Israel-Gaza conflict: What has Israel achieved in 26 bloody days?

[OriZ 3,157]

It is also important to remember that while some of the attacks by Jews, which were normally a retaliation, were infact aimed at civilians, most of them were not. Moreover, in most of them(although not all of them) a warning was given, much in the same way that the IRA gave warnings a couple of decades ago, but were unfortunately ignored in most cases, such as the King David Hotel bombing. And like I said, the rest of the info can be found in older pages...but those points were important for me to make again, due to some really ignorant claims.

Beat you to it.

Again: Israel the nation was built on terrorism. Supporting Israel is supporting terrorists.

I don't care what your grandmother was born as, someone who doesn't believe Jews should have the right to live peacefully in their own country where they can't be persecuted cause their security is not in the hands of other people(such as in, say, Germany), but rather their own, but you don't want them to have it, which makes you nothing but a Jew hater. You can cover it with words, say you are only against Israel's policies, but the bottom line is that what it comes down to it.

Ahhhh. We finally see who you really are. I love it.

Edited August 15, 2014 by OriZ

[decocker 7,198]

jew-hater? and here i thought there was no name calling on vj.

[Expat1 971]

lol lets repeat things that were already discussed here in detail at the end of 2012...you are a waste of my time. I'm not going to waste my time on things I've already responded to in length before but if anyone wants to read it and actually see the context in which everything happened and not your one-sided twisted BS they can sure find it around Nov-Dec 2012 in many posts.

This is all I'll post for now about it:

and I also have something else better than you. I have first hand stories from my own blood, my grandmother, who came with her family from Russia in the late 20's. In Russia they were wealthy, they had everything, but the Russians told them they needed to leave, without taking anything. So they went to Palestine, and lived in a tent, and what little bit they had, got stolen by the Arabs at times. Her mom died in her 40's when she wasn't even able to recognize her own daughter anymore due to the trauma she had suffered in life. During the civil war, the Arabs turned against the Jews, even the ones you thought were your friends, even the kids she used to play with as a kid, would now throw rocks at her every time she left the house.

And here's some more about Deir Yassin

Like I said the rest will have to be searched cause I have no time for BS.

I have LOTS of time and have gotten sick of playing around in here.

As to your story I'm sobbing. Really. MY grandmother was a German Jew. Name was

They arrived in America around 1918 or 1919 with nothing.

Did fine. Wanna know how much of the German national wealth was held by a small (1%) of the population? Look that up. Seems (retrospect) that when a small group of people wall off and accumulate the vast majority of national wealth it REALLY REALLY ticks the rest of the people off.

Good lesson for America today.

I don't actually feel that their previous plight gives me rights to a single square inch of stolen land in Gaza, in a tent, house, or blanket on the ground. Sorry.

Seek sympathy for terrorists elsewhere. None here.

Edited August 15, 2014 by Expat1

[Expat1 971]

which makes you nothing but a Jew hater.

Next group of terrorists who wall other people up, limit their food, water, medical supplies, and energy, blockade their ports and ALSO shoot them like fish in a barrel and ALSO run over people from my country with bulldozers and ALSO murder unarmed people from my country who are trying to deliver humanitarian supplies will get the same treatment

Edited August 15, 2014 by Expat1

[Expat1 971]

jew-hater? and here i thought there was no name calling on vj.

I don't much like ISIS either and they're only a couple hundred miles away

[decocker 7,198]

On August 10, an anti-war demonstration led by mainstream left-wing political parties Meretz and Hadash, and the Peace Now NGO was cancelled by Israeli Home Front Command on the grounds that it presented a public danger due to rocket fire. Many were skeptical of this rationale because no other public events, some of which drew larger crowds, had been called off.

None of the three groups protested the cancellation, drawing criticism from other anti-war leftists. "There is a sense that the mainstream left isn't taking the danger seriously and they are trusting the police too much," said Sappir.

Samar Asakli, 22, a Palestinian activist and student at Haifa University, described what he perceives as white supremacy in the mainstream left: "The Israeli mainstream left doesn't think Palestinians have a right to resist against the siege [on Gaza]. They tell us what we have to do because they are the intelligent people and we are primitive."

With another ceasefire ending, neither Israel nor Hamas appear to be willing to end the conflict. The trends that anti-war activists describe will likely worsen until long-term solutions are found. In Israel's increasingly right-wing society, the marginalized anti-war left struggles to survive.

https://news.vice.com/article/israels-anti-war-activists-feel-increasingly-threatened?utm_source=vicenewsfb

[Expat1 971]

Beat you to it.

I don't care what your grandmother was born as, someone who doesn't believe Jews should have the right to live peacefully in their own country where they can't be persecuted cause their security is not in the hands of other people(such as in, say, Germany), but rather their own, but you don't want them to have it, which makes you nothing but a Jew hater. You can cover it with words, say you are only against Israel's policies, but the bottom line is that what it comes down to it.

Ahhhh. We finally see who you really are. I love it.

I believe that the people of Gaza have the right to live peacefully in their own country where they can't be persecuted because their security is not in the hands of others (such as, say, the Israelis).

As to Israel, they have a country with internationally recognized borders but the conflict under discussion in this thread is not in nor has nothing to do with these borders, it is outside the borders, so we finally see who you really are. An elitist, master-race type who believes in one set of values for himself and another set of values for his neighbors. I actually don't love it - it's like watching someone who has pi$$ed his pants but doesn't realize it.

You're just ticked off and name-calling because it is slowly being demonstrated that the people in Gaza are doing EXACTLY what the Israelis did when they formed their own country. So either what Israel did was right and the ends justified the means OR what Israel did was wrong so which is it? Attacking villages and hotels to free themselves and form their own nation was right because they deserved their own country? If so, then what they are doing in Gaza is also right and for the exact same reasons.

Yours to decide. If winning your freedom by any means necessary is a good thing then apply it to both sides.

[OriZ 3,157]

You were the one who said that Israel was created by terrorism, and so supporting Israel is supporting terrorism. You didn't talk about internationally recognized borders, you talked about all of Israel. So, you do not acknowledge Israel's right to exist and you do not acknowledge the Jewish people's right to their homeland.

I'm not ticked off, I'm actually pretty amused by it, I'm just calling it the way it is - and exposing the fraud. The Jews in Palestine alot of times gave warnings - the Palestinians try to kill as many people as possible - huge difference. And there are many other differences, but like I said, we've already had that conversation.

Here's some more on the King David Hotel Bombing:

The hotel was the site of the central offices of the British Mandatory authorities of Palestine, principally the Secretariat of the Government of Palestine and the Headquarters of the British Forces in Palestine and Transjordan. The attack initially had the approval of the Haganah (the principal Jewish paramilitary group in Palestine). It was conceived as a response to Operation Agatha (a series of widespread raids, including one on the Jewish Agency, conducted by the British authorities in the British Mandate of Palestine) and was the deadliest directed at the British during the Mandate era (1920–1948). The explosion caused more casualties than any subsequent bombing carried out in the Arab-Israeli conflict.

The Irgun planted a bomb in the basement of the main building of the hotel, whose southern wing housed the Mandate Secretariat and a few offices of the British militaryheadquarters. Warnings were sent by telephone, including one to the hotel's own switchboard, which the hotel staff decided to ignore, but none directly to the British authorities. A possible reason why the warning was ignored was that hoax bomb warnings were rife at the time. From the fact that a bomb search had already been carried out, it appears that a hoax call or tip-off had been received at the hotel earlier that day.Subsequent telephone calls from a concerned Palestine Post staff member and the police caused increasing alarm, and the hotel manager was notified. In the closing minutes before the explosion, he called an unknown British officer, but no evacuation was ordered. The ensuing explosion caused the collapse of the western half of the southern wing of the hotel. Some of the inflicted deaths and injuries occurred in the road outside the hotel and in adjacent buildings. Controversy has arisen over the timing and adequacy of the warnings and the reasons why the hotel was not evacuated.

In 1946, the Secretariat occupied most of the southern wing of the hotel, with the military headquarters occupying the top floor of the south wing and the top, second and third floors of the middle of the hotel.The military telephone exchange was situated in the basement. An annexe housed the military police and a branch of the Criminal Investigation Department of the Palestine Police.

Rooms had first been requisitioned in the hotel in late 1938, on what was supposed to be a temporary basis. Plans had already been made to erect a permanent building for the Secretariat and Army GHQ, but these were cancelled after the Second World War broke out, at which point more than two-thirds of the hotel's rooms were being used for government and army purposes.

In March 1946, British Labour Party MP Richard Crossman gave the following description of activity at the hotel: "private detectives, Zionist agents, Arab sheiks, special correspondents, and the rest, all sitting around about discreetly overhearing each other." Security analyst Bruce Hoffman has written that the hotel "housed the nerve centre of British rule in Palestine".

[CowBoE 429]

I'm not taking sides...we are all human beings before religion, country, and political and social conflicts.

All human beings need a place they can live safely and happily,

and whether its 1 or 1000, it's really sad to see this conflict rage on and on forever

and destroying innocent family lives.

And I won't get into chicken and egg issue as to who's the first to blame

or who's bigger to blame. In conflicts like this, so much facts are twisted

and so much propaganda is fabricated to rally the supporters.

For the sake of innocent people living in fear in all sides,

I just pray for a peaceful co-existence by all neighboring countries in the middle east.

(Your choice of) God bless them all.

[OriZ 3,157]

Back on topic

British Jews have responded furiously to criticism of Israel over the conflict in Gaza, calling it one-sided and pulling funding for a theatre that cancelled the UK Jewish Film Festival due to its sponsorship by the Israeli government.

Leading British Jewish businessman and philanthropist Sir Trevor Chinn is ending his "four-figure" funding for the Tricycle Theatre in Kilburn, London, after it refused to host the festival, the Jewish News reported. The report says that other Jewish donors have made the same decision.

“We are as a community under pressure from the boycott movement. We can’t accept boycotts and whenever one comes along we have to fight it," the report quoted Sir Trevor as saying.

Sir Trevor is a devout supporter of Israel and leading member of the British Jewish community. He is a president of the Joint Israel Appeal and Vice President of the Jewish Leadership Council, British Jewry's umbrella organization. He received his knighthood for his charity work.

According to the report, Sir Trevor met with the theatre's artistic director Indhu Rubasingham two weeks ago, after Tricycle announced its decision, and made it “absolutely clear” that the theatre would lose Jewish funding over the decision.

“The Tricycle is going to lose a lot of audience members and a lot of financial support,” Sir Trevor was quoted as saying. He also said that other “substantial supporters” had said that they would also cut their funding.

“It’s a tragedy because this is a theatre that needs and, in the ordinary course, deserves support,” he said.

Businesswoman and philanthropist Celia Atkin has also decided to end her sponsorship of the theatre, the report said.

British Culture Secretary Sajid Javid wrote to festival chair Stephen Margolis that the Tricycle Theatre's boycott was "misguided", the Jewish Chronicle reported.

According to the Chronicle, philanthropist Allan Morgenthau has resigned from the Tricycle's development committee and pulled the donations from the Diana and Allan Morgenthau Charitable Trust.

The report quoted Morgenthau as saying that, "I was totally and utterly surprised by what the Tricycle did. It's a terribly misplaced decision. I don't think there was malice intended but the Tricycle must be judged by its deed.

He said, however, that "If they change their mind, the Jewish community will forgive them. It's very, very sad."

Meanwhile, Jewish members of the British Association of Social Workers have responded furiously to a statement by the union condemning Israel for the Gaza conflict.

"The British Association of Social Workers joins with our IFSW colleagues in being appalled by Israel’s attacks on Gaza and its ongoing illegal occupation of Palestinian land," said the statement released last week.

"While we condemn all indiscriminate attacks on civilians, the scale of the actions of the Israeli government forces, especially the shelling of UNWRA schools and the killing of children while they sleep, in supposedly safe places, is grossly disproportionate. We are appalled by the many violations of human rights that are taking place in Gaza, leading to ever-rising numbers of deaths and serious injuries, particularly among the civilian population. We condemn Israel’s attacks on people’s homes, hospitals and even on children while they play on the beach.

"We call for an end to Israel’s aggression, a lifting of the blockade of Gaza and the end of Israel’s occupation of Palestinian territories."

The statement, which makes no mention of rocket fire on the Israeli civilian population by Gaza's terrorist groups, was accompanied by an image of destruction in Gaza.

“I’m horrified. The BASW has dishonored its own code of ethics,” London social worker Karin Ward told the Jewish News.

She called the union's statement “distressing, manipulative, inflammatory, one-sided and disturbing.” BASW should be held accountable, she said.

“I feel like I’m in hiding,” said Ward, whose teenage son is serving in the IDF. “It really is a careless misuse of power.”

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4559028,00.html

[Teddy B 17,252]

Oriz, I'm looking for a quick score. Can you help me out with a sure fire stock?

[OriZ 3,157]

Yeah, it's called STAY AWAY

[OriZ 3,157]

an interview with an Arab woman whose dying son was treated in an Israeli hospital for a serious heart condition. This excerpt comes from the documentary film “Precious Life.

The Jewish Israeli doctors saved her son’s life while Israelis came to visit her with gifts to make her stay easier.

Apparently, she still wants him to be a martyr.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrKFbsnvTw8

[OriZ 3,157]

ISIS militants have apparently struck Iraq's tiny Yazidi minority again, this time attacking the village of Kojo, killing 80 men and taking 100 women captive.

The village of Kojo is not available on Google Maps, but Kurdish news site Bas News says that it is about 12.5 miles south of Sinjar, where other Yazidis were held captive atop a mountain by ISIS militants.

The United States sent marines and special-forces troops to help plan an evacuation for the stranded Yazidis. However, it turned out that no more troops were necessary, and the Yazidis, aided by Kurdish peshmergaforces, were able to leave the mountain by foot. In light of the humanitarian crisis, President Barack Obama had also authorized air strikes on ISIS militants in Iraq, but targeting the group has proven difficult.

According to previous reports, Kojo residents had been given until Thursday to convert to Islam or face execution, in what is becoming a common ISIS ultimatum.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2014/08/isis-killed-80-yazidis-in-iraqi-village.html

This is heartbreaking, somebody tell them unfortunately the world is too preoccupied with Gaza...This is the reason and the answer.. it reminds us why the slogan "never again" remains more true than ever. Unfortunately for the millionth time the UN is failing to do its duty.

Edited August 16, 2014 by OriZ

[Expat1 971]

You were the one who said that Israel was created by terrorism, and so supporting Israel is supporting terrorism. You didn't talk about internationally recognized borders, you talked about all of Israel. So, you do not acknowledge Israel's right to exist and you do not acknowledge the Jewish people's right to their homeland.

I'm not ticked off, I'm actually pretty amused by it, I'm just calling it the way it is - and exposing the fraud. The Jews in Palestine alot of times gave warnings - the Palestinians try to kill as many people as possible - huge difference. And there are many other differences, but like I said, we've already had that conversation.

Here's some more on the King David Hotel Bombing:

Haven't actually said a word about "Israel's right to exist".

Already said Israel has internationally recognized borders but doesn't belong in the areas that the UN has declared occupied territories and has categorically ruled that Israel does not have rights to.

Already said that as long as Israel is there and as long as Israel occupies these areas and as long as Israel engages in human rights violations in these areas then the people who live there have a right to defend themselves from this occupation

Already said that killing civilians in these occupied areas and settled areas outside internationally recognized borders does NOT constitute, in any way, shape, or form "self-defense". It is terrorism with a goal of expanding borders.

As to your "further information" who cares? A hotel was bombed. I listed several other terrorist bombings as well. Car bomb at Damascus gate. Truck bomb Jaffa Town Hall. Semiramis Hotel bomb. Truck bomb Jaffa gate. Bomb at Ramia market. Bomb placed in Haifa garage. All in the spirit of declaring their independence and forming their new nation. All listed to point out that Israel originally formed their nation using terrorism with goal of expanding borders and all listed to point out a pattern that has never stopped. This pattern listed was to drive home the point that Israel is not and never has been interested in peace and always has engaged in expansion by systematically targeting civilians, which is terrorism with the goal of expanding borders.

I do acknowledge the borders set out for Israel. I do not acknowledge their right to either occupy, settle in, or expand beyond those borders and as long as Israel is using violence to hold even a single square inch of territory then Israel is not entitled to a cent of our support. I believe we should stop funding, arming, and supporting the terrorist pattern of targeting civilians for purposes of expansion until Israel (who has never, ever stopped expanding this way) lifts the blockades, recognizes that the Palestinians ALSO have a right to their own nation, and returns to their borders.

As to you personally - I categorically acknowledge your right to enjoy all the freedoms in your new location, including your right to personally defend yourself, your property, and your family and would never dream of denying you that right because of who you are or where you came from. I do not acknowledge your right to settle in the US, eyeball your neighbor's property, and start moving your fences over just because of who you are and where you came from and I do acknowledge the right of your neighbor to respond to such actions "with prejudice" as I acknowledge your right to do so if your neighbor does the same.

I hope that you pick up that principle, learn it, embrace it, and apply the concept of equal protection under the law not only to yourself but to everyone else.

I realize that you are not the sharpest crayon in the box but that is the summary of my position. Hope that lifts your fog of confusion.

Edited August 16, 2014 by Expat1