'Unintelligent' blacks 'brainwashed' to choose street cred over success: Charles Barkley

[Teddy B 17,252]

There is an internal logic to it and believe it or not it's quite common.

I'm actually studying psychology at the moment.

That article talks about how one can make their own negative predictions come true. it is true that this happens, but I'm referring to the large amount of blacks who purposely buck the system and publicly denounce the black people who abide by the system and become successful.

That was a perfect description of you.

[Janelle2002 3,865]

That was a perfect description of you.

I only know 20 black people? You might be right. I live in West Texas. I can count the number of black people I know on one hand. It's a little lonely.

[Janelle2002 3,865]

That article talks about how one can make their own negative predictions come true. it is true that this happens, but I'm referring to the large amount of blacks who purposely buck the system and publicly denounce the black people who abide by the system and become successful.

Which really isn't happening on that grand of a scale. Have you ever heard of birds of a feather flock together? Why would I hang around some unintelligent moron that will talk about my education or "success" everyday as if my education and success is a failure? This wouldn't make much sense. So how can we judge how often does this happen? You really can't. It is more of a rumor that has become truth but no one really knows the scale of it.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

That article talks about how one can make their own negative predictions come true. it is true that this happens, but I'm referring to the large amount of blacks who purposely buck the system and publicly denounce the black people who abide by the system and become successful.

I have no idea how prevalent what you are saying is. The argument I have heard in relation to it is that criticism of others success is related to the idea that to achieve that success, those people turned their back on their own identity. It's not about jealousy, it's about the perception that someone has betrayed their roots and thinks that they are better than they are. Obviously, it's not a terribly rational point of view. But again there is an internal logic to it - if you're part of an insular community where everyone is in the same economic boat and has the same expectations of the education system, employment and life, you can see why someone might resent a person who bucks the trend - it's just not how it's meant to be.

When I worked in publishing in NYC, I did a stint on a label that specialised in black fiction. What I found interesting about the books that were marketed to the black market tended to fall into familiar themes:

• People who lived in the ghetto, got out and then were drawn back in.
• So-called erotic novels involving forbidden interracial relationships or marriages being destroyed by infidelity (threesomes were also a common theme).

More than a few of these were written by authors who were in jail, or who at least purported to be.

Obviously you can't draw too many conclusions from this, but I think it's interesting how the same stories seemed to repeat themselves in fiction. There has to be some truth in there somewhere.

Edited October 27, 2014 by Hail Ming!

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Why is there such a strong call for nonconformity to our society amongst blacks?

Janelle and my experiences are different. But I can speak on what I know:

From what I've seen, it's because they don't want to lose their sense of being black. In today's society, being successful and rich is usually coined as a white attribute. Being black is usually to be ignorant or other crappy terms.400+ years of slavery, discrimination, segregation, and being told you're inferior, tends to work a number on people. If you come from a black family, and poverty and hard times are all you know, and you get out and make something of yourself, chances are when you go back home, you'll be shunned to an extent.

Because now, you're no longer part of the struggle. You've "assimilated" into what they see as "white" culture. White isn't a color, it's an attitude.

Edited October 27, 2014 by Su and Marvin

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Janelle and my experiences are different. But I can speak on what I know:

From what I've seen, it's because they don't want to lose their sense of being black. In today's society, being successful and rich is usually coined as a white attribute. Being black is usually to be ignorant or other crappy terms.400+ years of slavery, discrimination, segregation, and being told you're inferior, tends to work a number on people. If you come from a black family, and poverty and hard times are all you know, and you get out and make something of yourself, chances are when you go back home, you'll be shunned to an extent.

Possibly because they don't see how someone got there without having done a deal with 'the man'.

[Janelle2002 3,865]

Possibly because they don't see how someone got there without having done a deal with 'the man'.

But to a certain extent you do? You have to change the tone of your voice, the way you act, the way you walk, almost everything that made you who you were, you change.

If not, you are just the awkward person that got a job and you can never be expect to move up without changing who you were.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

But to a certain extent you do? You have to change the tone of your voice, the way you act, the way you walk, almost everything that made you who you were, you change.

If not, you are just the awkward person that got a job and you can never be expect to move up without changing who you were.

Sure, I can understand that.

It's not too dissimilar to the old argument about women in business - that to succeed they have to adopt masculine behavioural traits.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Possibly because they don't see how someone got there without having done a deal with 'the man'.

Pretty much. You're a sell out because you worked with the "enemy" to get where you are. And it's a shame that folks would rather live in poverty than succeed.

But to a certain extent you do? You have to change the tone of your voice, the way you act, the way you walk, almost everything that made you who you were, you change.

If not, you are just the awkward person that got a job and you can never be expect to move up without changing who you were.

For black people, you have to make extra sure you don't come off and intimidating or uppity and at the same time smart enough to be there in the first place.

[Teddy B 17,252]

I have no idea how prevalent what you are saying is. The argument I have heard in relation to it is that criticism of others success is related to the idea that to achieve that success, those people turned their back on their own identity. It's not about jealousy, it's about the perception that someone has betrayed their roots and thinks that they are better than they are. Obviously, it's not a terribly rational point of view. But again there is an internal logic to it - if you're part of an insular community where everyone is in the same economic boat and has the same expectations of the education system, employment and life, you can see why someone might resent a person who bucks the trend - it's just not how it's meant to be.

When I worked in publishing in NYC, I did a stint on a label that specialised in black fiction. What I found interesting about the books that were marketed to the black market tended to fall into familiar themes:

• People who lived in the ghetto, got out and then were drawn back in.
• So-called erotic novels involving forbidden interracial relationships or marriages being destroyed by infidelity (threesomes were also a common theme).

More than a few of these were written by authors who were in jail, or who at least purported to be.

Obviously you can't draw too many conclusions from this, but I think it's interesting how the same stories seemed to repeat themselves in fiction. There has to be some truth in there somewhere.

From what I've seen, it's because they don't want to lose their sense of being black. In today's society, being successful and rich is usually coined as a white attribute. Being black is usually to be ignorant or other crappy terms.400+ years of slavery, discrimination, segregation, and being told you're inferior, tends to work a number on people. If you come from a black family, and poverty and hard times are all you know, and you get out and make something of yourself, chances are when you go back home, you'll be shunned to an extent.

Because now, you're no longer part of the struggle. You've "assimilated" into what they see as "white" culture. White isn't a color, it's an attitude.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. I have a hard time wrapping my head around embracing a concept that actually hurts oneself, whether it be on purpose or not. Having never had to deal with that type of mindset in my own environment, I wasn't sure what was behind the thought process. I originally thought it was more about hatred and resentment towards the white society because of the wrongs of our past, but realistically this tends to make a lot of sense as well. I would be willing to say that both probably have a play in it.

[Janelle2002 3,865]

Pretty much. You're a sell out because you worked with the "enemy" to get where you are. And it's a shame that folks would rather live in poverty than succeed.

For black people, you have to make extra sure you don't come off and intimidating or uppity and at the same time smart enough to be there in the first place.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. I have a hard time wrapping my head around embracing a concept that actually hurts oneself, whether it be on purpose or not. Having never had to deal with that type of mindset in my own environment, I wasn't sure what was behind the thought process. I originally thought it was more about hatred and resentment towards the white society because of the wrongs of our past, but realistically this tends to make a lot of sense as well. I would be willing to say that both probably have a play in it.

Well that's because you and I have a different experience of society that didn't come with the idea that 'this is who you are and all you'll ever be'.

I would say though that it isn't just blacks who think this way - and you can probably find similar attitudes in economically deprived white areas.

[SMOKE 1,426]

[Teddy B 17,252]

Well that's because you and I have a different experience of society that didn't come with the idea that 'this is who you are and all you'll ever be'.

I would say though that it isn't just blacks who think this way - and you can probably find similar attitudes in economically deprived white areas.

True, and I don't think this mindset/attitude is something that is solely in black society, but I do think it is more predominant.

Another part of this mentality I don't understand is people who can cheer their favorite sports player on and wear their jersey, but turn around and say they aren't black enough, or that they've sold out their fellow black people. This just happened last week with Seattle Seahawks QB russell Wilson, and it's been said many times before. I believe the term used is "Cornball Brother", it's been used to describe Robert Griffin 3rd as well.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Isn't the term 'Oreo' supposed to mean the same thing - black on the outside, white inside?

I think it's the same thing - 'who does so and so think he is' - that sort of thing.