The Myth Behind Defensive Gun Ownership

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If you ever have been to a gun show you would see their is no logic at what yap yap talks about .

Well in terms of what he said specifically it's surely either true or false. Either people are buying illegal guns through private sales at gun shows or they are not.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Well in terms of what he said specifically it's surely either true or false. Either people are buying illegal guns through private sales at gun shows or they are not.

These are largely legal transactions. Problem is that the seller has no obligation to query the buyer's eligibility to purchase a firearm. So anyone can buy a firearm there in a private sale - that's been documented and I provided the relevant footage and reporting. All the background checks that are mandated aren't worth squat if one can acquire firearms without one at many venues.

[Sousuke 1,214]

it's pretty easy to get a gun in virginia. certainly at gun shows. or pawn shops. or flea markets. are you denying this?

I'll agree that outside of California and maybe one or two other states, firearms are easy to acquire from private individuals. I could see requiring private party transfers for all states lowering firearms in circulation to people that are not eligible.

For the record, pawn shops have to have an FFL so they are doing background checks.

[decocker 7,198]

I'll agree that outside of California and maybe one or two other states, firearms are easy to acquire from private individuals. I could see requiring private party transfers for all states lowering firearms in circulation to people that are not eligible.

For the record, pawn shops have to have an FFL so they are doing background checks.

it makes no sense to me that there is no registration/tracking involved in private sales. i wouldn't be surprised if some of the smaller pawn shops around here just kept such transactions on the dl. i live in 'don't tread on me' country and i'd say at least 50 percent of our local population genuinely believes that obama is a socialist plotting the ultimate gun grab.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

it makes no sense to me that there is no registration/tracking involved in private sales. i wouldn't be surprised if some of the smaller pawn shops around here just kept such transactions on the dl. i live in 'don't tread on me' country and i'd say at least 50 percent of our local population genuinely believes that obama is a socialist plotting the ultimate gun grab.

You live in lib's neck of the woods?

[decocker 7,198]

You live in lib's neck of the woods?

true story, there are three shot guns just leaning up against the wall across the warehouse from me right now. i'm at work. pretty sure random guns hanging out in a warehouse that holds nothing but alcohol is breaking a law or two.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

true story, there are three shot guns just leaning up against the wall across the warehouse from me right now. i'm at work. pretty sure random guns hanging out in a warehouse that holds nothing but alcohol is breaking a law or two.

So where are these are the law-abiding gun owners I keep reading about?

[decocker 7,198]

So where are these are the law-abiding gun owners I keep reading about?

(in my experience people with money tend to live above the law, but another story)

well, they're here too i guess. it's just there are so many guns. too many guns.

[Sousuke 1,214]

it makes no sense to me that there is no registration/tracking involved in private sales. i wouldn't be surprised if some of the smaller pawn shops around here just kept such transactions on the dl. i live in 'don't tread on me' country and i'd say at least 50 percent of our local population genuinely believes that obama is a socialist plotting the ultimate gun grab.

If a pawn shop sold them without an FFL, they would be shutdown and people might go to prison.

Older firearms aren't held to this regulation though.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

it makes no sense to me that there is no registration/tracking involved in private sales. i wouldn't be surprised if some of the smaller pawn shops around here just kept such transactions on the dl. i live in 'don't tread on me' country and i'd say at least 50 percent of our local population genuinely believes that obama is a socialist plotting the ultimate gun grab.

In states where those transactions are to be registered, even in the case of simple transfers of ownership, say between family members, it is up to the individuals to comply with the law. So, you do still end up with folks that should not have a firearm acquiring them fairly easily. California, and I hope other states, have a program where they proactively search the residences of people that are prohibited from possessing firearms. The program has been extremely successful in seizing large numbers of firearms, but still a long way from getting all the illegally possessed firearms from those persons.

[decocker 7,198]

If a pawn shop sold them without an FFL, they would be shutdown and people might go to prison.

Older firearms aren't held to this regulation though.

i'm saying, what if they have a license but run the sale off to the side? i don't know if this happens, i'm just wondering. seems it would be relatively easy to do, but i don't know much about maintaining a ffl, what reporting is involved - tracking etc.

The program has been extremely successful in seizing large numbers of firearms, but still a long way from getting all the illegally possessed firearms from those persons.

i doubt that will ever be a done deal.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

i'm saying, what if they have a license but run the sale off to the side? i don't know if this happens, i'm just wondering. seems it would be relatively easy to do, but i don't know much about maintaining a ffl, what reporting is involved - tracking etc.

Everything is supposed to get logged in and out of the shop, where it came from, who it was sold to, et cetera, and that record kept indefinitely. Some state and local governments also keep their own databases. However, enough nutters were worried that somehow the Federal government could track who has what weapons as a prelude to taking everybody's guns away, so once a sale is made, and cleared the NCIS, that record is destroyed after 24 hrs. So, no Federal gun registry exists.

[decocker 7,198]

Everything is supposed to get logged in and out of the shop, where it came from, who it was sold to, et cetera, and that record kept indefinitely. Some state and local governments also keep their own databases. However, enough nutters were worried that somehow the Federal government could track who has what weapons as a prelude to taking everybody's guns away, so once a sale is made, and cleared the NCIS, that record is destroyed after 24 hrs. So, no Federal gun registry exists.

i can't tell if it's more sad or funny that the state of virginia tracks the sales and distribution of alcohol within the state on a monthly basis, every single liter accounted for and taxed. but guns can be traded and sold with a mere recommendation..

What are the laws concerning the private sale of a handgun?

To privately sell a firearm, it is recommended that you safeguard information pertaining to the transaction such as the date the firearm was sold, the complete name and address of the buyer, and the make, model, and serial number of the firearm. The seller and buyer of a handgun must be a resident of the state in which the transfer occurs. Should the firearm ever be located at a crime scene, trace of the firearm will determine the licensed dealer who last sold the firearm and will identify the last buyer of the firearm. To have your name removed from this process, you may consider placing your firearm on consignment with a licensed dealer. This will also ensure that the firearm is transferred only to a lawfully eligible individual.

[Sousuke 1,214]

i can't tell if it's more sad or funny that the state of virginia tracks the sales and distribution of alcohol within the state on a monthly basis, every single liter accounted for and taxed. but guns can be traded and sold with a mere recommendation..

Clearly your alcohol sales are too strict.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Cars are registered by the states and traceable to the owner. Clearly, that's too strict. I should expect my car to be confiscated any moment now.