Weapons Systems the US Donated to ISIS

[rlogan 2,036]

Courtesy of the USA, here is but a brief tour of the weapons now in the hands of ISIS:

Of course, Hum Vees:

Nice Ride!

I think this is about the zippiest thing they have right here:

That's a FIM-92 Stinger MANPAD. Talk about HOT! Check this out:

The FIM-92 Stinger is a shoulder-fired infrared homing surface-to-air missile. It was originally designed by the U.S. and it entered service in 1981. These MANPADs are extremely dangerous and can effectively take down helicopters and aircraft

Old School military will recognize a M198 Howitzer here. This is a real battle-wagon medium sized artillery piece you should not underestimate in a pinch, like cracking through those stubborn city defenses and parading right downtown, yes sir. Get out of the way! A bit on this old friend:

The M198 can fire rounds upwards of 14 miles. This howitzer can launch a variety of munitions, including high explosives, rocket-assisted projectiles, and white phosphorus. ISIS likely captured howitzers from the Iraqi Army after they fled their bases.

These guys have it all though: T-55 and T-72 tanks, rocket launchers, grenade launchers, anti-aircraft guns, heavy machine guns - what every little boy wants for Christmas. Comin's to a town near you, filling power vacuums left by the US all over the middle east! In Libya, they even have commercial planes. Those are great because they can be flown into cities chock full of goodies, and they look, um, like civilian planes. So you got the element of surprise workin' for ya there. A review of ISIS weapons:

http://www.businessinsider.com/isis-military-equipment-breakdown-2014-7?op=1

Obama is about to make some kind of announcement on his ISIS strategy, which is an air campaign facilitated by whatever ground assets he can get into place. Our stooge in the Green Zone will help us there. So? What is this bombing going to accomplish? Bombing our own Hum-Vees and Howitzers.

This is the USA in the middle east, just like it was in Viet Nam:

I was in a small minority against the invasion of Iraq, and you take the typical warmonger bullying about what a terrorist-sympathizer you are when you do so. But this is the scale of blundering finally coming home to roost for the USA with Iraq, Libya, and elsewhere that the USA thought it was the "indispensable nation".

You guys - the warmongers on both the right and left - claim to know so much more than the rest of us. As if managing a country on the other side of the world completely foreign to your language and culture is like doing the laundry. Your minds cannot think past "regime change" - which is a coy little way of saying overthrowing a government by war. Now, again - tell me what you do after the air war against ISIS? You are always bringing these threats to my attention for some "Shock and Awe; MIssion Accomplished" promises. Smart bombs get you dumb results like crazies armed with smart bombs themselves.

Don't get me wrong. These are old school crazies. Wahabbist, but more of a modern mutant version that rejects Saudi Arabia's would-be monopoly over the definition. A quick read on the distinction:

http://muslimvillage.com/2014/09/06/57428/to-understand-isis-look-at-the-history-of-saudi-arabias-wahhabism/

These are the convert-or-die wife/daughter rapists and plunderers bringing back an ancient cultural heritage. Rule by terror - sure.

But the truth is, the disaffected Sunni are now allies of ISIS against our puppet regime in the Green Zone. That's what is really going on here. The Sunni are going to be just as disaffected after our air war as they were before, and therefore still allied with ISIS. Do you see how making war in a country and thereafter trying to control it can get the populace aligned with the most radical and savage revolutionary element?

I swear we are insane. More war is now the go-to strategy for America. No mistake is too great to admit. Always thinking no further than the next battle instead of the war itself. Can we please be done with ruling the rest of the world by force now?

War has gotten us exactly the thing the whole War on Terror was supposed to stop: awesome weapons in the hands of rape-and-murder crazies. And we actually produced or supported the acquisition of those weapons, on behalf of Maliki, our stooge in Iraq.

Get out of Iraq. All of it. Just like Viet Nam, absolutely. The sooner we do that, the sooner the country can fix itself on its own terms and deal with the crazies themselves. Stop aligning the local population with the crazies. You do that by getting out. Not just the army, not just the Green Zone, the CIA too and every other kind of meddling.

Edited September 8, 2014 by rlogan

[GandD 5,966]

Yeah, but now we get to blow them up with our fancy missiles and jets. At least most of these things are made in the US, ya know.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

The US should have never gotten involved in Iraq - it wasn't about WMD, it was an attempt to create a US friendly regime in the Middle East and to privatise Iraq's oil.

That said, I don't think the situation will fix itself if the USA pulls out.

I have no idea what the solution to this is - but it's probably too late to stop what is coming - genocide and a horrible regional war that could consume the entire region.

WW3 anyone?

[OriZ 3,157]

The US should have never gotten involved in Iraq - it wasn't about WMD, it was an attempt to create a US friendly regime in the Middle East and to privatise Iraq's oil.

That said, I don't think the situation will fix itself if the USA pulls out.

I have no idea what the solution to this is - but it's probably too late to stop what is coming - genocide and a horrible regional war that could consume the entire region.

WW3 anyone?

I have no doubt. I actually think we've been in some kind of form of WWIII since 9/11. It's just a much slower moving war.

[UncleBeer 244]

Obama is about to make some kind of announcement on his ISIS strategy

Did Valerie Jarrett give him one since last week?

[lostinblue 1,989]

FIM-92 Stinger MANPAD...Looks like a few dozen of these could be very easily carried across our southern border..Perhaps the left thinks that would be too hard of a journey for folks used to fighting in 3 countries at the same time.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

FIM-92 Stinger MANPAD...Looks like a few dozen of these could be very easily carried across our southern border..Perhaps the left thinks that would be too hard of a journey for folks used to fighting in 3 countries at the same time.

It would probably be easier to get them from somewhere closer to home... Rather than ship them across the ocean...

[JohnR! 5,495]

I am surprised the motley crew has not pinned this one on Obama as well...

The US should have never gotten involved in Iraq - it wasn't about WMD, it was an attempt to create a US friendly regime in the Middle East and to privatise Iraq's oil.

That said, I don't think the situation will fix itself if the USA pulls out.

I have no idea what the solution to this is - but it's probably too late to stop what is coming - genocide and a horrible regional war that could consume the entire region.

WW3 anyone?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Oh I'm sure it will be forthcoming. I see it as getting dealt several bad hands of poker - no matter how good of a player you are, sometimes you just can't win.

I just don't get what people want to see done here - more war, or sit back and let whatever happens happen. Neither are great solutions really.

[OnMyWayID 1,489]

Sorry but I'm going to have to call a possible ethics breach here. These were not donated to ISIS as the titles states but captured by hostile forces. The title appears to have been phrased in such a way to purposefully cause possible discord amongst those of us who take time to thoughtfully consider and discuss such matters.

Edited September 8, 2014 by OnMyWayID

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Sorry but I'm going to have to call a possible ethics breach here. These were not donated to ISIS as the titles states but captured by hostile forces. The title appears to have been phrased in such a way to purposefully cause possible discord amongst those of us who take time to thoughtfully consider and discuss such matters.

You could, of course, ignore the title...

[UncleBeer 244]

Sorry but I'm going to have to call a possible ethics breach here. These were not donated to ISIS as the titles states but captured by hostile forces. The title appears to have been phrased in such a way to purposefully cause possible discord amongst those of us who take time to thoughtfully consider and discuss such matters.

Hear hear.

[rlogan 2,036]

A timely article for us with a lot more U.S. - made weapons supplied by the United States to ISIS:

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mikegiglio/11-photos-of-us-weapons-used-by-isis-and-some-rockets-from-a#4j4lkac

Where are these being found? In northern Syrian ISIS hands. Made in the USA. Transported overseas to them by the USA. The smartest people in the room were telling us we had to spend $25 billion running the Iraq army to support our stooge in the Green Zone. But you can't force people to defend a government that represents the USA instead of them. So the weapons go to who finds them handiest at the time.

The answer OF COURSE, is to arm Syrian "moderates", Kurds, and the devil himself if we have to. A future of continuous blowback, all justified by the last round of blowback.

I mean the title of this thread literally: in the larger scope of strategic lessons of Iraq and the middle east more generally: We went there under the premise of disarming radicals, enemies of the U.S. and most especially Al Qaeda style. And what we have done since 2003, in a mere decade of historically disgraceful acts, is arm a virulent strain of jihad harkening back to days of camel raids, cutting the mens' heads off with knives, raping the women and girls, burning their villages, etc. With a religious patina, but violent thugs nevertheless. I accept the term terrorist being applied to them because they rule by terror.

This is what we created, not what we must destroy. We can ship weapons, but we can't rule countries. If you want world war three, just keep shipping more and bigger weapons.

Edited September 8, 2014 by rlogan

[OnMyWayID 1,489]

I mean the title of this thread literally:

Ga! Its one thing to do something moronic, don't come out and literally admit it for Pete sake!

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Same as with guns in this country - if you spread them around in large enough numbers, some will end up in the wrong hands.