Miami, the great world city, is drowning while the powers that be look away

[Peikko 1,575]

All these budding scientists on VJ. Exciting.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

So you are implying the severe multi year long drought was caused by man?

The drought, no. That the soil blew away in huge dust storms, yes.

You can find plenty of information out there that the environmental damage was caused by intensive farming methods. It's very well documented.

No. He stated it, did not imply it. Having less long-rooted grasses would have had zero impact if the rains had come as normal, but don't think for a second you will be able to rationalize that with him.

I wonder what ocean levels were back in the 30's? Hmmmmm...

I stated it because I have studied it.

[Neonred 3,664]

..... implement whatever measures are necessary to minimise the negative Impacts.....

So I guess that is your answer to the problem. LOL

Great idea!

[lostinblue 1,989]

So I guess that is your answer to the problem. LOL

Great idea!

Czech President Vaclav Klaus........

“As someone who lived under communism for most of my life I feel obliged to say that the biggest threat to freedom, democracy, the market economy and prosperity at the beginning of the 21st century is not communism or its various softer variants,” said Klaus, responding to questions posed by the two lawmakers. “Communism was replaced by the threat of ambitious environmentalism.”

He added, “The so-called climate change and especially man-made climate change has become one of the most dangerous arguments aimed at distorting human efforts and public policies in the whole world.”

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2007/03/40698/#0IOmavvUSr5yHCyx.99

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

So now communism and environmentalism are equivalent concepts? FFS

The premise of the argument in this thread was provided by the insurance industry - about far from communism as its possible to be.

Edited July 15, 2014 by Hail Ming!

[mota bhai 2,675]

The insurance industry took taxpayer money (just like the so-called 'scientific community' has for centuries) to cover their own back sides. The day they did that is the day they sold their soul to the Left wing Obamunists and embraced the hoax of global warming.

Trust no one who takes gubmint money.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

So now communism and environmentalism are equivalent concepts? FFS

The premise of the argument in this thread was provided by the insurance industry - about far from communism as its possible to be.

Sure, if you study the World Nut Daily hard enough, that's what it'll come to.

[rlogan 2,036]

All these budding scientists on VJ. Exciting.

lol. You are the one parading around as if you had superior knowledge, and like just about every climate change groupie you don't have anything beyond hysterics and the vague handwaving about "doing something" to minimize the negative impacts.

That's the whole point: while you think your hysteria makes you more informed it actually proves the opposite - that you don't really have the capacity to reason through or even acknowledge mankind's thousand-generation experience in dealing with climate change or the multitude of other changes that caused him to make massive adjustments in location or way of life.

A key deception employed by people pushing various self-interested agendas in climate change is to try invoking the kind of alarm that an impending Hurricane causes. If you don't hear people shrieking about climate change and packing up moving vans to flee up into the mountains then they're labeled with various pejorative terms like "climate change deniers". When the truth is that there is no emergency. It isn't a tidal wave coming and in the course of history this is laughably small potatos. The Black Death killed possibly 200 million people in a seven year period. Sea levels rising at even much faster rates than worst case scenario just aren't much to get alarmed about compared to the real catastrophes man has had to deal with.

[mota bhai 2,675]

[Peikko 1,575]

lol. You are the one parading around as if you had superior knowledge, and like just about every climate change groupie you don't have anything beyond hysterics and the vague handwaving about "doing something" to minimize the negative impacts.

That's the whole point: while you think your hysteria makes you more informed it actually proves the opposite - that you don't really have the capacity to reason through or even acknowledge mankind's thousand-generation experience in dealing with climate change or the multitude of other changes that caused him to make massive adjustments in location or way of life.

A key deception employed by people pushing various self-interested agendas in climate change is to try invoking the kind of alarm that an impending Hurricane causes. If you don't hear people shrieking about climate change and packing up moving vans to flee up into the mountains then they're labeled with various pejorative terms like "climate change deniers". When the truth is that there is no emergency. It isn't a tidal wave coming and in the course of history this is laughably small potatos. The Black Death killed possibly 200 million people in a seven year period. Sea levels rising at even much faster rates than worst case scenario just aren't much to get alarmed about compared to the real catastrophes man has had to deal with.

Parading around? Climate groupie? Hysterical? Invoke alarm? You found all that in the posts I made? Gosh golly, how fantastic. considering what I wrote and responded to, finding all that must takes special skills. Kudos to you!

Not sure what your point is apart from trying to suggest that whatever happens, humans should just shrug their shoulders, point to the skies and say, "well, that's the natural world for you nothing we can to do to stop nature" (or god if that's your particular fancy) which I have to say is pretty darned stupid. We know, we've been told by real scientists looking at the real sea in our real world that there is an issue and looking at the real life problems and trying to minimize impacts saves us both money and lives but, who would do that when it's more fun to poo poo those who suggest there are things that could and should be done?

So I guess that is your answer to the problem. LOL

Great idea!

You seem to mistake me for an environmental engineer. No idea why you would do that.

Edited July 15, 2014 by Peikko

[rlogan 2,036]

Parading around? Climate groupie? Hysterical? Invoke alarm? You found all that in the posts I made? Gosh golly, how fantastic. considering what I wrote and responded to, finding all that must takes special skills. Kudos to you!

Yes, absolutely - to claim Miami is drowning is quite literally hysteria. The claim that "powers that be" look away is completely false. For example, over a year ago an official task force was formed to make recommendations for inclusion in the Master Plan:

The Task Force was formed through Miami-Dade County Resolution R-599-13, adopted on July 2, 2013.

http://www.miamidade.gov/planning/boards-sea-level-rise.asp

That is hardly the first official act though, and your own article says they've spent $1.5 billion so far. Yet you state hysterically that they are looking away. Mr. Johnny-come-lately who knows NOTHING is claiming the people in charge of billions in remediation efforts should do something to remediate. Captain obvious to the rescue, years after people are already acting.

Not sure what your point is apart from trying to suggest that whatever happens, humans should just shrug their shoulders, point to the skies and say, "well, that's the natural world for you nothing we can to do to stop nature" (or god if that's your particular fancy) which I have to say is pretty darned stupid. We know, we've been told by real scientists looking at the real sea in our real world that there is an issue and looking at the real life problems and trying to minimize impacts saves us both money and lives but, who would do that when it's more fun to poo poo those who suggest there are things that could and should be done?

Perfect thanks. Because here I am proving you are completely wrong about the rational and quite significant efforts others are undertaking to mitigate, while you are screeching about non-existent phantoms in your mind that are saying to do nothing.

How hilarious you talk about the "real world" while you are in a fantasy world of "nothing being done". Task forces meeting regularly, BILLIONS being spent - and you saying nothing is being done. Media exists to profit on advertising and you have to use your brain when something is being sensationalized for the purpose of selling deodorant and soft drinks. I have floods on my own road to deal with, nothing to do with global warming but I know exactly how the whole six year road priority plan works here and there are my counterparts in counties/states all over the country that deal regularly with this sort of problem. You on the other hand have no idea how this kind of civil process works so you can't fathom how people deal with it.

So you frame people that are knowledgeable and doing something about their problems as do-nothings. Well, guess who it is amongst us that is the real do-nothing? That would be you.

[rlogan 2,036]

Perfect too, for the enormous straw man you are trying to manufacture. That's why you aren't actually writing anything of substance and pretending to say something of value with this stupid picture. It isn't a question of whether there is flooding Miami-Dade has to deal with.

It is a question of how stupid you have to be in believing they don't have flood plans, flood designation zones, flood mitigation, and preparation for higher flood levels in the future. You have to be so stupid that you can't even use google to check into their flood brochures like this:

http://www.miamidade.gov/publicworks/library/brochures/flood-zones.pdf

How stupid do you have to be ti believe that people in flood zones don't think about, plan for, and mitigate against flooding? How arrogantly stupid indeed to pretend someone who doesn't live there and knows nothing about it needs to tell them to "do something"?

[Neonred 3,664]

It is a question of how stupid you have to be in believing they don't have flood plans, flood designation zones, flood mitigation, and preparation for higher flood levels in the future. You have to be so stupid that you can't even use google to check into their flood brochures like this:

http://www.miamidade.gov/publicworks/library/brochures/flood-zones.pdf

How stupid do you have to be ti believe that people in flood zones don't think about, plan for, and mitigate against flooding? How arrogantly stupid indeed to pretend someone who doesn't live there and knows nothing about it needs to tell them to "do something"?

Exactly. The house I built in the Keys is a "stilt house" as are most of the houses. While the ground under my house is barely 3 feet above sea level, the floor of the living space is 13 1/2 feet above sea level. Because of that I get a reasonable rate for my flood insurance. Only once in the last 15 years have we had a storm surge, and that was 6 feet from hurricane Wilma. No damage.

[Peikko 1,575]

Yes, absolutely - to claim Miami is drowning is quite literally hysteria. The claim that "powers that be" look away is completely false. For example, over a year ago an official task force was formed to make recommendations for inclusion in the Master Plan:

http://www.miamidade.gov/planning/boards-sea-level-rise.asp

That is hardly the first official act though, and your own article says they've spent $1.5 billion so far. Yet you state hysterically that they are looking away. Mr. Johnny-come-lately who knows NOTHING is claiming the people in charge of billions in remediation efforts should do something to remediate. Captain obvious to the rescue, years after people are already acting.

Perfect thanks. Because here I am proving you are completely wrong about the rational and quite significant efforts others are undertaking to mitigate, while you are screeching about non-existent phantoms in your mind that are saying to do nothing.

How hilarious you talk about the "real world" while you are in a fantasy world of "nothing being done". Task forces meeting regularly, BILLIONS being spent - and you saying nothing is being done. Media exists to profit on advertising and you have to use your brain when something is being sensationalized for the purpose of selling deodorant and soft drinks. I have floods on my own road to deal with, nothing to do with global warming but I know exactly how the whole six year road priority plan works here and there are my counterparts in counties/states all over the country that deal regularly with this sort of problem. You on the other hand have no idea how this kind of civil process works so you can't fathom how people deal with it.

So you frame people that are knowledgeable and doing something about their problems as do-nothings. Well, guess who it is amongst us that is the real do-nothing? That would be you.

You really are a very excitable fellow. Perhaps you could calm down enough to separate my claims and those of the article I posted?

If you were to go back to the OP, you would see that I posted an article from an online newspaper and the article made the claim that South Miami is in an increasingly vulnerable position because of rising sea levels and it asserted that the powers that be in the area were unwilling to do anything about the issue because they were in denial about the reality of the sea rising and how this could adversely affect the populations of that area. Were you to go back and read what I said in relation to the posted article, you would see that I didn't endorse or underpin the claims in the article in any way at all. Perhaps you could look into that and see what I posted at the bottom of the article? Got it? Right, so, I am not in any 'world of claims' at all, I didn't make any claims I just asked a question and made a comment based on the article.

Now, you seem to have got yourself up in a dichotomy because you are on the one hand claiming that, "global warming is false and nothing needs to be done" and "sea levels are riging and the powers that be in Miami are in fact spending millions, no billions on doing something about it" (I don't see any evidence that backs up your claims either, but I'll let that slide) Which is your position? Are the seas rising and things need to be done, or are the seas not rising and nothing needs to be done?

Instead of getting all excited and insulting, take the time to respond to things I have said and not things that you think I ought to have said based on your own prejudice. Thanks

[rlogan 2,036]

What kind of person asks multiple questions of someone and then attacks them for answering? Hilarious that you are the one posting hysteria and then attacking someone who is not getting all bent out of shape by your histrionics for being "excitable". Lol.

You called them "mad" in your OP. You seem to call everyone crazy if they aren't acting as crazy as you.

What kind of person tells this lie right here, claiming I said this, and you put it in quotes:

"global warming is false and nothing needs to be done"

That was a lie. I said no such thing. In fact what I said is that mankind has been making quite dramatic adjustments to climate change for a thousand generations, with large population movements, etc.

It's one thing to be too challenged intellectually to look up how South Florida has been dealing with floods. But is entirely another to lie through your teeth about what other posters have said.

Edited July 16, 2014 by rlogan