2 co-sponsors (I-864A's) Married Filing Jointly...

[KayDeeCee 4,893]

If both of his parents live in the same household, there is no need to submit an entire separate AOS for the the parents. The instructions clearly say that you are allowed to combine your income with a qualifying household member.

It's better that he combines his income with them than if they filed a separate I-864. I also didn't say they MUST file an I-864A, I only meant that it would be better.

That would give you a greater total income in order to meet the requirements. Therefore, it is not necessary for his parents to be separate joint sponsors when they can just combine their income with their son.

You said, "If you live with your parents, then they would both need an I-864A." That is the same thing as saying they must. They do not both need or must, nor would it be better for them both to use an I-864A.

More income pooling together and a larger household count as well. If neither one claims the other as a dependent, then they are separate households, and that is why it works out better to file as a joint sponsor, but I already explained this above. I have seen it work out well for many people over the years, and I will continue to advise people to keep the household counts separate and easier to deal with. Your reasoning that it is better to not have someone that is basically head of their own household size file as a household member instead of a joint sponsor is what? Because the instructions mention the use of a household member's income?

You are acting as if filing as a joint sponsor will entail so much more effort or something. It does not, but it keeps the household counts accurate and easy to manage. It also takes away the need to provide proof of their relationship and shared residence.

OP> I advise your father to fill out an I-864 as the joint sponsor and have the mom fill out an I-864A to go along with his I-864 since they file taxes jointly. They will combine their incomes and list them together on the father's I-864, but they need to know their individual incomes to list as their current income on their individual forms. They must have pension benefits documents, 1099s for them, something that shows how much each received. How did they list and prove their income when they filed the taxes? If they have no other dependents, then their household size will just be 3, themselves plus your wife. If the have other dependents, then add them accordingly on the father's I-864. If you and your wife have no other dependents then your household size will just be the two of you on your I-864.

[Ian H. 207]

They do not need to be dependent on each other in order to be able to file an I-864A. Also as for the increased household size, since they are all combining their income it would be a 4 person household. That's why since each case is different one would have to do the math.

Also the proof of relation can be easily proved with a copy of his birth certificate, and the proof of shared residence would be the taxes, w2s, paystubs that they would be submitting anyway since it's obvious that those forms would all have the same address.

To the OP:

Is the income requirement higher with the parents for a household of 4 if you combine your income with theirs, or is it higher with the parents submitting a separate AOS for a household of 3 with their income only? Whichever method gives a higher total income based on the household size, is the one I would use.

[ibhitchin 1]

Sorry for the absence, my day got hijacked by an overly excited wife armed with a home pregnancy test!

I thank you both for your impassioned advice, and as I understand it, both have the same requirement of figuring the split on their (the parents) income. I can take either path, because the relationship and living arrangements allow for filing 864a's or since there are almost no restrictions on WHO can file an 864 (after getting past the citizenship/LPR requirements) I can file two 864's and one 864a. The main difference being the effect on household size (3 vs 4), and resulting effect on the 125% amount, neither povery line is a concern when I addin or consider, my parents income - they are well above for either household size.

As far as figuring the split, I think what my parents do is take each check stub, from every month, and for each foreign pension, figure out the conversion rate (since the checks are in foreign denominations) and add it all up. Since you don't need to send evidence of claimed income to the irs, they don't care so long as what you claim is at least what you are liable for, there is no 1099 or other tax record from the pension authority. The FBI and the DOJ might definitly care about unsubstantiated income due to money laundering concerns, but that is a separate animal from what we are talking about.

Since the NVC will be open for questions again in about 2 hours, and I have already missed the Post office for the day, I am going to try calling them again, and hopefully my phone will hold out for the entire call! I will post what they say afterward.

Thanks again.

Edited August 5, 2014 by ibhitchin

[ibhitchin 1]

OK, here is the straight poop, right from the horses....

I am to file the 864, which we already knew., filled out as follows:

• Part 5 Question 7 (same household sponsors) is 2 (parents).
• Part 5 Question 8 (total of household) is 4 (2 parents and my wife and I from ).
• Part 6 Question 6a,b,c name, Mother, income estimate as shown on her 864A Question 10.
• Part 6 Question 7a,b,c Name, Father, income estimate as shown on his 864A Question 10.
• Part 6 Question 10, total of part 6 Q' 5,6c, and 7c.

My parents each file an 864A filled out as follows:

• 864A Question 10, an ESTIMATE of each individuals expected income this year. Will be different for each person (probably), is an estimate, no lengthy splitting of income required, does not need to match any number on the Tax Transcript. And since exchange rates and COLA's are not too predictable, a good faith best guess is acceptable.
• 864A Question 11, each of the last 3 years TOTAL house hold income from the tax transcripts. Will be same same for Mother and Father.
• Both parents will use the same figures from the same Tax Transcripts.

Simple right.

OK, that is from the NVC helpline. I will follow up with what way I file, and what the result is... when and if I know a result!

Thank you all again for the help.

[NikLR 13,227]

Keep in mind that you could call several times and get diff answers. Also NVC doesn't approve or deny the AOS, just accepts it and checks for completeness. The consular officer is the eventual decision maker.

Best of luck.

[ibhitchin 1]

Keep in mind that you could call several times and get diff answers. Also NVC doesn't approve or deny the AOS, just accepts it and checks for completeness. The consular officer is the eventual decision maker.

Best of luck.

Yep, in fact my second post on this thread was about my call from last night where the NVC rep said I would only need one 864A... which left many un-answered questions!

This has the feel of being right, as does the joint sponsor route you suggested, but this has the advantange of fewer fields to fill in and therefore fewer chances to be wrong.

Once this gets past the NVC, I will be much more confident, because I am sure I can show that the numbers are correct and sufficient. My lack of confidence is born of there being no clear "right" way to format things, and what forms to use, where to put individual numbers ect. Especially after a very close reading of the instructions has pointed up an inconsistency between the instructions and the directions on the form itself. If you are curious, it regards the individual income section and totaling the figures. The form says My current income goes in line 5, my first co-sponsor is in 6c, and 2nd in 7c, and so on, then total line 5, 6c, and 7c (and the others for the rest of your co-sponsors). The Instructions say to copy the figure in line 5 to line 6c, then add lines 6c,7c, 8c... like that.

Now that I have written it out like that, I think that is another question for the NVC help line!!