to make a strong political statement, I'm sure

It was exploitative, sure - but Moore's theatrics aside - the point for me was that the slavery laws were never taken out the statute books until the mid-90's. By then of course they had been made redundant by various pieces of human rights legislation. Still - it makes you think.