American and Algerian

[mayis.nove 0]

Hello!

First, thank you so much for reading this and taking your time to help me, a stranger to all of you. I appreciate it deeply, especially on this matter.

I met an Algerian girl online more than three years ago. Long story to short, we fell in love and have barely spent a day without talking. All my intentions are to marry this girl I love.

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She is 20 and I am 26. I am a Christian and she is not sure of her beliefs. She has told me that she is not Muslim, but to her family she always will be. Her father is deceased and her mother is paralyzed and has other health problems. She has two older sisters, 36 and 24, that know about our relationship. She has three brothers, and only two of them are aware of us. We are a secret from her 29 year old brother because it is completely NOT safe for him to know. I'm not joking at all. The other two are OK with me but I feel that they don't offer much help, and if things went bad they would possibly not be on our side.

We wanted to do things the "safe" way, so we tried for her to get a tourist visa to the states. She was denied. We couldn't let our love go, never, so after realizing the only other thing to do was to visit her in Algeria and file for a fiance visa, I prepared for my trip.

I just got back last week. It was like I always dreamed. Meeting her after three years was just a natural continuation for us. We are truly in love.

I was not able to see her house because it was too dangerous to go near there. The other brothers that are "OK" with me refused my company as well, so I had no house to go to. That left our only time together in the taxi or walking through Algiers. Every day she had to sneak out of the house to see me. Her older sister covered for her and said she was training her to be a nanny. Even with these sad difficulties my time with her was amazing. Our last day was very difficult. It was hard to hold my love's hand knowing that I would soon be just a video in Skype again.

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Now all I want to do is get her here to me. I wouldn't mind living in Algeria with her if it was easy. But I never got stared at so much in my life. I had no seconds of privacy with her, and when she cried a soldier yelled at me for hugging her. I loved Algeria, but I know I would never be able to breathe there. She must be here with me, so we can truly express our love and be away from people that want to hurt us.

Now I have read some things lately that have me worried. Will the embassy call her family after her interview to ask about our religious differences? Her one brother would never allow it. That could possibly be catastrophic. She is 20 and is an adult. It's not about her family, right? Because my family already loves her and even if they didn't, I am a man and she is the one I love.

And will her denied tourist visa play a part?

I have read that a fiance attorney is only extra money. I only just pass the limit of income for a foreign spouse, but if an attorney can represent our case with the embassy and get us out of this situation it would make a huge difference for us.

Basically, our relationship puts us in danger, but now that I'm back in America, she is the one in the most difficult position. I can't stop my love for her, and neither can she stop her's for me.

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Again, thank you all so much for your time and advice!

Jordan

[Gorkhali 214]

Man you have a tough love story. Woo la la a great love story to tell kids. I dont know anything about Algeria and i dont want to comment anything at all. All i wish you is good luck.

Our prayers and best wishes are always with you.

Cheers

[msbau764 245]

Man you have a tough love story. Woo la la a great love story to tell kids. I dont know anything about Algeria and i dont want to comment anything at all. All i wish you is good luck.

Our prayers and best wishes are always with you.

Cheers

Umm, the OP gave an account of what Algeria is like in terms of dating. I think you get the picture.

[Cathi 5,726]

If you are Christian and she is Muslim when she has her interview they will ask if the family is aware that she plans to marry out of her religion, and if they approve. They are very aware that it is forbidden for a Muslim woman to marry anyone but a Muslim. I am Catholic, my husband is Muslim, they did ask us at the interview about family and if they approved, but in Islam men can marry a Christian. You are treading a fine line and could possibly be putting her life in danger if her brothers ever find out what she is doing, they take it very seriously, especially if you already know they won;t allow it, approve of it and she had to sneak out to see you. In that culture it doesn;t matter her age or if she's an adult. No disrespect, but I don;t think you fully understand the culture if you think it's as easy as her being an adult and her own person.

An attorney doesn;t give you a better chance of approval, they just slow the process down. As long as you have plenty of evidence of an ongoing relationship and you are organized, you can do it on your own. Good luck

[mayis.nove 0]

What if she tells them at the interview that she is atheist? That's what she says she is. Will they most likely accept that? I know that Algeria is something like 99% Muslim. Does the interview take place at the American embassy? Are people there American or Algerian?

Ultimately whose choice is it that she leaves, America's or Algeria's?

I have studied the culture for quite some time now and I know it's dangerous. It's my hope that as long as the embassy doesn't bring the family into it that she can interview and be allowed to come to America. Is it more deep than this?

Thanks for your help and time! The whole process worries me, but I don't know what else to do. It would be impossible to forget about us.

Jordan

Edited October 4, 2014 by mayis.nove

[Cathi 5,726]

What if she tells them at the interview that she is atheist? That's what she says she is. Will they most likely accept that? I know that Algeria is something like 99% Muslim. Does the interview take place at the American embassy? Are people there American or Algerian?

Ultimately whose choice is it that she leaves, America's or Algeria's?

I have studied the culture for quite some time now and I know it's dangerous. It's my hope that as long as the embassy doesn't bring the family into it that she can interview and be allowed to come to America. Is it more deep than this?

Thanks for your help and time! The whole process worries me, but I don't know what else to do. It would be impossible to forget about us.

Jordan

the consulate will without doubt ask about the family, they know the culture and the first thing they will want to know is if she is leaving to marry another Muslim. I was at the interview with my husband and they concentrate on family and family acceptance for a good portion of the interview. And why would she tell them she is atheist when she isn;t? That is material misrepresentation and will result in a lifetime ban to the US. They do their own background checks long before she sets foot in that door and they know everything about her already. At the interview they knew things about me I never told them, things I would never think of. So keep in mind if either one of you ever lies at any point you are in for a big rude awakening. Never EVER lie to immigration under any circumstance whatsoever, They have the power to prevent her from ever setting foot into the US for the rest of her life.

Edited October 4, 2014 by mimolicious

[Cathi 5,726]

And only one trip to Algeria and a little research isn't very telling of her culture. You need to spend a significant amount of time there to fully understand. For goodness sake you snuck around and never even met her family, you said you held hands in public, holding hands is forbidden in public in the culture, touching at all is haram(forbidden) between unmarried couples, dating is forbidden which is what you were doing. So I really don;t think you have quite the grip on the culture that you think you have.

I am only telling you these things so you are aware of how quickly things can turn against you at an interview, and we have seen it time and again in this forum. What she is doing with you is dangerous considering she already knows her brother will harm her not if, but WHEN he finds out about you, because he WILL find out. Someone will slip up, he'ell discover her talking to you on skype, it will happen.

I never told you to forget her, but you need to have a talk with her and figure out a way to tell her brother, perhaps the other family members who approve and your girlfriend can sit down together and calmly explain to him the situation. I am sure she doesn;t want to leave Algeria not having told him the truth anyway, it;s her brother, a man who after her dad died has made sure to keep her safe, and in that culture that is exactly what men do for their unmarried sisters, it's what they are expected to do.You didn't get to see and understand how the family dynamic works while you were there which I think is very unfortunate. Family works very differently, and for the most part in a good way. Take the time to figure this all out without sneaking around and lying. Not only is she putting herself in danger, she is putting the people who are lying on her behalf in danger as well.

[Pianist27 31]

Let me be the bad guy here on this thread.

You met her online when she was 17. You go there and you've only seen her, no one else, correct? You never met any of her family? All you met was a girl in a taxi and on a few walks? Are you really sure she is who she says she is? If some of her brothers do not object, why did they not meet with you? Cultural differences aside, I certainly would want to meet someone my sister was interested in from so far away.

Be absolutely sure that you aren't being scammed here. I realize the culture imposes some barriers to getting to know her and her family, but I'd be very suspicious if I were you.

[mayis.nove 0]

I appreciate all the feedback.

However, I DO understand the culture. What I don't understand is the legal system by which she will be interviewed and brought to America.

I have said twice now that she is not Muslim. Therefore, when will she be lying at the interview? Her family is Muslim, but not her. Does that mean that she is Muslim legally on paper? Please explain this part.

I met both of her sisters. The eldest brother knew I was there but made excuses for not wanting to see me. The youngest brother was in jail for hard drugs when I met her, but now that he is out he went back to his old ways and made sure to beat her a few times. I don't think he's protecting her at all. He only cares about himself and his so called honor.

If holding hands is forbidden, why did I see a lot of couples doing it, and even a gay couple? I know you have to be careful to never go beyond that.

We have been talking for three years. I know her better than most of my friends here. I guarantee it's not a scam, things are way too hard for this to be a scam.

I think that two of the brothers are OK with it, but they could never convince the youngest. I've already seen the two normal brothers via Skype, and they've seen me. I've talked to their wives and seen one of them. Their three year old kid knows me by name. I've sent them gifts. The mother has seen me, but I wasn't able to meet her due to her being paralyzed. I've talked to some aunts and cousins. Many of them say, "Inchallah you will be with him and be married." It's merely that one brother that no wants to tell!

I can understand asking about the family if we were going to live in Algeria, but why would they go so deep if she will leave the country? I thought Algeria was more modern than this, especially for an outside marriage that will have nothing to do with sharia law.

Thank you!

Jordan

[msbau764 245]

the consulate will without doubt ask about the family, they know the culture and the first thing they will want to know is if she is leaving to marry another Muslim. I was at the interview with my husband and they concentrate on family and family acceptance for a good portion of the interview. And why would she tell them she is atheist when she isn;t? That is material misrepresentation and will result in a lifetime ban to the US. They do their own background checks long before she sets foot in that door and they know everything about her already. At the interview they knew things about me I never told them, things I would never think of. So keep in mind if either one of you ever lies at any point you are in for a big rude awakening. Never EVER lie to immigration under any circumstance whatsoever, They have the power to prevent her from ever setting foot into the US for the rest of her life.

There is one big if. If one hasn't used controlled substances a few months preceeding the medical and interview it would be idiotic to admit drug use. Nothing to gain, everything to lose.

[msbau764 245]

the consulate will without doubt ask about the family, they know the culture and the first thing they will want to know is if she is leaving to marry another Muslim. I was at the interview with my husband and they concentrate on family and family acceptance for a good portion of the interview. And why would she tell them she is atheist when she isn;t? That is material misrepresentation and will result in a lifetime ban to the US. They do their own background checks long before she sets foot in that door and they know everything about her already. At the interview they knew things about me I never told them, things I would never think of. So keep in mind if either one of you ever lies at any point you are in for a big rude awakening. Never EVER lie to immigration under any circumstance whatsoever, They have the power to prevent her from ever setting foot into the US for the rest of her life.

Isn't that highly unfair? What weight should the family's approval or disapproval bear if the beneficiary wants to enter into a legal contract with an American citizen under American laws? Whether or not the family is in favor of the engagement seems extremely irrelevant to me.

[Golden Gate 530]

My husband is from Morocco right at the border of Algeria and says that the countries are very similar. He said that she is an adult, and he believes the consulate will be considering the relationship itself, not the approval of the family. In fact, we did not have the approval of his family, and it made no difference. He just stated at the interview they didn't approve. She should just be honest at the interview.

We did have to be discreet in Morocco, and his father threatened to call the police on us, but he didn't know where we were. So, it is true that some family members could go far in their reactions, and you have to be careful and be smart. You can't convince everyone in a family. Some people will never accept it.

Edited October 4, 2014 by Golden Gate

[mayis.nove 0]

Isn't that highly unfair? What weight should the family's approval or disapproval bear if the beneficiary wants to enter into a legal contract with an American citizen under American laws? Whether or not the family is in favor of the engagement seems extremely irrelevant to me.

I do agree! I know that American laws and Algerian laws differ drastically, but wouldn't it be normal to proceed on American terms since she will be leaving Algeria? This is why I want to know if the consulate is American and will think like Americans, or if they will operate more on the side of Algerian law.

Algerian law says that a wali (male guardian every female has) cannot force a woman to marry someone against her will or oppose the marriage. So she can't be forced out of this in any way. I know that our marriage would not be recognized in Algeria, but we won't be doing it in Algeria.

Is it really so complicated on this interview that they might not issue the K-1 for her? The only issue I'm worried about is her abusive brother. Otherwise everything would be ok! When his prison term was cut short he made everything very difficult.

Edit: Thank you, "Golden Gate." That's what I'm really hoping to hear.

Thanks so much!

Jordan

Edited October 4, 2014 by mayis.nove

[Golden Gate 530]

You're welcome. Good luck! Also, stay safe if you travel there again considering the recent kidnapping and killing of the French climber. There are some dangerous groups in Algeria, which is why the border between Algeria and Morocco has been closed for some time now.

[mayis.nove 0]

You're welcome. Good luck! Also, stay safe if you travel there again considering the recent kidnapping and killing of the French climber. There are some dangerous groups in Algeria, which is why the border between Algeria and Morocco has been closed for some time now.

Yes I will! I was actually there in Algeria when the news hit about the French man. It was unnerving.

So has anyone here seen a case of a Muslim-born woman leaving the country to be with a man of another religion?

And does anyone know if the consulate will care about Algerian tradition with her leaving Algeria to a place where it won't matter? My family loves her, so there are no problems on my side.

Thanks to everyone who has taken their time here!

Jordan