Russian Law - Registration of all Russians who are abroad

[b_fowler 0]

There has been a large amount of discussion - in my community - about one of the newest Russian laws. That all Russians - with green cards, and citizenship - must register with the immigration department. Here is some information that was passed around here in my community:

http://www.garant.ru/hotlaw/federal/557998/#review

and these are the documents that I made to print so they could have a tear off portion.

Print with 2 sided and flip on the short side.

Hope these help someone else.

Any comments?

Question 1 - Format 1.pdf

Question 2 - Format 1.pdf

[Mike&Lena 3]

You can't imagine how happy I was to see your post:) My wife has been trying to get this process done while visiting there in Russia, and as the clock keeps ticking away for her to do this, the offices there told her they didn't even have these forms yet. Perfect timing and thank tou for sharing...my wife is now at ease about getting thus done.

[Texasav8r 183]

I think this only applies to Russian citizens who actually live in Russia and have citizenship (or perm resident) in another country. It does not apply to Russians living abroad (away from Russia). Unless that has changed very recently, it isn't something that should concern Russians living here, unless of course they believe they may move back at some point.

Is this new or different from the previous declaration from a few months ago?

Regardless, we won't be bothering with it as she will be living in the US. What are the consequences?

Edited August 8, 2014 by Texasav8r

[eekee 182]

What I have read is that it applies to Russians who have kept their registration in Russia. So if you keep an apartment there where your citizen spouse is registered, or if they're registered at their parents' apartment, it counts as "living in Russia." No one really knows exactly what to do, though, and who needs to do it. But if your wife doesn't figure it out over there in time, I think she should be able to do it through the consulate in the US.

[Mike&Lena 3]

What I have read is that it applies to Russians who have kept their registration in Russia. So if you keep an apartment there where your citizen spouse is registered, or if they're registered at their parents' apartment, it counts as "living in Russia." No one really knows exactly what to do, though, and who needs to do it. But if your wife doesn't figure it out over there in time, I think she should be able to do it through the consulate in the US.

Yes, I agree, with your comment. My wife is registered there, and maintains an apartment there as well. Her local offices tell her to return around the 17th to apply, and her flight back here is on the 20th...so this form is like a jump start for her. What is really bad, is they are given 60 days to do this, (from the 4th of August), yet with many regional offices are not ready to process this, the clock keeps ticking away, and the deadline doesn't change!

[Hollyday 122]

The consequences of not doing it can be a fine or some work you have to do but then you have a criminal record in Russia. I'm considering doing this for myself because there's no official definition of 'permanently residing abroad'. Even though i don't have a permanent registration in Russia anymore.

[Mike&Lena 3]

What I have read is that it applies to Russians who have kept their registration in Russia. So if you keep an apartment there where your citizen spouse is registered, or if they're registered at their parents' apartment, it counts as "living in Russia." No one really knows exactly what to do, though, and who needs to do it. But if your wife doesn't figure it out over there in time, I think she should be able to do it through the consulate in the US.

From all that I have read, you cannot do this at the consulate in the US. It must be done in the regional offices there in Russia, in person, however they do allow you to mail this in to them...but then...they do not send you any confirmation of receiving it, so you can still easily be listed as a "criminal"...especially if it gets lost in the mail. I am now told, that the immigration offices there have these forms....BUT...get this.... they do not have a law that tells them they can give this form to the public yet, so my wife is now told to come back on the 17th...which is a Sunday...haha..they are closed, so she will try again on the 18th. Even if you went down with a printed out form, they will not take it, so you cannot submit it yet. My wife asks...maybe they need a law to use the toilet:)))) She is very very upset with this whole mess, and frankly I don't see how she can endure anymore BS from the government. My question is, why are the really doing this in the first place?????

Edited August 12, 2014 by Mike&Lena

[ONA 133]

From all that I have read, you cannot do this at the consulate in the US. It must be done in the regional offices there in Russia, in person, however they do allow you to mail this in to them...but then...they do not send you any confirmation of receiving it, so you can still easily be listed as a "criminal"...especially if it gets lost in the mail. I am now told, that the immigration offices there have these forms....BUT...get this.... they do not have a law that tells them they can give this form to the public yet, so my wife is now told to come back on the 17th...which is a Sunday...haha..they are closed, so she will try again on the 18th. Even if you went down with a printed out form, they will not take it, so you cannot submit it yet. My wife asks...maybe they need a law to use the toilet:)))) She is very very upset with this whole mess, and frankly I don't see how she can endure anymore BS from the government. My question is, why are the really doing this in the first place?????

Why are they doing this? Who knows... maybe they are planning on "protecting" Russian speakers in other countries (they've been doing a lot of that in different places lately). Maybe they will create some more "interesting" laws in future, related to taxation of people, who have another citizenship or a resident card, or related to our property in Russia. Whatever this is, I don't expect any positive changes.

However, I have some information that might help your wife. It's all in Russian, and I don't feel like translating, but you can have her read this:

Итак, закон, обязывающий граждан РФ уведомлять о иных гражданствах, ВНЖ и документах на право постоянного проживания, принят и 4 августа 2014 года вступил в силу.

Закон называется

Федеральный закон от 04.06.2014 г. № 142-ФЗ "О внесении изменений в статьи 6 и 30 Федерального закона "О гражданстве Российской Федерации" и отдельные законодательные акты Российской Федерации"

Прочитать текст закона можно здесь.

www.consultant.ru/document/cons_doc_LAW_163933/

Основной подзаконный акт - приказ ФМС РФ, определяющий порядок подачи уведомления так же принят и опубликован 05.08.2014 г. Он вступает в силу 17.08.2014 г.

Называется

Приказ Федеральной миграционной службы от 28 июля 2014 г. № 450

"Об утверждении форм и порядка подачи уведомлений о наличии у гражданина Российской Федерации иного гражданства либо вида на жительство или иного действительного документа, подтверждающего право на его постоянное проживание в иностранном государстве"

Прочитать текст приказа можно здесь.

base.consultant.ru/cons/cgi/online.cgi?req=doc;base=LAW;n=166884

Кроме того, принят еще один подзаконный акт - постановление правительства РФ.

Называется

Постановление Правительства Российской Федерации от 30.07.2014 № 733 "Об утверждении Правил осуществления Федеральной миграционной службой и ее территориальными органами учета письменных уведомлений о наличии у граждан Российской Федерации гражданства иного государства"

Прочитать текст постановления можно здесь.

pravo.gov.ru:8080/Document/View/0001201408070010?index=0&rangeSize=1

С целью разъяснения положений принятых нормативно-правовых актов, ФМС России 7 августа 2014 г. была проведена пресс-конференция.

Основным спикером на пресс-конференции была

Казакова Валентина Львовна

Начальник Управления по вопросам гражданства ФМС России, полковник внутренней службы

Видеозапись пресс-конференции на ютубе

youtu.be/BHv0oCG5uLM

Видеозапись пресс-конференции на сайте информационного агентства

www.pressria.ru/pressclub/20140807/949447250.html

Это к настоящему моменту все источники, из которых мы можем сделать какие-то выводы.

Кроме того, разработаны бланки уведомлений.

Бланки в PDF, образцы заполнения бланков, файл Excel для заполнения на компьютере доступны по ссылке:

cloud.mail.ru/public/e3109cbe9b3e/Uvedomleniya_FMS_Prikaz450.zip

или

drive.google.com/file/d/0B1jjl9UC3sYkeUFHbFFyaTRyUHM/edit?usp=sharing

Чтобы не отвечать на типовые вопросы, резюмируем то что уже известно.

1) Вопросы процедуры уведомления:

1.1) Уведомление можно подать только с территории России. Подать уведомление через интернет нельзя. Подать уведомление через консульство нельзя. Подать уведомление заказным письмом из Германии, а равно как и из любой другой страны, нельзя.

1.2) В России уведомление подается либо в отделение УФМС по месту жительства (при отсутствии места жительства по месту пребывания, при отсутствии мест пребывания и жительства по месту фактического нахождения) либо через любое отделение Почты России.

1.3) В ФМС подача уведомления бесплатна. Через Почту России - стоит небольших денег (за почтовое отправление).

1.4) Уведомление подается лично, с предъявлением паспорта. Подать уведомление за совершеннолетнего взрослого нельзя.

1.5) За несовершеннолетних и недееспособных уведомление подает родитель (законный представитель).

1.6) Разработано два вида бланка уведомления. Для взрослых свой бланк, для детей и недееспособных свой. Бланки уведомлений доступны здесь:

cloud.mail.ru/public/e3109cbe9b3e/Uvedomleniya_FMS_Prikaz450.zip

или здесь:

drive.google.com/file/d/0B1jjl9UC3sYkeUFHbFFyaTRyUHM/edit?usp=sharing

1.7) После подачи уведомления от сотрудника ФМС или Почты России необходимо получить заполненную отрывную часть уведомления с подписью и печатью ФМС или почтовым штампом. Этот документ будет являться доказательством подачи вами уведомления.

1.8) Уведомление о уже имеющихся ВНЖ и гражданстве должно быть подано до 02.10.2014 года включительно.

1.9) Уведомление о приобретенном гражданстве или полученном ВНЖ либо документе на право постоянного проживания должно быть подано в течение 60 дней со дня получения гражданства или такого документа.

1.10) Из разъяснений Казаковой В.А., начальника Управления по вопросам гражданства ФМС России, данных ею на пресс-конференции, следует, что лица, пропустившие срок уведомления вследствие нахождения за пределами РФ, обязаны уведомить ФМС в течение 60 дней после первого въезда в РФ, при этом они освобождаются от ответственности, поскольку не имели физической возможности уведомить ранее. Стоит отметить что эти слова не подтверждены каким-либо документом.

1.11) К уведомлению прикладываются копии документа удостоверяющего личность (паспорта), документа, удостоверяющего право постоянного проживания/гражданства (при наличии), документа, подтверждающего родство/опеку с несовершеннолетним/недееспособным (в случае подачи уведомления за несовершеннолетнего/недееспособного)

Подаются простые копии. Ничего переводить/заверять/апостилировать не нужно.

2)Вопросы о том, кому необходимо подавать уведомления

2.1)Кто такой "Гражданин Российской Федерации, постоянно проживающий за пределами Российской Федерации"?

В настоящий момент точного законодательного определения критериев нет. У чиновников единого мнения на этот счет так же нет.

Из разъяснений Казаковой В.А., начальника Управления по вопросам гражданства ФМС России, данных ею на пресс-конференции, следует что освобождаются от обязательства уведомить о наличии иного гражданства или ВНЖ лица, снявшиеся с регистрационного учета по месту жительства в России. Те кто зарегистрированы в России, обязаны подать уведомление в течение 60 дней с момента первого въезда после вступления закона в силу.

Если гражданин зарегистрирован по месту жительства в России, но считает себя постоянно проживающим за границей, он должен быть готов доказать органам ФМС или следствию что постоянно проживает за границей.

Стоит отметить что эти слова не подтверждены каким-либо документом.

2.2)Что такое "действительный документ, подтверждающий право на постоянное проживание в иностранном государстве"?

В настоящий момент точного законодательного определения критериев такого документа нет.

Из разъяснений Казаковой В.А., начальника Управления по вопросам гражданства ФМС России, данных ею на пресс-конференции, следует что ФМС РФ не уполномочена определять какие из иностранных документов подтверждают право не постоянное проживание в иностранном государстве. Гражданин, обладающий таким документом, должен сам определить дает ли документ право постоянного проживания исходя из законодательства страны, выдавшей документ. При этом ответственность за правильность определения лежит на гражданине.

Что касается Германии и других стран шенгена, думаю, разумнее всего будет считать документами на право постоянного проживания все виды ВНЖ/ПМЖ, в том числе и ограниченные по сроку (NE,AE,AT,BC,DA-EU и другие). Не подпадают под обязательство уведомления, соответственно, обладатели всех видов виз.

3) Вопросы ответственности за неподачу уведомления.

3.1) Предусмотрена административная и уголовная ответственность.

3.2) Административная ответственность по ст.19.8.3 КоАП РФ предусмотрена за несвоевременную подачу уведомления либо за подачу неполных или недостоверных сведений и карается штрафом от 500 до 1000 рублей.

3.3) Уголовная ответственность по ст. 330.2 УК РФ предусмотрена за неисполнение обязанности по подаче уведомления и предусматривает ответственность в виде штрафа до 200 000 рублей либо обязательными работами до 400 часов.

3.4) Уголовная статья по подследственности отнесена к СК РФ.

3.5) Протоколы по административной статье имеют право составлять сотрудники ФМС и участковые полицейские.

3.6) Разница между "несвоевременной подачей уведомления" и "неисполнением обязательства по подаче уведомления" определяется в моменте обнаружения факта неподачи уведомления. Если выяснилось что уведомление не было ранее подано в момент подачи уведомления - то это "несвоевременная подача" и действует административная ответственность. Если выяснилось что уведомление не подано и не подается в настоящий момент, то это уголовная ответственность. Иными словами, если вы сами пришли и сдались, то административная ответственность, если вас поймали, то уголовная ответственность.

[Mike&Lena 3]

Why are they doing this? Who knows... maybe they are planning on "protecting" Russian speakers in other countries (they've been doing a lot of that in different places lately). Maybe they will create some more "interesting" laws in future, related to taxation of people, who have another citizenship or a resident card, or related to our property in Russia. Whatever this is, I don't expect any positive changes.

However, I have some information that might help your wife. It's all in Russian, and I don't feel like translating, but you can have her read this:

Wow, thank you for all you've shared. This confirmed the fact that this form is not in force until Aug 17th, so that explains a lot. Just crazy how they can say it is effective Aug. 4th, and the 60 days to register begins from that date...even if the form isn't in force...till the 17th...a loss of 2 weeks shot. I certainly will pass all this on to her....Thanks soooooooooooooo much:))))))))

[b_fowler 0]

It seems that the murky waters of Russian law is certainly just that - Murky!! I just wanted to help out, because I know how much of an issue it can be to comply with the Russian government - you need this doc, you need that doc, you have to go here, you have to go there - Sharing what we have helps clear the path and makes it easier to combine information so that we all can navigate these changes together and more do it more efficiently. Glad to see all the replies and hope we can make it easier for all others to come.

- edited for grammar error

Edited August 13, 2014 by b_fowler

[b_fowler 0]

From all that I have read, you cannot do this at the consulate in the US. It must be done in the regional offices there in Russia, in person, however they do allow you to mail this in to them...but then...they do not send you any confirmation of receiving it, so you can still easily be listed as a "criminal"...especially if it gets lost in the mail. I am now told, that the immigration offices there have these forms....BUT...get this.... they do not have a law that tells them they can give this form to the public yet, so my wife is now told to come back on the 17th...which is a Sunday...haha..they are closed, so she will try again on the 18th. Even if you went down with a printed out form, they will not take it, so you cannot submit it yet. My wife asks...maybe they need a law to use the toilet:)))) She is very very upset with this whole mess, and frankly I don't see how she can endure anymore BS from the government. My question is, why are the really doing this in the first place?????

We called the consulate here in the U.S. and the said, "This is NOT our cup of tea!!!" and then followed on with, "you will have to call the immigration office in the region or city your wife is from."

So that seems to be correct.

[Spoon 7]

I just found this article that implies that you need to declare when you visit and that people living abroad do not have to meet the Oct deadline. I am still looking to confirm this is the canse.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/deadline-set-for-disclosing-dual-citizenship/504769.html

Edit: Of course if you are registered there, they may count you as living there as many of you have pointed out.

Edited August 19, 2014 by Spoon

[Amelie123 2]

Dear all,

I have a question about Russian Immigration Law.

I got my green card in February 2015 and I want to go to Moscow to see my parents, and according to the new law, I have to report my perm. residency to the immigration department there.

The problem is that the name on my green card is my married name and it doesn't match the name on my passport (my passport has my maiden name).

Has anybody here had the same situation? Did it pose any problems? How long did it take?

Please, share your experience!

Thanks a lot!!!

[workin4somethin 0]

Dear all,

I have a question about Russian Immigration Law.

I got my green card in February 2015 and I want to go to Moscow to see my parents, and according to the new law, I have to report my perm. residency to the immigration department there.

The problem is that the name on my green card is my married name and it doesn't match the name on my passport (my passport has my maiden name).

Has anybody here had the same situation? Did it pose any problems? How long did it take?

Please, share your experience!

Thanks a lot!!!

I noticed your post had no response yet....There have been a number of other threads in this forum on this very topic - "changing your name." If I remember correctly, there are at least a couple of issues (problems) for those who do in fact change their name. If you do not get a response soon in this particular thread, you may want to start a new thread stating your concern. Sorry I do not recall more on this topic, but there are others active in this forum who can help you. Another option would be for you to scroll down through the thread titles in hope of finding a something on topic. Good luck to you!

Oops! I just read where you found the answer on another thread. I suppose all is good. Please excuse me.

Edited July 20, 2015 by workin4somethin

[Amelie123 2]

I noticed your post had no response yet....There have been a number of other threads in this forum on this very topic - "changing your name." If I remember correctly, there are at least a couple of issues (problems) for those who do in fact change their name. If you do not get a response soon in this particular thread, you may want to start a new thread stating your concern. Sorry I do not recall more on this topic, but there are others active in this forum who can help you. Another option would be for you to scroll down through the thread titles in hope of finding a something on topic. Good luck to you!

Oops! I just read where you found the answer on another thread. I suppose all is good. Please excuse me.

Thanks a lot for your response!

I did indeed get a response in one of the threads, which calmed me down a lot

But I wouldn't mind hearing the same thing from somebody else - it is always reassuring to me when several people, who are in the same situation as I am, say the same thing.

Maybe I am overthinking though, but in legal topics - I would rather overthink than..."under"think -

Anyway, thanks again!!