40 shot, 4 dead from gun violence in Chicago over weekend

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

I pointed out how SAF unfairly targets POC's that aren't criminals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_stop-and-frisk_program

New York police officer Adrian Schoolcraft made extensive recordings in 2008–2009 which documented orders from NYPD officials to search and arrest black people in the Bedford-Stuyvesant neighborhood. Schoolcraft, who brought accusations of misconduct to NYPD investigators, was transferred to a desk job and then involuntarily committed to a psychiatric hospital. In 2010, Schoolcraft sent his tapes to the Village Voice, which publicized them in a series of reports. Schoolcraft alleges that the NYPD has retaliated against him for exposing information about the stop and frisk policy.

In a city that's predominately black it would make sense that the criminals might lean towards that profile. The problem is, they're frisking everyone EXCEPT the criminals. Dudes in business suits with no criminal record in the morning and afternoon. But at night, where are they?

So let me understand. The NYPD are stopping nothing but dudes in business suits, with no criminal records. Now that is some serious finite profiling right there. PS. How do they know they have no criminal records

before they stop and frisk them.

As for the report. Nothing is as trustworthy as a crazy dude, published in the village voice. ROfl

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

answer the question marvin. who's doing the killing?

you'd have to ask the police your question. I have no idea where they are at any particular time, unless I see them there.

Criminals are doing the killing. Or, is black people and criminals the same thing?

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Criminals are doing the killing. Or, is black people and criminals the same thing?

some black people are criminals. John is black

Therefore

A. John is a criminal

B. John is not a criminal

C. John is black

D. we are all blatant racist and should have everything we own sized for even talking about it

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

So let me understand. The NYPD are stopping nothing but dudes in business suits, with no criminal records. Now that is some serious finite profiling right there. PS. How do they know they have no criminal records

before they stop and frisk them.

As for the report. Nothing is as trustworthy as a crazy dude, published in the village voice. ROfl

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/african-american-teen-says-stop-and-frisk-has

Blacks and Latinos made up to 80% of those “right people” who were stopped. In 2011, the number of stops of young black men actually exceeded the total number of young black men in New York City.

The judge’s opinion points out that between 2004 and June 2012, the NYPD conducted 4.4 million stops and 2.3 million frisks. Out of the 2.3 million, almost 99% of the frisks failed to yield a single weapon. Police contended the stops occurred because the individual was in a “high crime area” or had engaged in “furtive movements.”

If black people are doing so much crime, but are being stopped every day and every single one of them is frisked, why is there crime in NYC?

[SMOKE 1,426]

Criminals are doing the killing. Or, is black people and criminals the same thing?

sorry. you're not twisting what I said to fit your needs. you don't want to answer, that's fine. I didn't expect you to.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/african-american-teen-says-stop-and-frisk-has

Blacks and Latinos made up to 80% of those “right people” who were stopped. In 2011, the number of stops of young black men actually exceeded the total number of young black men in New York City.

The judge’s opinion points out that between 2004 and June 2012, the NYPD conducted 4.4 million stops and 2.3 million frisks. Out of the 2.3 million, almost 99% of the frisks failed to yield a single weapon. Police contended the stops occurred because the individual was in a “high crime area” or had engaged in “furtive movements.”

If black people are doing so much crime, but are being stopped every day and every single one of them is frisked, why is there crime in NYC?

Is this like the poster that said, asking illegals why they came here is totally different than asking them why they came here ?

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/african-american-teen-says-stop-and-frisk-has

Blacks and Latinos made up to 80% of those “right people” who were stopped. In 2011, the number of stops of young black men actually exceeded the total number of young black men in New York City.

The judge’s opinion points out that between 2004 and June 2012, the NYPD conducted 4.4 million stops and 2.3 million frisks. Out of the 2.3 million, almost 99% of the frisks failed to yield a single weapon. Police contended the stops occurred because the individual was in a “high crime area” or had engaged in “furtive movements.”

If black people are doing so much crime, but are being stopped every day and every single one of them is frisked, why is there crime in NYC?

Ps.. Just for the record. Any search with probable cause or a warrant is a violation of our 4th amnd rights, regardless of your color.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

sorry. you're not twisting what I said to fit your needs. you don't want to answer, that's fine. I didn't expect you to.

What were you expecting me to say? Black people are doing the killings so they should be frisked?

Is this like the poster that said, asking illegals why they came here is totally different than asking them why they came here ?

Ps.. Just for the record. Any search with probable cause or a warrant is a violation of our 4th amnd rights, regardless of your color.

Nope, just pointing out when you SAF a person solely based on the color of their skin, it's not productive.

It's a violation, but since it only applies to minorities, that's why it's been allowed to carry on as long as it did.

[SMOKE 1,426]

What were you expecting me to say? Black people are doing the killings so they should be frisked?

idk. you brought race into the discussion, so I asked. you still haven't answered. but, you keep implying my words mean something they don't. not that you'll answer this either...why are you doing that?

[lostinblue 1,989]

Based on reports filed by victims, blacks committed 66 percent of all violent crime in New York in 2009, including 80 percent of shootings and 71 percent of robberies. Blacks and Hispanics together accounted for 98 percent of reported gun assaults. And the vast majority of the victims of violent crime were also members of minority groups.

Non-Hispanic whites, on the other hand, committed 5 percent of the city’s violent crimes in 2009, 1.4 percent of all shootings and less than 5 percent of all robberies.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/26/opinion/26macdonald.html

Blacks and Latinos made up to 80% of those “right people” who were stopped .. in 2011

Any correlation there ?

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

idk. you brought race into the discussion, so I asked. you still haven't answered. but, you keep implying my words mean something they don't. not that you'll answer this either...why are you doing that?

The majority of victims were black. The criminals were between black and hispanic males. My whole point was and still is, that you go after the criminals, not the color of that person's skin.

I brought it up because SAF doesn't work when you only target a person's skin color, rather than their activities.

Based on reports filed by victims, blacks committed 66 percent of all violent crime in New York in 2009, including 80 percent of shootings and 71 percent of robberies. Blacks and Hispanics together accounted for 98 percent of reported gun assaults. And the vast majority of the victims of violent crime were also members of minority groups.

Non-Hispanic whites, on the other hand, committed 5 percent of the city’s violent crimes in 2009, 1.4 percent of all shootings and less than 5 percent of all robberies.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/26/opinion/26macdonald.html

Blacks and Latinos made up to 80% of those “right people” who were stopped .. in 2011

Any correlation there ?

So, because I'm black, I make up the right people?

[Sousuke 1,214]

The majority of victims were black. The criminals were between black and hispanic males. My whole point was and still is, that you go after the criminals, not the color of that person's skin.

I brought it up because SAF doesn't work when you only target a person's skin color, rather than their activities.

So, because I'm black, I make up the right people?

Racial profiling is unconstitutional, period. SAF is clearly racial profiling and goes beyond the current Terry Stop.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Sousuke

[SMOKE 1,426]

The majority of victims were black. The criminals were between black and hispanic males. My whole point was and still is, that you go after the criminals, not the color of that person's skin.

I brought it up because SAF doesn't work when you only target a person's skin color, rather than their activities.

ok. thank you. now I have another question if you don't mind.

which makes more sense?

1. SAF in high crime areas (knowing police bias will effect innocent people's lives)

or

2. enact more gun laws (knowing people wanting to commit crimes with firearms will not obey them and effect innocent peoples lives), while doing nothing in the high crime areas to curb the violence.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

ok. thank you. now I have another question if you don't mind.

which makes more sense?

1. SAF in high crime areas (knowing police bias will effect innocent people's lives)

or

2. enact more gun laws (knowing people wanting to commit crimes with firearms will not obey them and effect innocent peoples lives), while doing nothing in the high crime areas to curb the violence.

A combination of both.

SAF in places that have high crime might help. If I can spot some dude on the corner selling drugs 50 feet away, there's no reason cops can't do this. In high crime areas, there's no police presence. In areas that have no crime, there's ATF's and armored tanks. Makes sense how? NYC had all those SAF stops and 99% of them yielded no results. Cops need to be trained to handle minorities with the same care as a non minority.

If you ever listen to folks in bad neighborhoods, they never want more guns. They want the killings to stop. They want more police and stricter sentencing laws for repeat offenders. They want the gang members off the street.

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

You can take it as a zero, most people know that's not true.

Only idiots think that it's not true. Lawful gun owners rarely part with them, in my experience, except maybe to trade up. I still have every gun I have purchased except one, and it was a gift to a family member.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

What compares to a tool whose sole purpose is to kill? Only another tool whose sole purpose is to kill.

Spooks you seem stuck on comparing non-compatible objects to firearms, it really doesn't make sense.

Ah, another game of apple meet orange.

What a coincidence, that's the way I view both of your viewpoints on blaming law abiding legal gun owners for the actions of criminals. Strangely, I feel that most adults are responsible for their own actions. You two sound like Republicans blaming everything on the Democrats.