Putin is under Satan's influence: leader of Kiev Orthodox Church

[Janelle2002 3,865]

People are complex, they aren't inherently evil. Even Hitler cared about animals.

It's a bit of a cop-out to suggest that someone's bad behaviour is the result of some sort of possession or influence. People make choices and adults are responsible for their own behaviour. They have to be.

Even if they use the devil made me do it, doesn't mean they should not get the death penalty or go to jail. You are confusing my belief that the devil exist with someone being punished for their crimes. I don't care if they devil made them do it or not, they should be punished. This does not change my belief that the devil exist. The devil is those little tiny voices in your head that tells you to do something you have no business doing. And i'm not talking about forced Christian guilt on kissing a boy, I mean the hard core stuff.

[Curmudgeon 227]

Hahahahahahaha not an attack but you still say that I post uneducated.

Why? Because my characterization shows that I would rather believe the devil influences people to do bad things other than accepting humans are just inherently evil.

What does that say about your character? Anytime you jump on someone else because they would rather believe that all people can be good if they would just strike down the little voice in their head that is telling them to do wrong. Sorry, I would rather for humans to do good things.

I am uneducated and unsophisticated but you do realize the notion of the devil has been around before I was even thought of and if my only downfall is believing in it, so be it. I am uneducated along with the other millions, Catholics, Christians, Jehovah Witnesses and everyone else that does.

And for you to attack me and say, in a nut shell, I am uneducated and unsophisticated is more of a judgment on yourself than on me.

It is an unsophisticated view (as in, one that uses a simple system of blame and justification) rather than one that more properly encompasses the human condition, people are extremely complex and can have obnoxious and odious views on some things and yet be compassionate and caring on others. It is very simplistic to thing that humans are either inherently good or inherently evil. They are neither one nor the other.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I don't think you've thought it through.

If evil is the result of external influence then a person can't be responsible for the things they do. If they aren't responsible for the things they do then it's questionable to punish them for their actions while under the influence. That's simply a logical interpretation of that view.

IMO the devil is simply a fantasy story people have come up with to explain why other people do evil things. Because it's too scary to imagine that a person might make evil choices of their own volition and for their own reasons.

It is an unsophisticated view (as in, one that uses a simple system of blame and justification) rather than one that more properly encompasses the human condition, people are extremely complex and can have obnoxious and odious views on some things and yet be compassionate and caring on others. It is very simplistic to thing that humans are either inherently good or inherently evil. They are neither one nor the other.

+1

[Curmudgeon 227]

Even if they use the devil made me do it, doesn't mean they should not get the death penalty or go to jail. You are confusing my belief that the devil exist with someone being punished for their crimes. I don't care if they devil made them do it or not, they should be punished. This does not change my belief that the devil exist. The devil is those little tiny voices in your head that tells you to do something you have no business doing. And i'm not talking about forced Christian guilt on kissing a boy, I mean the hard core stuff.

There are no voices telling people to do things that are evil. It's all from within. Taking ownership of the responsibility for the bad things that people do is necessary in order to be able to combat it. Blaming 'voices' telling people to do things they would not other wise do is nonsensical and fails to address the problem. If you are plagued by voices telling you to do things that are evil you basically haven't understood how to live as part of a society or haven't grown up. That's either because you are mentally ill or emotionally immature both of which can be addressed if you leave the 'devil' out of the equation.

[Rob L 3,811]

There are no voices telling people to do things that are evil. It's all from within. Taking ownership of the responsibility for the bad things that people do is necessary in order to be able to combat it. Blaming 'voices' telling people to do things they would not other wise do is nonsensical and fails to address the problem. If you are plagued by voices telling you to do things that are evil you basically haven't understood how to live as part of a society or haven't grown up. That's either because you are mentally ill or emotionally immature both of which can be addressed if you leave the 'devil' out of the equation.

I think I know where you think you are trying to go with this, but I don't think you understand mental illness enough to speak with any authority.Best to stick to the emotional maturity bits..

[Curmudgeon 227]

I think I know where you think you are trying to go with this, but I don't think you understand mental illness enough to speak with any authority.Best to stick to the emotional maturity bits..

Conversely, I have no idea what your intention is with this post. My only point is that the devil is not responsible for things that people hear in their heads. I am sure there are mental illnesses that do make people hallucinate and believe they hear the devil's voice but I do not know for sure and am certainly not trying to suggest I am an authority on mental illness. Perhaps you have another point you would like to make bearing this in mind?

[Rob L 3,811]

No, you made it , you are not an authority on mental illness...

[Curmudgeon 227]

No, you made it , you are not an authority on mental illness...

That's it, that's your point? You want to make it clear beyond a shadow of a doubt that I am not an authority on mental illness even while I never claimed to be one? Isn't that a tad futile?

[Rob L 3,811]

If Satan does not exist then how did Putin strike a deal with him to pull something like this off

.....

Or look like this....

[Janelle2002 3,865]

It is an unsophisticated view (as in, one that uses a simple system of blame and justification) rather than one that more properly encompasses the human condition, people are extremely complex and can have obnoxious and odious views on some things and yet be compassionate and caring on others. It is very simplistic to thing that humans are either inherently good or inherently evil. They are neither one nor the other.

Ok I get it. I am a bad person for believing there is a devil.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Ok I get it. I am a bad person for believing there is a devil.

The devil can only exist if people believe in him. That makes those that believe in him responsible for his very existence.

[Rob L 3,811]

Ok I get it. I am a bad person for believing there is a devil.

I don't think he said you were bad, you are just unsophisticated ( dont let me speak for the Curmudgeon though)

The devil can only exist if people believe in him. That makes those that believe in him responsible for his very existence.

Do you believe that?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Do you believe that?

If I said yes, would you believe that? What if I said no?

[Janelle2002 3,865]

I don't think he said you were bad, you are just unsophisticated ( dont let me speak for the Curmudgeon though)

Do you believe that?

You left out the uneducated part. If he is not a believer in God or the devil it is his business but to make me uneducated because I do is foolishness in itself.

[GandD 5,966]

Ok I get it. I am a bad person for believing there is a devil.

No one knows or will likely ever know.