Baker in 'gay marriage' cake row

[Teddy B 17,252]

Of course. If you want a cake with a message on it that endorses homosexuality - they won't serve you.

Pretty much, it's a service they won't perform.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Because of you are. That's why it's being taken to court.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Looking into this a little more, gay marriage isn't legal in Northern Ireland. So, in order to avoid being labelled discriminatory, the baker would have been forced to provide goods that support an activity that is illegal in his and the complainant's part of the world. Nice.

That isn't relevant. They were denied a service because they were not heterosexual. That is illegal in Northern Ireland -- that gay marriage is not yet legal in Northern Ireland is immaterial. As you probably well know, gay marriage was only recently made legal throughout Great Britain, yet the relevant secondary legislation that was applicable to England and Wales, and Scotland, made such discrimination there illegal as well during the time that same sex marriage was not yet permissible.

To those who think this is unfair, here's my advice: move to Northern Ireland. Agitate for the repeal of the regulations. There you go.

[Teddy B 17,252]

That isn't relevant. They were denied a service because they were not heterosexual. That is illegal in Northern Ireland -- that gay marriage is not yet legal in Northern Ireland is immaterial. As you probably well know, gay marriage was only recently made legal throughout Great Britain, yet the relevant secondary legislation that was applicable to England and Wales, and Scotland, made such discrimination there illegal as well during the time that same sex marriage was not yet permissible.

To those who think this is unfair, here's my advice: move to Northern Ireland. Agitate for the repeal of the regulations. There you go.

I respectfully disagree with this assessment. They were not denied a service because they were not heterosexual, they were denied a service that went against the company owners beliefs, which was promoting homosexuality. They were not denied a cake, they were denied the message they wanted to put on the cake.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

I respectfully disagree with this assessment. They were not denied a service because they were not heterosexual, they were denied a service that went against the company owners beliefs, which was promoting homosexuality. They were not denied a cake, they were denied the message they wanted to put on the cake.

Then wouldn't your argument be that they denied service on the grounds of religion? As I'm sure you know, that one's a big no-no in NI.

[Operator 1,927]

What if I wanted a cake with a dinosaur on it. That goes against some folks religious beliefs, I know a crazy woman that won't let her kids watch Harry Potter movies because it's about witchcraft...

I say let them eat cake!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Teddy B 17,252]

Then wouldn't your argument be that they denied service on the grounds of religion? As I'm sure you know, that one's a big no-no in NI.

Yes, my argument would be that, but I'm also not claiming that it would be allowed under NI law. I am not fluent in NI law. I'm simply stating my opinion that a business owner should have the right to refuse to perform a service based on religious beliefs. In the US I believe they would.

[LibCampFireClub 635]

Yes, my argument would be that, but I'm also not claiming that it would be allowed under NI law. I am not fluent in NI law. I'm simply stating my opinion that a business owner should have the right to refuse to perform a service based on religious beliefs. In the US I believe they would.

Nice try, but it's America. A place where the intent of the Constitution was to protect all. No special provisions. No exclusions to do stuff that others cannot do because your religion says you can. We don't serve two masters here, even though liberals and atheists want it that way. Freedom of choice means the right to choose. Go next door. Change the channel. Move to a new neighborhood. Or, stay and fight the people who live where you are now. Try as the libs may to force-feed their concepts to ALL people, they will be spending more time cleaning the spewed vomit from their faces and clothing than they would have be living and let living.

Edited November 7, 2014 by ExExpat

[Teddy B 17,252]

Nice try, but it's America. A place where the intent of the Constitution was to protect all. No special provisions. No exclusions to do stuff that others cannot do because your religion says you can. We don't serve two masters here, even though liberals and atheists want it that way. Freedom of choice means the right to choose. Go next door. Change the channel. Move to a new neighborhood. Or, stay and fight the people who live where you are now. Try as the libs may to force-feed their concepts to ALL people, they will be spending more time cleaning the spewed vomit from their faces and clothing than they would have be living and let living.

Can I ask what the hell you're talking about?

[LibCampFireClub 635]

Can I ask what the hell you're talking about?

Ahhh, easily confused I see. Read it over and over until you have a question that rises to the level of actually being considered a question. Note for progs, ask a specific question and get a more specific answer. Express dissatisfaction with a statement, and that's what you get right back atcha.

[Teddy B 17,252]

Ahhh, easily confused I see. Read it over and over until you have a question that rises to the level of actually being considered a question. Note for progs, ask a specific question and get a more specific answer. Express dissatisfaction with a statement, and that's what you get right back atcha.

No seriously, what are you talking about? The story in the op took place in Northern Ireland, not the US. My post claimed freedom of religious choice in a business should be a right and you mocked me as if I had said the complete opposite.

[LibCampFireClub 635]

No seriously, what are you talking about? The story in the op took place in Northern Ireland, not the US. My post claimed freedom of religious choice in a business should be a right and you mocked me as if I had said the complete opposite.

Sorry, not trying to mock you. I simply disagree that there should be separate laws that apply to one religion and thereby exclude them from following other laws. Laws are made for all. Laws should not force people to make cakes, or not make cakes. There are plenty of laws on US books that can be used to go after someone who is treating you unfairly.

[Teddy B 17,252]

Sorry, not trying to mock you. I simply disagree that there should be separate laws that apply to one religion and thereby exclude them from following other laws. Laws are made for all. Laws should not force people to make cakes, or not make cakes. There are plenty of laws on US books that can be used to go after someone who is treating you unfairly.

I'm still not clear on what you're saying. Should a business owner have the right to chose not to put a homosexual message on a cake based on religious beliefs?

[LibCampFireClub 635]

I'm still not clear on what you're saying. Should a business owner have the right to chose not to put a homosexual message on a cake based on religious beliefs?

Yeah. That should apply to everyone. Not based on religion, just that you choose not to. That's all. Let them go next door. That's a libertarian concept.

[Teddy B 17,252]

.

Yeah. That should apply to everyone. Not based on religion, just that you choose not to. That's all. Let them go next door. That's a libertarian concept.

I wouldn't go that far. Now you are opening up the door for all sorts of discrimination.

Edited November 7, 2014 by Teddy B